4e Fan Creations and House RulesWorking on variant powers? Statting up a PC race or your version of a monster? Creating or converting an adventure? Put it here!
I've noticed that when starting out early in level 1, having bought equipment with 100 gp like the PH tells you, the players aren't that good, and early character death is a real danger. When character death happens, it seems reasonable to give the player's new character equal equipment worth the value of the dead player's equipment.
However, consulting the DMG, a new character at a higher level has way more stuff than a player who actually played up to that level could ever dream of having! If you made a level 1 character using the rules in the DMG, this superchar would have two magic items levels 1 and 2 and all the starting gear they wanted. That is way more than 100 gp worth.
Now, it seems unfair when, for example, at level 3 a player dies and then the new character is superpowered from so many items compared to the others. What if every player, at level 1 started with this abundance of items? It would level off the playing field, and give them the level 1 items that they would never find according to the treasure parcels! I haven't tried it out yet, but I'm thinking of proposing this as a viable idea. What is your experience with starting gear and new characters in 4e?
Take a look at Althai, my D&D 4e campaign setting, and The_Heroes of Althai, the dramedy of the heroes who did and will affect Althai. (Both on the backburner for now.)
The starting wealth levels are higher than what a character would normally get from play at level 2 and level 3 and maybe level 4, but are not excessive from level 5 onwards. The standard treasure parcels also contain magic items of higher level than the PCs would be able to obtain under the starting wealth guidelines.
That said, I don't think it would unbalance the game too much if you allowed characters to start the game with a 1st-level magic item or even a 1st-level magic item and a 2nd-level magic item. It would make the PCs slightly tougher at lower levels, but it would not make much of a difference in the long run.
If you allow replacement characters to bring in new equipment, how do you treat the equipment of the previous character? Does the rest of the party retain that as well? If so, I think that would be a greater problem for the magic item economy of your game than starting 1st-level characters with one or two magic items.
If a character in my game dies, and their equipment isn't lost in the process, anything that the players decide to not bury with their fallen comrade gets deducted from the low end of the party's upcoming treasure parcels.
__________________ Life's a die and then you bitch.
There isn't much point in house ruling this. The rules work for higher level characters and you can ad hoc for lower level characters. You mostly make house rules for things that happen a lot (like combat) not for making higher level characters.
The problem is that in some games I play (the ones in which I don't do any DM dice fudging) the characters die much more often than I would like them to, and I want a rule that can prevent that without forcing me to make the monsters act purposly stupid or fake a die roll.
Take a look at Althai, my D&D 4e campaign setting, and The_Heroes of Althai, the dramedy of the heroes who did and will affect Althai. (Both on the backburner for now.)
The problem is that in some games I play (the ones in which I don't do any DM dice fudging) the characters die much more often than I would like them to, and I want a rule that can prevent that without forcing me to make the monsters act purposly stupid or fake a die roll.
A few low level items are not going to solve this problem. It sounds like :
Your players tactics are not too good (or yours are better)
You are using too high level encounters
You have misread some rules (a common one is starting hit points - you get your Con SCORE added to hit points at level 1, not your con modifier. This would result in lots more deaths )
The basic rules are quite balanced and you shouldn't really consistenly see people dying all over the place.
Heh, I might've missed something, but not something that obvious (no offense to anyone who missed that). Yeah, it's probably the problem with the tactics. I know the rules too well and my players just want to play the game without spending time to learn how. I just want to give them a bit of an edge.
Another thing I noticed with some of the starting gear is the climber's kits and the thieves' tools. They give +2 bonuses to Athletics and Thievery checks respectively, but why aren't there other items that give this bonus to other skills? There's the fine clothing, which I houseruled gives you a +2 bonus to Diplomacy checks against others of the nobility, but I'm also going to create some other items to help. I'll rule that you can only start with one in the beginning though. (This is for completeness sake; I'm not OCD, but it bugs me when there's a gap. Martial Controller, for example.)
Here are some of my ideas. Note that they all carry some sort of penalty along with the bonus, e.g. it takes more time to use or you can use it only in certain situations.
Arcane Lore Book (+2 to Arcana, but takes longer to make the check while you look up information)
Fake Gold Necklace (+2 to Bluff against people who respect the rich, usually other rich, but -2 against people who think the rich always lie)
Fine Clothing (+2 to Diplomacy against nobility, but -2 against uncooperative commoners)
Dungeoneerer's Manual (+2 to Dungeoneering, but takes longer to make the check while you look up information)
First Aid Kit (+2 to Heal, but takes longer to make the check especially during combat)
History Book (+2 to History, but takes longer to make the check while you look up information)
Priestly Robes (+2 to Insight against religious people who feel bad about lying to clergy, but -2 against those who don't trust the church)
Bone Necklace (+2 to Intimidate against commoners who fear physical pain, but -2 against the brave ones who laugh in the face of danger)
Nature Survival Guide (+2 to Nature, but takes longer to make the check while you look up information)
Near-Sighted Spectacles (+2 to Perception, but -2 when what you're trying to look for is adjacent to you or in a book)
Holy Text (+2 to Religion, but takes longer to look up information, and only works for well-known religions)
Dark Clothing (+2 to Stealth, but -2 to Stealth when you're trying to hide in a crowd due to the solid color standing out)
Street Clothes (+2 to Streetwise in a town of normal folk who are somewhat helpful, but -2 if the people look down on commoners)
There are a few skills that I don't know what would be helpful (Acrobatics and Endurance). Maybe someone has ideas?
Take a look at Althai, my D&D 4e campaign setting, and The_Heroes of Althai, the dramedy of the heroes who did and will affect Althai. (Both on the backburner for now.)
There are a few skills that I don't know what would be helpful (Acrobatics and Endurance). Maybe someone has ideas?
Improved Quality Rations ie Good Food come to mind for endurance... Oh and their is this ointment you can rub on aches that is good for endurance as well... and hand powders if you are doing some acrobatics (swinging from chandeliers you probably wont think of it but making sure your hands aren't sweaty is useful). Certain packing skills can be used to improve the balance of your gear it is a supplemental skill use not an equipment difference though.
That said I am inclined to adjudicate on the fly for this stuff.. don't want to look it up.
Last edited by Garthanos; 18th June 2009 at 05:08 PM..
At the beginning of a campaign, I give my players a low level magic item (of my choice) based on their character background. This promotes the players to invest more time with their background and roleplaying.
Heh, I might've missed something, but not something that obvious (no offense to anyone who missed that). Yeah, it's probably the problem with the tactics. I know the rules too well and my players just want to play the game without spending time to learn how. I just want to give them a bit of an edge.
Another thing I noticed with some of the starting gear is the climber's kits and the thieves' tools. They give +2 bonuses to Athletics and Thievery checks respectively, but why aren't there other items that give this bonus to other skills? There's the fine clothing, which I houseruled gives you a +2 bonus to Diplomacy checks against others of the nobility, but I'm also going to create some other items to help. I'll rule that you can only start with one in the beginning though. (This is for completeness sake; I'm not OCD, but it bugs me when there's a gap. Martial Controller, for example.)
Here are some of my ideas. Note that they all carry some sort of penalty along with the bonus, e.g. it takes more time to use or you can use it only in certain situations.
Arcane Lore Book (+2 to Arcana, but takes longer to make the check while you look up information)
Fake Gold Necklace (+2 to Bluff against people who respect the rich, usually other rich, but -2 against people who think the rich always lie)
Fine Clothing (+2 to Diplomacy against nobility, but -2 against uncooperative commoners)
Dungeoneerer's Manual (+2 to Dungeoneering, but takes longer to make the check while you look up information)
First Aid Kit (+2 to Heal, but takes longer to make the check especially during combat)
History Book (+2 to History, but takes longer to make the check while you look up information)
Priestly Robes (+2 to Insight against religious people who feel bad about lying to clergy, but -2 against those who don't trust the church)
Bone Necklace (+2 to Intimidate against commoners who fear physical pain, but -2 against the brave ones who laugh in the face of danger)
Nature Survival Guide (+2 to Nature, but takes longer to make the check while you look up information)
Near-Sighted Spectacles (+2 to Perception, but -2 when what you're trying to look for is adjacent to you or in a book)
Holy Text (+2 to Religion, but takes longer to look up information, and only works for well-known religions)
Dark Clothing (+2 to Stealth, but -2 to Stealth when you're trying to hide in a crowd due to the solid color standing out)
Street Clothes (+2 to Streetwise in a town of normal folk who are somewhat helpful, but -2 if the people look down on commoners)
There are a few skills that I don't know what would be helpful (Acrobatics and Endurance). Maybe someone has ideas?
I don't think adding mundane items to give a +2 to these skills is a great idea. Many of these checks have significant effects in game and even magic items that give a bonus to them costs hundreds of gold. The climber's kit only helps with climbing because it is a mundane task that should be easier if done carefully. I'm not sure why thief's tools exist anymore. It should be assumed that each character has the necessary equipment to use their abilities, which is why we stopped tracking mundane spell components.
In any case the modifiers you referenced above look like the +2/-2 ad hoc modifiers that DMs are encouraged to use. What I'm saying is that if your players dress all in black to sneak around give them a +2 bonus, and if they do it during the day give them a -2 penalty, but don't add 'dark clothing' to the list of mundane equipment, make them work for it on their own! Similarly you could give them +2 to a religion check if they find/read/study a tome relevant to the religious question being asked.
The reason that many class tools appeared in 3e (healers kit) and not in 4e is that it makes for easier book keeping. Assume the rogue has her favorite lock picks and the fighter has some bandages and move on with the encounter. It's fine for the PC to inherit a set of especially fine theive's tools, purchase some healing balms off a traveling druid, or dress to blend in with their background, but leave this to situational modifiers and special cases.
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