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Old 15th September 2008, 03:54 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Cadfan Snaketongue Initiate (Lvl 7)Cadfan Snaketongue Initiate (Lvl 7)
Some further edits made to the compendium post. The path mastery bonuses have been changed, as has the math for calculating mastery level.

Those have been the hardest part of the design. I want to encourage specialization, not merely to hand out small bonuses at random. So I've set the Path Mastery to "number of powers from that path, minus 1." The minus one part ensures that taking just one power from a path, or taking a feat that boosts that path, won't give you a "mastery" bonus. You have to invest at least 2 powers, or a power and a feat.

I may change it so that its "number of powers from that path, but a mastery level of 1 has no effect." That way you always start out with at least a bonus of 2, but you don't get anything from being a dilettante.
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Old 17th September 2008, 06:32 PM   #22 (permalink)
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In spite of the almost complete lack of replies to this topic, I soldier on!

Feat: Shadow Cast
Paragon Tier
Any of your close burst or close blast mysteries may originate from a space adjacent to you rather than from your space.

Special: When you move the origin space of a close burst, it still deals no damage to you as normal. It may deal damage to someone in the new origin space.

Basically like the wizard feat but weaker and without the prerequisite, and with a rules note to clarify an ambiguity. The note probably isn't even necessary.

The next step is to create paragon paths. I want one that specializes in each path, but with a slight twist so that they aren't just more of the same. They're tougher to design than I expected, probably because I need five of them and each one requires six entries (two level 11 abilities, one level 11 power, one level 12 power, one level 16 ability, and one level 20 power).
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Old 17th September 2008, 10:33 PM   #23 (permalink)
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PDF version, perhaps

Greetings...

Hey, Cadfan -

I have only briefly glanced at the work done here, and it looks very interesting and inviting.

The only issue I have is the presentation of the information. Well, not really the presentation - as the presentation in the thread is perfect. I would just rather have a PDF or something with all the information so that it could all be printed and reviewed at once.

Any chance of transferring the information into a PDF? A PDF with just the heroic tier would be fine, since that's pretty much all you've posted. A complete PDF would be grand, though.

(Just so you know that people are, indeed, following the thread.)

Until that time...
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Old 17th September 2008, 10:43 PM   #24 (permalink)
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I will absolutely upload a pdf... but right now I don't yet trust the balance since the only person who's reviewed it for balance is, well, me.

I also have a few... proud nails? Things I'd like to change if I could think up a better idea. Some of the path mastery bonuses, in particular, I'd like to revise. I like the temporary hit point one, the bonus to stealth (since this is a stealthy type character with no reason to use dexterity), and I'm a little ambivalent on some of the rest. They're not terrible, but if better ideas came along I'd change them.
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Old 18th September 2008, 04:59 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Armor Proficiency: Cloth, Leather
Leather is actually pretty nice.

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Originally Posted by Cadfan View Post
Trained Skills: Arcana. From the following list, choose 3 more: Dungeoneering, Endurance, Insight, Intimidate, Perception, Stealth
Interesting. Why not Bluff, History or Streetwise?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadfan View Post
Mystic Reflections
+2 on the use of the Arcana skill to detect magic.
This is worthless.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadfan View Post
Bend Perspective
When you cast this mystery, choose a square within five spaces of yourself. You may trace line of sight from this square. Sustain: minor.
This is ZOMG broken. There's a magic item which allows LoS offset by one square, and that's very strong.

[quote=Cadfan;4461051]For each path, a Shadowcaster has a "mastery level." This is equal to the number of mysteries the Shadowcaster knows from that path, minus 1. The Shadowcaster's Mastery Level in a path is used in determining the strength of his path features.

Quote:
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Umbral Mind
Path Feature: Add your mastery level in this path as a bonus to your Intimidate skill.
Could be broken, depending how you rule Intimidate used in combat.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadfan View Post
Sharp Shadows
The shadows that surrounds you are edged, sharp enough to draw blood.
Dark Metamorphosis
Int v ref, R10, 1d8+ Intelligence cold damage. If a foe strikes you with a melee attack before your next turn, it takes your charisma modifier in damage.
Needs to be more precise. I think you mean if the one enemy you hit moves up and thwacks you, it takes extra damage ... which is very weak. If you mean any foe who thwacks you takes the extra damage, then it's reasonably strong.

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Originally Posted by Cadfan View Post
Voice of Shadow
Your voice whispers in the back of your enemies minds, urging them to give up, to die...
Umbral Mind
Close Burst 2. Int v will. Foes take 1d6+int psychic damage.
Oh wow. Very big area for an at-will. Combined with Psychic Lock, this is totally brutal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadfan View Post
Arrows of Dusk
The energy of the Shadowfell flows from your fingers.
Elemental Shadows
2 targets within 2 of each other, R5, Int v ref, 1d6+ Intelligence necrotic damage
Should probably say something more like "1 or 2 targets within 2 of each other".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadfan View Post
Black Fire
You begin to breach the walls between this world and the next.
Darkness Unbound
Wall 4 within 10. Everyone who passes through this wall or who begins their turn inside this wall takes 1d6+ Intelligence cold damage. This wall may only be created in empty spaces. You may dismiss this wall as a free action. Sustain: Minor.
Huh, an at-will wall. Does it block anything? Line of sight, line of effect, cover?


That's all I got time for tonight.

Cheers, -- N
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Old 18th September 2008, 08:39 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Quote:
Interesting. Why not Bluff, History or Streetwise?
Mostly to match the original Shadowcaster.
Quote:
This is worthless.
Hmm. You're right.
Quote:
This is ZOMG broken. There's a magic item which allows LoS offset by one square, and that's very strong.
The intent was that the way I phrased it you wouldn't be able to cast spells around corners, just see around corners. Because it doesn't provide line of effect. You'd be able to upgrade it with a feat you'll find later down the page so that you can cast around corners, but it would cost a standard action to cast the Fundamental, a minor to sustain it for the next round, and then the regular action to cast the spell. And the Fundamental only has a range of 5.

So what's the worst abuse you could pull off?
Quote:
Could be broken, depending how you rule Intimidate used in combat.
The most you can get out of it based on current design is +6. And that's if you focus exclusively on this skill. Since Charisma isn't your favorite ability score, it basically puts you even with a paladin who took Skill Focus: Intimidate. Which is broken, I guess, depending on how you rule Intimidate to work in combat...
Quote:
Needs to be more precise. I think you mean if the one enemy you hit moves up and thwacks you, it takes extra damage ... which is very weak. If you mean any foe who thwacks you takes the extra damage, then it's reasonably strong.
Exactly the way its phrased now. Anyone who hits you takes the damage. Ten people hit you, ten people take the damage.
Quote:
Oh wow. Very big area for an at-will. Combined with Psychic Lock, this is totally brutal.
I hadn't thought about Psychic Lock. Still, it requires you to take your lightly armored character and venture within two spaces of your enemies. And if you want to hit more than one or two, you have to actually move in between them. I was hoping that the high risk would balance things.
Quote:
Should probably say something more like "1 or 2 targets within 2 of each other".
Yeah, my phrasing isn't technically precise yet. I'll copy the language used by the PHB when I have the time.
Quote:
Huh, an at-will wall. Does it block anything? Line of sight, line of effect, cover?
No. Just does damage. Its less a wall than an homage to the original Shadowcaster powers of the Dark Terrain path. Just some spaces that deal damage if you enter them.
Quote:
That's all I got time for tonight.
Thanks!
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Old 18th September 2008, 02:27 PM   #27 (permalink)
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The intent was that the way I phrased it you wouldn't be able to cast spells around corners, just see around corners. Because it doesn't provide line of effect.
There are plenty of teleportation effects that only need line of sight, but I'm more thinking about being able to look around every corner without making a Stealth check.

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Originally Posted by Cadfan View Post
Exactly the way its phrased now. Anyone who hits you takes the damage. Ten people hit you, ten people take the damage.
The way it's phrased now is ambiguous, which is why I had to ask what you meant. Re-phrase it to make it more obvious.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadfan View Post
I hadn't thought about Psychic Lock. Still, it requires you to take your lightly armored character and venture within two spaces of your enemies. And if you want to hit more than one or two, you have to actually move in between them. I was hoping that the high risk would balance things.
If you're standing behind two Defenders, your risk isn't all that high, and you can still easily hit five dudes on the other side of your allies, locked down by the two Defenders.

Compare with some Cleric Encounter powers, and I think you'll see attacking Will in that large an area At-Will is too strong. As an Encounter power, it's fine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadfan View Post
No. Just does damage. Its less a wall than an homage to the original Shadowcaster powers of the Dark Terrain path. Just some spaces that deal damage if you enter them.
Huh. Doesn't seem all that bad then.

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Old 3rd October 2008, 05:42 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Any updates to this? It deserves a hefty bump.
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Old 10th October 2008, 03:28 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Any updates to this? It deserves a hefty bump.
I'm having trouble coming up with paragon paths. That's kind of my current sticking point.

To fit the architecture I've set, I need one paragon path per Path choice. That's five in total. That's... a lot of paragon paths to design.

I'll try to get at least one done sometime today. Who knows if it will happen.
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Old 16th October 2008, 04:19 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Cadfan Snaketongue Initiate (Lvl 7)Cadfan Snaketongue Initiate (Lvl 7)
Some of you may recognize this.

Whispersmith
Paragon Path
You have listened to the whispering voices from the deepest darkness, and learned to answer.

11: You can understand and respond to the speech of any sentient creature. You cannot read their language, unless you know it by some other means.
11: [Action Point] When you spend an action point, all foes in 5 take -2 to attack rolls until the end of your next turn.
16: You may communicate telepathically with any willing creature you specifically know within 10 miles.

Sussuration
You inescapable whispers speak directly to the mind.
Level 11 Encounter Power
Umbral Mind
Target: Enemies in close burst 5. This power affects enemies even without line of sight or line of effect.
Int v Will. Hit: Dazed, in addition, you may slide a hit target 3+cha spaces, or knock that target prone.


Subvocalize
You lend weight to your words by leaning upon the psyche.
Level 12 Utility Power (Encounter)
Gain a +5 bonus on your next diplomacy, bluff, or intimidate check. If you fail the check, your target knows you attempted to influence them magically. If you succeed, the target does not.

Sibilation
Your foe can do little but listen to your voice.
Level 20 Daily Power
Umbral Mind
Int v Will. Range 20. This power affects enemies even without line of sight or line of effect. Hit: 4d10+Int psychic, stun. Sustain: move to maintain the stun. If foe saves, stun may not be sustained.
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Old 16th October 2008, 04:55 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Whispersmith
Depends on how far away the next somaturge of extraordinary puissance is.

Cheers, LT.
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Old 19th October 2008, 03:34 AM   #32 (permalink)
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Convert to a PDF request

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadfan View Post
This post has all the heroic tier material. If notes above conflict with this post, this post is intended to be the final version.

Also, design notes are omitted.

Primary Shadowcaster Statblock
Spoiler:
Shadowcaster 4e

Power Source: Shadow. Your powers are called Mysteries.
Role: Controller.
Key Abilities: Intelligence, Charisma
Armor Proficiency: Cloth, Leather
Weapon Proficiency: All simple
Implement: Orb, Staff, Wand
Bonus to Defense: +1 Fortitude, +1 Will

Hit Points at 1st Level: 12+ Constitution Score
Hit Points per Level Gained: 5
Healing Surges per Day: 6+ Constitution Modifier

Trained Skills: Arcana. From the following list, choose 3 more: Dungeoneering, Endurance, Insight, Intimidate, Perception, Stealth

Build Options: N/A
Class Features: Path Mastery, Fundamentals, Umbral Sight

Fundamentals: You know the five fundamentals detailed below. They are at will powers.

Umbral Sight: You gain Low-Light Vision. If you have Low-Light Vision from another source, gain +2 to perception checks.

Fundamentals
Spoiler:
Fundamentals: You know the following Fundamentals automatically. They are at will powers and require a standard action to activate.

Black Candle
Creates radius 3 shadowy illumination centered on you. Note that this can increase the ambient lighting or decrease it as the case may be.

Mystic Reflections
+2 on the use of the Arcana skill to detect magic.

Umbral Hand
As Mage Hand.

Bend Perspective
When you cast this mystery, choose a square within five spaces of yourself. You may trace line of sight from this square. Sustain: minor.

Shadow Cloak
+2 stealth, sustain minor

Path Mastery
Spoiler:
Path Mastery: Many mysteries a Shadowcaster can learn (other than cantrips and utility powers) have an associated path. A Shadowcaster gains special benefits from knowing many mysteries with the same path. These benefits are detailed in the Path Feature section below.

For each path, a Shadowcaster has a "mastery level." This is equal to the number of mysteries the Shadowcaster knows from that path, minus 1. The Shadowcaster's Mastery Level in a path is used in determining the strength of his path features.

Paths

Dark Metamorphosis
Path Feature: You begin each encounter with temporary hit points equal to your mastery level. At paragon tier, you double this amount. At epic tier, triple it.

Umbral Mind
Path Feature: Add your mastery level in this path as a bonus to your Intimidate skill.

Shutters and Mirrors
Path Feature: Add your mastery level in this path as a bonus to your Perception skill.

Elemental Shadows
Path Feature: You gain Resist Necrotic equal to your mastery level in this path.

Darkness Unbound
Path Feature: Add your mastery level in this path as a bonus to your Stealth skill.

At Will Mysteries
Spoiler:
Sharp Shadows
The shadows that surrounds you are edged, sharp enough to draw blood.
Dark Metamorphosis
Int v ref, R10, 1d8+ Intelligence cold damage. If a foe strikes you with a melee attack before your next turn, it takes your charisma modifier in damage.

Voice of Shadow
Your voice whispers in the back of your enemies minds, urging them to give up, to die...
Umbral Mind
Close Burst 2. Int v will. Foes take 1d6+int psychic damage.

Shadow Hood
You wrap your foes face in cloth-like shadow.
Shutters and Mirrors
Int v will, R5, 1d4+ int psychic damage. All enemies the target attacks for one round count as having concealment.

Arrows of Dusk
The energy of the Shadowfell flows from your fingers.
Elemental Shadows
2 targets within 2 of each other, R5, Int v ref, 1d6+ Intelligence necrotic damage

Black Fire
You begin to breach the walls between this world and the next.
Darkness Unbound
Wall 4 within 10. Everyone who passes through this wall or who begins their turn inside this wall takes 1d6+ Intelligence cold damage. This wall may only be created in empty spaces. You may dismiss this wall as a free action. Sustain: Minor.

Level 1 Encounter Mysteries
Spoiler:
1: Life Fades
You drain vitality from your foes, leaving them vulnerable.
Elemental Shadow
R5, two targets within 2 spaces of each other. Int v reflex, 2d8+ Int cold damage. If this attack would reduce an enemy to below its bloodied value, instead reduce that enemy to its bloodied value.

1: Mesmerizing Shade
Your opponent's mind swims with shadowy images.
Umbral Mind
Int v will, 2d8+ int psychic damage. Effect: inflicts a penalty on the target's next attack roll equal to your charisma bonus.

1: Feral Reflection
Your foe's shadow twists from the floor to strike at him.
Shutters and Mirrors
R5. The target suffers an attack equal to its own basic melee attack, with a bonus to the attack roll equal to your charisma bonus.


Level 1 Daily Mysteries
Spoiler:
1: Umbral Touch
Dark energy bleeds from your fingertips.
Dark Metamorphosis
Attack an adjacent enemy with an int v ref attack that deals 2d6+ Int necrotic damage. If you hit with this attack you gain your charisma bonus in temporary hit points. Sustain: Minor. While this power is sustained, you may make another attack with it by spending a standard action.

1: Clinging Darkness
Shadows surge across the floor, grabbing at your opponent's ankles.
Darkness Unbound
Zone 5, centered on the caster. Enemies in this zone who do not move at least 2 spaces during their turn take your charisma modifier in damage and are immobilized at the end of their turn. This immobilization lasts until the end of their next turn. This zone emanates from the caster, and moves with him. Sustain: Minor.

Level 2 Utility Powers
Spoiler:
Steel Shadows
Daily
+3 power bonus to ac until end of encounter

Congress of Shadow
Daily
Converse with willing ally silently across distance equal to your charisma modifier in miles.

Sight Eclipsed
Daily
+5 to stealth for duration of encounter

Level 3 Encounter Powers
Spoiler:
3: Flesh Fails
Your foe is close to defeat, he only needs a push...
Elemental Shadow
R5, two targets within 3. Int v ref. 2d6+ Int cold damage. If at least one bloodied foe is targeted by this attack, increase the damage to both by Cha.

3: Afraid of the Dark
Fear of the shadow paralyzes your foe.
Umbral Mind
Enemies in Close Burst 5, Int v will. 1d8+Int psychic damage. Until the end of its next turn a target hit by this attack will not voluntarily enter a square that is dark or has shadowy illumination.

3: Shadow Bind
You pull your foe's life energies into his shadow, so that you may more easily extinguish them.
Shutters and Mirrors
R10. Int v fort. 2d6+ Int necrotic damage. Until the end of your next turn, any power which can target a space within Cha spaces from this opponent may be used to target the opponent itself. This includes melee attacks.


Level 5 Daily Powers
Spoiler:
5: Aura of Shade
You channel the power of shadow into an ally.
Dark Metamorphosis
R5, yourself or an ally. The target deals an additional 1d6 cold damage on all hits until the end of the encounter.

5: Murder at Nightfall
You and your allies slip silently through the shadows, stalking your foes.
Darkness Unbound
Zone, Close Burst 8. Shadowy illumination. Sustain: Minor. You and your allies gain a bonus to stealth checks equal to your charisma modifier while in this zone.


Level 6 Utility Powers
Spoiler:
6: Bolster
Dark energy sustains you.
Daily, Minor action
R5. The target may spend a healing surge to gain temporary hit points equal to two healing surges.

6: Piercing Sight
You see with more than mere sight...
Daily, Minor action
Gain darkvision for the duration of the encounter. For the duration of the encounter you can also see invisible creatures. Every round, take one point of damage for each invisible creature you can see. You may dismiss Piercing Sight as a free action.

6: Sight Eclipsed
You warp light and darkness around yourself, and vanish from view.
Encounter, Minor action
Make a hide check versus your opponents' passive perception scores. Any creature who's passive perception you exceed cannot see you until the end of your next turn. You count as if you have total concealment from these opponents.


Level 7 encounter powers
Spoiler:
7: Life Ends
Each death opens the door to the afterworld a little further.
Elemental Shadow
Enemies in close burst 5. 1d6+int necrotic damage. If this power kills one or more foes, deal your charisma modifier in damage to the other foes hit by this power for each enemy killed by this power. If this causes another enemy to die, repeat the process.

7: All Sides Besieged
Your enemy flees from both friend and foe.
Umbral Mind
R5, Int v Will. 2d8+int psychic damage, and the target moves its speed until it is no longer adjacent to any other creature, friend or foe. It avoids opportunity attacks if possible. On its next turn it will not voluntarily move adjacent to any creature, but it is not obliged to otherwise flee.

7: Dark Echo
Anything you can do I can do better.
Shutters and Mirrors
Immediate Reaction. Trigger: A foe targets you and only you with a ranged or melee attack. The foe immediately suffers an identical attack using the foe's stats. Resolve the echo attack first, and if the foe is incapable of using the initial attack afterwards (because it is dead, unconscious, etc), the foe's original attack is negated. If the attack against your foe requires decisions to be made (such as what direction to slide your foe on a hit, etc), you make them.


Level 9 daily powers
Spoiler:
9: Flicker
You merge your body with the darkness, flickering from shadow to shadow.
Dark Metamorphosis
Minor action. Teleport 5. Sustain: Minor. When you sustain this power, you may teleport 5 spaces.

9: Sudden Rift
You tear a hole in the fabric of reality between this world and the Shadowfell, and dark energy pours through, overwhelming your foes.
Darkness Unbound
Close Blast 5. Int v Ref. 3d6+int cold and necrotic damage, and daze. Miss: half, no daze.


Level 10 Utility
Spoiler:
10: Step into Shadow
You step into one shadow, and emerge from another.
Daily. Move action. Teleport up to 5+cha spaces. You only need line of sight to teleport with this power, not line of effect, meaning that it is compatible with powers that alter your line of sight.

10: Dancing Shadows
A foe's attack strikes only the shadow of the true target.
Daily. Immediate Reaction. R5. Trigger: Target is hit with an attack. Negate this attack, and the target MUST shift one space. This power only works against blasts, bursts and zones if the one space shift places the target outside of their area of effect.

10: Shadow Investiture
Invite the darkness to stay awhile...
Daily. Standard action. R5. Target gains +2 movement, +2 attack rolls, +2 ac, and +2 reflex until the end of the encounter. The target loses 3 hit points at the beginning of each turn. The target of this effect may terminate it as a free action.
I want to use this class in my own game. May have your permission to convert it into a PDF? You will get full authorship credit.

Have you also finalized your class feats and multiclass feats?
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Old 19th October 2008, 06:12 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Cadfan Snaketongue Initiate (Lvl 7)Cadfan Snaketongue Initiate (Lvl 7)
If you wait until Monday afternoon, I'll upload it as a pdf myself and save you the trouble.

There's no such thing as "final" in the world of home brew. Right now, the only change I know needs to be made is to the fundamental Mystic Reflections, because it kind of doesn't do anything. So I'll put the feats into the pdf, but there's no guarantee they won't change.
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Old 20th October 2008, 07:42 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Cadfan Snaketongue Initiate (Lvl 7)Cadfan Snaketongue Initiate (Lvl 7)
Here's the pdf. Its got some changes and rebalancing in it, and some feats as well.

Its the most current version.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Shadowcaster Heroic Tier.pdf (43.9 KB, 112 views)
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Old 7th November 2008, 01:10 AM   #35 (permalink)
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Some of you may recognize this.
Yup. And I love it. Nice implementation.
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Old 13th November 2008, 04:29 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Great work here... Everyone interested in shadow magic should take a glance at this.

Did you ever post this over as the WotC site? If not you should.
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