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[Nonlethal Force]

Originally Posted by Najo

Well, the main issues are this:

1. Caster levels not stacking making spell caster spells weaker and weaker as the character levels.

2. Dipping into a class for 1 or 2 levels to create broken combos.

3. Different results coming from the order you take two different classes in. For example, going rogue 1/fighter1 verses fighter 1/rogue 1 is not the same character.

4. Saving throws being min/maxed by clever multiclassing so all of your base saves by level 20 are +12/12/12 or greater. Even using multiclassing to get +14 on some.

5. Overcomplicating characters with dabbling in lots of classes or taking 1 level in every class.

6. Class features not progressing properily to be useful at high level (i.e. turning undead)

These are some of the major issues with the current rules.

Najo, forgive me if I have brought this up with you before. If so, I apologize. But looking over this list I feel the desire to point you in the direction of my sig (and yes, please forgive the self-promotion). But if you want to avoid most if not all of these issues you should really look at a work I just put out through Dreamscarred Press. It is a point-buy character system (meaning you spend your earned XP to buy increases to your characters HD, BAB, Saves, class abilities, casting/psionic progressions, etc), and it honestly negates all the problems you listed. Let me explain a little more...

#1 - you buy the level of casting ability you want with XP you gain. So there is no assumed loss of level unless you as the player opt to spend your XP elsewhere. At which point, that is the player's perrogative.

#2 - With no classes anymore, any class ability can have prerequisites to avoid broken combos. Those class abilities that have broken combos can have their price adjusted if desired. But the point is that DMs are given the power to determine availability of things that can be broken. And don't get me wrong ... point-buy systems can be broken. ALL systems can be broken. But at least in a point-buy system the DM has multiple tools to aleviate broken combos in the for of XP pricing, prereqs, etc.

#3 - Eliminated completely. What you buy first you buy first. If you buy a d10 first and then a d6 you do it because that's what you wanted. If you buy the d6 and then the d10, you do it because you wanted it that way.

#4 - Save prices are predetermined, you buy access to however much you want. But if you want that +12/+12/+12 it will cost you. It can be done ... but it will require some serious sacrifice and present weaknesses that a DM can exploit.

#5 - Giving players the ability to design their own character actually streamlines characters. PLaers are no longer taking a class to get one or two abilities and also getting a few they didn't really care about. Now, they get what they want (and can follow a focus much more clearly). Plus, it really makes players much more happy with their characters since they feel much more empowered. There is much less whining about "not being able to get character idea X to feel right."

#6 - In a point buy system you buy access to the abilities you want. So let's say you want an aminal companion like a druid as well as the ability to rage like a barbarian. You could buy both class abilities as much as you would want ... even up to what a 20th level barbarian and druid would have. Of course, depending on the abilities purchased and the level to which they are purchased will imply a consequence on how much more/less can be bought using the rest f the XP.


Anyway, just a thought. For less than $10 I'd suggest checking it out. As a promotional I'll even throw in a link to an Excel Character Calculator so that you don't even have to do any of the math, and that's available for free: HERE {You do have to be registered and logged into the forums to see it, though. It should be in the 8th post on that page.} But it's a free download to anyone that wants it. It'll let you play with the system and see the pricing as a completely free gesture. But ... you won't be able to do a character completely because there are a few things like skills and class abilities and spell/manifesting pricings that need to be explained in the work. I'll trust that anyone appreciating the Excel sheet will buy the Complete Control work to go with it. Especially DMs won't be sorry they spent the money. Oh, and for the record thatthread I've linked to is my personal PbP I am running over on DSP's forums. If you want to post questions about COmplete COntrol (the point-buy work) please see the link in my sig about the FAQ thread. I'll be happy to answer questions about Complete Control there!

Anyway, forgive my intrusion. I just love what multiclassing should be able to do in 3.5 but was always frustrated by how ineffective the characters were under the rules. So I created a system that lets me multiclass the way I've always wanted. When I see a conversation about multi-classing in 3.5 I just want to share my work so that others who are seeking the same thing as me can benefit from my labor. So please, do check it out!