4e Fan Creations and House RulesWorking on variant powers? Statting up a PC race or your version of a monster? Creating or converting an adventure? Put it here!
Oh I should also mention that I have used heaps of your monsters in game from a motley collection of printout I have of yours Keterys.
Having used goblinoids a LOT, I have been looking for variety. I have used all yours, inc the whip-wielding leader and fire tossing skirmishers. Also added your hobgoblin dragonshama (or warcaster, dragoncaster, something like that). Its stats seemed way out (maybe an early version), but I love having other stats for creatures. I mean how many hobgoblin warcasters with the same force powers can the PCs fight before they (and I) get bored.
Hence I like the idea of a lot more options for standard ccreatures. The kobold one in Dragon was great. Gnoll one too - but they were most more powerful gnolls. I made up several 'varieties' of gnolls around the same level as the others (inc minions, which I am using more and more).
Still would love all your work in one updated PDF. C'mon publishers...actually in the publisher's board there are several looking for submissions.
Cheers, C
__________________ So sail away aboard our rig
The moon is full and so are we
We're...
Will do tomorrow - unless you need it for a game tonight, in which case I'll see about getting the file remotely and figuring that out.
I was playing around with Asmor's monster creator last week and doing some monster work and figuring out how I'd redo things - so I should be able to give a couple variants of the goblins too.
Doesn't get me any closer to a pdf, but I _think_ that means I should be able to start indexing and putting up htmls of the monsters in the not too far off future.
No rush. I'm running KotS, and my PCs aren't even to the Keep yet.
I'm looking for variant goblins/hobbos, along with making some adjustments to the mod (second level will be cultists, not hobbos).
Among other things, I am wanting to change goblins to have a Paizo-goblin feel. You have the war chanter, and the pyro is likely up my alley. I need to make a lurker that climbs on people's back and stabs them about the head, and a "fire-breather/spitter" controller.
Yep - my game for tomorrow got moved to today, so had to wait til I was done running.
Goblin Butcher
Level 3 Soldier
XP 150
Small natural humanoid Initiative +3 Senses Perception +2 HP 45; Bloodied 22 AC 20; Fortitude 16, Reflex 16, Will 16 Speed 5 m Goblin Cleaver (standard; at-will) * Weapon
+8 vs. AC; 1d8 + 2 damage.
M Off at the Knee (standard; recharge 5 6) * Weapon
+8 vs. AC; 1d8 + 2 damage and target is knocked prone and slowed (save ends) Goblin Tactics (immediate reaction, when an attack misses the goblin butcher; at-will)
Shift one square away from attacker. Combat Advantage
The goblin butcher deals an extrxa 1d6 damage on melee attacks against any target it has combat advantage against. Alignment Evil Languages Goblinoid Str 12 (+2) Dex 15 (+3) Wis 12 (+2) Con 13 (+2) Int 9 (+0) Cha 8 (+0)
Goblin Warchanter
Level 2 Controller (Leader)
XP 125
Small natural humanoid
Initiative +4 Senses Perception +7
Goblin Warchant Aura 10; All goblin allies in the aura gain a +2 bonus to attack rolls. HP 37; Bloodied 18 AC 15; Fortitude 12, Reflex 14, Will 12 Speed 6
m Dogslicer (standard; at-will) * Weapon
+6 vs. AC; 1d6 damage.
M Whip (standard; at-will) * Weapon
Reach 3; +6 vs. Reflex; 1d4 damage and target is knocked prone.
R Daze (standard; at-will) * Psychic
Range 10; +4 vs. Will; 1d6+1 psychic damage and target is dazed until end of warchanter's next turn.
Whip Crack (minor 1/round; at-will)
Goblin ally within 3 squares may make a basic melee attack.
Goblin Tactics (immediate reaction, when a melee attack against the goblin warchanter misses; at-will)
The goblin warchanter shifts one square away from the attacker.
Alignment Evil Languages Common, Goblinoid Skills Acrobatics +9, Stealth +9 Str 8 (+0) Dex 16 (+4) Wis 12 (+2) Con 13 (+2) Int 8 (+0) Cha 13 (+2)
Goblin Pyro
Level 1 Skirmisher XP 100
Small natural humanoid
Initiative +3 Senses Perception +0
HP 27; Bloodied 13 AC 15; Fortitude 12, Reflex 14, Will 12 Speed 6
m Dogslicer (standard; at-will) * Weapon
+5 vs. AC; 1d6 damage.
M Torch (standard; at-will) * Fire
+5 vs. Reflex; 1d4 fire damage and 2 ongoing fire damage (save ends).
R Pyromaniac (standard; encounter) * Fire
Range 5/10; +7 vs. Reflex; 1d8 fire damage and 5 ongoing fire damage (save ends). After making this attack, goblin pyro can no longer make Torch attacks. If the goblin pyro misses with this attack and does not roll a 1, make a secondary attack against a random goblin ally within range. Secondary Attack: +8 vs. Reflex; 1d4 fire damage and 2 ongoing fire damage (save ends).
Goblin Tactics (immediate reaction, when a melee attack against the goblin pyro misses; at-will)
The goblin pyro shifts one square away from the attacker.
Danger to Themselves
If a goblin pyro misses with any melee attack and there is an adjacent goblin minion, it kills the goblin minion. If the goblin pyro rolls a 1 on any attack roll, it hits itself.
Combat Advantage
The goblin pyro deals an extra 1d6 damage on melee and ranged attacks against any target it has combat advantage against.
Alignment Evil Languages Common, Goblinoid Skills Stealth +7, Thievery +7
Str 10 (+0) Dex 15 (+2) Wis 10 (+0) Con 11 (+0) Int 9 (-1) Cha 12 (+1)
Cultist Chainfighter Level 3 Skirmisher
XP 150 Medium natural humanoid
Initiative +8
Senses Perception +1 HP 45; Bloodied 22 AC 15; Fortitude 14, Reflex 15, Will 13 Speed 6
m Chainblades (standard; at-will) * Weapon Reach 2; +6 vs. AC; 1d8 + 2 damage.
M Pulling Strike(standard; recharge 4 5 6) * Weapon Reach 3; Shift 1 before or after attack. +6 vs. Reflex; 1d8 + 2 damage and target is pulled 1 square. M Capture Attack (immediate reaction, when a melee attack misses the chainfighter; at-will) Targets attacker. +6 vs. AC; 1d4 + 1 damage and target slides 1 square.
Alignment Evil
Languages Common
Skills Endurance +7 Str 12 (+2) Dex 15 (+3) Wis 10 (+1) Con 13 (+2) Int 9 (+0) Cha 11 (+1)
Hobgoblin Battlefist
Level 3 Brute (Leader)
XP 150
Medium natural humanoid Initiative +7 Senses Perception +3 Hobgoblin Standards Aura 10; Hobgoblin allies gain +1 to attack rolls and AC. HP 56; Bloodied 28 AC 16; Fortitude 16, Reflex 14, Will 16 Speed 6 m Mace (standard; at-will) * Weapon
+8 vs. AC; 1d8 + 3 damage. All hobgoblin allies deal +2 damage against target until end of hobgoblin battlefist's next turn.
M Grab and Smash (standard; recharge 5 6) * Weapon
+8 vs. Reflex; 1d6 + 3 damage and make secondary mace attack. Secondary: +10 vs. AC; 1d8 + 3 damage and target is pushed 1 square and knocked prone. Enforced Sacrifice (immediate interrupt, when attacked; encounter)
Target an adjacent enemy other than the attacker. +8 vs. Reflex; redirect attack to target. Hobgoblin Resilience (immediate reaction; encounter)
When a hobgoblin suffers an effect a save can end, the hobgoblin makes an immediate save against the effect. Alignment Evil Languages Goblinoid Skills Athletics +6, Intimidate +9 Str 17 (+4) Dex 13 (+2) Wis 13 (+2) Con 16 (+4) Int 12 (+2) Cha 16 (+4)
Hobgoblin Pickfighter
Level 2 Soldier XP 125
Medium natural humanoid Initiative +7 Senses Perception +3 HP 38; Bloodied 19 AC 18 (20 with phalanx soldier); Fortitude 17, Reflex 16, Will 15 Speed 6 m War Pick (standard; at-will) * Weapon
+7 vs. AC; 1d8 + 4 damage (1d8+12 crit).
M Challenging Strike (standard; at-will) * Weapon
+7 vs. AC; 1d8 + 4 damage (1d8+12 crit) and slide target 1 square. Target is marked until the end of the hobgoblin pickfighter's next turn. Strike the Unwary (immediate reaction, marked target attacks any other ally; at-will) * Weapon
May shift 1 before making attack; +9 vs. AC; 1d8 +4 damage (1d8+12 crit) and slide target 1 square. Hobgoblin Resilience (immediate reaction; encounter)
When a hobgoblin suffers an effect a save can end, the hobgoblin makes an immediate save against the effect. Phalanx Soldier The hobgoblin pickfighter gains a +2 bonus to AC while at least one hobgoblin ally is adjacent to it. Alignment Evil Languages Goblinoid Skills Athletics +12 Str 19 (+5) Dex 14 (+3) Wis 14 (+3) Con 14 (+3) Int 10 (+1) Cha 10 (+1) Equipment Leather armor, heavy shield, war pick
If you use the hobgoblin dragon shaman as well, I seem to recall it was a little unbalanced (powerful) - lightning bolt too easy to use. Maybe drop the ranges from 10 to 5.
Looks like I did up variants of the 3 goblins above, a goblin minion, and redid the 6 goblins from the Monster Manual, to adjust for DMG math and try out some ideas I've had - so I'll get those up on a website shortly. Tomorrow after work most likely.
Last edited by keterys; 18th March 2009 at 08:16 AM..
As a word of warning, I'd substituted in a variant Goblin Tactics (triggers on any attack and gives combat advantage against the attacker, but only works once per encounter) across the board, so you might want to unsub that. Should be able to keep the extras attached while still reverting to at-will and on melee misses only. I was just very unhappy with how often it A) triggered at all B) mattered.
Rough changelog:
1) Damage output, attack values, and defenses retuned to follow DMG suggestion
2) Goblin tactics changed to actually trigger and be on par with other racial abilities (some have improved versions thereof)
3) All goblins experimenting somewhere in the bloodied design space. Seeing what I think on it.
4) While the goblins are all dancing and scampering, they're a lot more vicious - in temperament and balance
I can explain any of the changes I made, at all, if anyone wants to know.
I can explain any of the changes I made, at all, if anyone wants to know.
Sure.
The biggest change I noticed was the Goblin Warrior.
Also, seeking advice:
I'm working on the first level of Shadowfell Keep right now, and one of the monsters I want to overhaul is the Hobgoblin Torturer. He's just boring. Do you have any suggestions, powers wise? (I also plan on changing the armor).
One power idea I had was an encounter power: 'Make 'Em Scream'; +x vs. Reflex; target takes 1d8+x damage, is grabbed, and enemies within 2 receive a -2 to attacks, while allies receive a +2 to attacks, until the end of the torturer's next turn.
Although that feels more like a Controller power. I want the Hobgoblin torturer to feel like a torturer, and have powers that clearly are harsh, and I also want him to stay alive longer. But things like Ongoing Damage/etc feel more like controller effects, and brutes barely hit. Controllers have no hit points, though, and I want him to do something cool before he dies.
The biggest change I noticed was the Goblin Warrior.
Heh, yeah - actually, I'm not happy with what I put down for Adrenaline Rush. I mean, it seems cool in my head, but too clunky I think. Maybe goblin tactics becomes at-will when it's bloodied.
I'll overview each, but first...
Quote:
Also, seeking advice: I'm working on the first level of Shadowfell Keep right now, and one of the monsters I want to overhaul is the Hobgoblin Torturer. He's just boring. Do you have any suggestions, powers wise? (I also plan on changing the armor).
So, I don't have KoS on me to check, but I think when I ran that I tried to make it about the Torturer putting people in the flame pit and iron maiden. So, bull rushes and grapples in theory.
Now, if you also want him to live longer, how about something like the bugbear strangler?
So, give him a grab, a body shield, and maybe a minor action torture attack on someone grabbed to daze them with pain? You could also add push 1 to his melee attack for the attack hurting so much.
But, grabbing someone and then dragging and tossing them into the iron maiden and closing it as a minor is pretty harsh. Especially if it locks in some way when closed.
Your encounter power looks pretty promising, but I wouldn't put all your bets on an encounter power on a brute because they just miss so much. Toning it back, but making it at-will or easy recharge might work better.
Still, I'm curious why you changed what you did. And interested in hearing it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by keterys
So, I don't have KoS on me to check, but I think when I ran that I tried to make it about the Torturer putting people in the flame pit and iron maiden. So, bull rushes and grapples in theory.
How'd that work out?
Quote:
So, give him a grab, a body shield, and maybe a minor action torture attack on someone grabbed to daze them with pain? You could also add push 1 to his melee attack for the attack hurting so much.
The "Live longer" is relative. I have a barbarian in the party, who likes to drill the hell out of anything.
I like the grab/body shield idea. ALthough if his physical attacks push one, that might shove people into the maiden/cage regardless.
Anyhow, Minor (requires grabbed target): +4 vs. Fort; target is dazed until the end of the Torturer's next turn.
The Iron Maiden just says "Anyone in the iron maiden when the device is closed receives 10 points of damage." I don't think it locks. But, dazing someone, shoving them into the maiden, and closing it (forcing them to spend one action just to open the damn thing) is rather harsh.
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Your encounter power looks pretty promising, but I wouldn't put all your bets on an encounter power on a brute because they just miss so much. Toning it back, but making it at-will or easy recharge might work better.
My thought was to essentially make it a Reliable power; it's not expended until it Hits.
Big Ol' Bite (Standard, At Will)
+6 vs. AC; 1d6+3 (1d6+7 with Combat Advantage)
Latch'n'Climb (Standard, At-Will)
Requires Combat Advantage: +4 vs. Ref; 1d10+3, and the target is grabbed.
Ear Gnaw (Minor, At-Will)
Grabbed target only; +4 vs. Ref; 1d6+3 damage (1d6+7 with combat advantage)
Get it Off!
A Goblin Earbiter has a +5 to AC and Reflex saves while grappling.
Goblin Tactics (Immediate Reaction, when attacked; encounter)
The goblin shifts 1 square and gains combat advantage against its attacker until the end of its next turn.
Stealth +10
Str 14 Dex 17 Wis 12
Con 13 Int 8 Cha 8
Reliable should work, then. And yeah, 10 damage for getting shoved in the iron maiden and needing someone else to open it for you or wasting your action - yeah, sounds good.
Technically, you could also make him a full blown elite. That should help him stay alive, and at that point you could give him a reactive attack or double attack, or a minor action grab attack.
Hah, nice edited in goblin - the ear gnaw might be a bit vicious for a level 1... maybe 1/round, or a reaction to a creature ending its turn while grabbed (ie, not escaping immediately), or something.
Basically means that if it already has combat advantage, it can do a standard attack then 2 gnaws in one round, which is a potential burst of ~29.5 damage from a level 1 non-elite, which is too much.
Choking Shove (Standard, At-Will)
+6 vs. Reflex; 1d10+4 damage, and slide 1.
Twist the Knife (Minor, At Will)
+6 vs. Fort; target is dazed until the end of the Torturer's next turn.
Make'm Scream (Standard, recharges when missed; Encounter) Fear
+6 vs. Will; 1d10+4 damage. Until the end of the Torturer's next turn, allies within 2 squares gain +2 to attacks, while enemies receive -2 to attacks.
I was going to give various grab effects, but it seemed overly clunky. He doesn't have to hold them to do his thing, just hit the right spot; sliding a hit target is elegant enough.
Also adjusted the various attacks vs. defenses; a 3rd level brute should be hitting at +4 vs. NADs. I noticed your Battlefist (a level 3 brute) was hitting with a +8 against a NAD (albeit it is a recharge power). So I went with middle of the road, between +4 and +8.
As to the other goblins:
I actually don't mind the adrenaline rush, it just reads clunky. What you might do is instead of a basic attack, allow a ranged basic attack.
I really dig the Underboss's superior goblin tactics, and his Underboss ferocity, but I think he's rather dull as far as an Elite goes. He's just making one attack per round, and likely the goblin at-will thing. He's a typical 'stand around and use basic attacks' elite, which is a shame for a controller.
BTW, I plan on using your Goblin Pyro, but instead of a torch, the pyro will be using hot coals in tongs, and a branding iron. And when bloodied, the hot coal gets knocked down his shirt.
I suppose I should mention one more global principle in the changes - I'm trying to make combat lean a little on the faster side and less on the grindy side. So, more damage, less defenses, and more 'And now for something completely different'.
First, the revisions I did on my own (other than the global changes already mentioned):
Goblin Butcher - I changed its combat advantage bonus to +4 against bloodied enemies, which I thought fit the "butcher" theme better and filled its "bloodied" trigger, even though it wasn't its own bloodied. It may be worth note that Off at the Knee is a lot more powerful once the DMG math is applied to it - in truth I could have made it do even more damage, but I thought that was plenty.
Goblin Minion - I removed some of what might be considered sillier elements (though I think applying some kind of 'Oops' effect for 1s for the goblins in general could still be good for some games) - it wasn't likely to trigger and was eating up space. As far as minions go, this is already really huge, but I like the dances and they can be played up as silly or vicious as desired. Dance of death reflects a change in how I think minions should be designed in general. Either some status effect (ex: ghouls) or some type of insurance on getting to really act.
Goblin Pyro - Again, I revised it to make it less inherently silly. I also changed it so it got to keep its torch attack rather than sacrifice it for its big fire effect. Flaming Oil on a miss will still autokill all minions around the target, at least. The lament not only gets itself killed faster, but has a neat chain effect of lighting PCs on fire. I've no doubt that I was thinking of this game when I designed it, but eh.
Goblin Pain Shaman (aka, Warchanter) - So, it was a little disparately themed before since it was modeling an NPC in a module. Now it's got a straightforward theme - albeit a bit risque - and works it.
And then the revisions of Monster Manual:
Goblin Blackblade - Main change is the on bloodied ability to relurk. I chose not to have its ranged attack get combat advantage for space and also to encourage it to go into melee. I removed the limitation on sneaky working on higher level allies - it's already caused confusion in a published product, saved me space, and makes it much tougher to use.
Goblin Hexer - This is one of the most reviled monsters among many circles. I changed its cloud so that it was still a huge effect, but a dangerous one rather than a frustrating one. I dropped a couple of its abilities for space (like the range redirect), but its bloodied ability makes you pay, one way or another, to either kill it quickly or leave it up. The slide 1 on its melee lets it disengage a little more easily and makes it slightly more interesting when forced to do that.
Goblin Sharpshooter - Nothing too special going on here, actually. By the DMG it should actually be like AC 14 and Ref 16, but I decided 15/15 was more palatable.
Goblin Skullcleaver - Not too much going on here - gave it the OA against shifts to make it less easy to lead it around by the nose once it's raging.
Goblin Underboss - The MM version is downright boring as written - especially if it's the last thing targeted. Grind it a bit and... hey, it's bloodied... now it's even more grindy. Sigh. Gave it more leadership potential and made it a real choice to kill it fast or leave it up.
Goblin Warrior - I was most conflicted here. I'm not entirely sure why the MM version is the generic "warrior" goblin, since it's actually a bit fiddly when you get down to it. I switched out its almost-entirely-range focus for more generic move and attack (range or melee). I think I'd just swap Adrenaline Rush for something - originally the intent was for it to make a ranged and melee attack both in same turn (probably by adding onto mobile attack) but I got fuzzy on wording and tried something easier.
Aside: It's odd, but the computer I'm on now some of the powers go over an extra line (at least on the webpage) but didn't on my other (or at least, the originals did). I'll have to experiment with that. Maybe a font issue, dunno. Anyhow, that's where there's a couple odd 1 word and no other text lines in there.
Last edited by keterys; 19th March 2009 at 08:45 PM..
PCs just came out of the Irontooth fight. I think throwing another elite brute would be rather harsh.
Good call, that.
Quote:
I was going to give various grab effects, but it seemed overly clunky. He doesn't have to hold them to do his thing, just hit the right spot; sliding a hit target is elegant enough.
Yep, pretty sure when I ran it I had some kind of push effect is how I ran mine. Then the PCs showed up with a party of all dwarves, so I had to do the grab for it to work at all.
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Also adjusted the various attacks vs. defenses; a 3rd level brute should be hitting at +4 vs. NADs. I noticed your Battlefist (a level 3 brute) was hitting with a +8 against a NAD (albeit it is a recharge power). So I went with middle of the road, between +4 and +8.
Yeah, that's the problem with me making these several months before the books came out. I figured +5 would fit the math... and it _does_, but not for brutes.
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I actually don't mind the adrenaline rush, it just reads clunky. What you might do is instead of a basic attack, allow a ranged basic attack.
That is actually closer to my original thought. I'll work at it later.
Quote:
I really dig the Underboss's superior goblin tactics, and his Underboss ferocity, but I think he's rather dull as far as an Elite goes. He's just making one attack per round, and likely the goblin at-will thing. He's a typical 'stand around and use basic attacks' elite, which is a shame for a controller.
He does get the extra attack whenever a goblin within sight is attacked, too. But, yeah, he's pretty simple - I wasn't trying to make him drastically more complex than the MM version, just less grindy.
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BTW, I plan on using your Goblin Pyro, but instead of a torch, the pyro will be using hot coals in tongs, and a branding iron. And when bloodied, the hot coal gets knocked down his shirt.
Good deal - pretty sure I had put a pyro in that room too
He does get the extra attack whenever a goblin within sight is attacked, too. But, yeah, he's pretty simple - I wasn't trying to make him drastically more complex than the MM version, just less grindy.
It's funny though, when you look at the Hexer who is all tricked out, for a regular controller... and then the Underboss is woefully undertricked for an elite of one level higher.
Anyhow, thanks for the advice/break down of your monsters. I forgot that you made a bunch of these before the MM was out.
I'm running KotS, and my PCs aren't even to the Keep yet. 
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