Unearthed Arcana Takes On Theurgy & War Magic
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  • Unearthed Arcana Takes On Theurgy & War Magic


    In the latest Unearthed Arcana from WotC's Mike Mearls and Jeremy Crawford, the wizard gets another look. This week's short two-page PDF includes two Arcane Traditions - Theurgy (wizards with divine patrons) and War Magic (wizards who use evocation and abjuration in combat). "After releasing the 28-page mystic last week, we have a short Unearthed Arcana installment this week: two Arcane Tradition options for the wizard. The Theurgy tradition has appeared in Unearthed Arcana before, but this time we’d like to gather playtest feedback on it. War Magic is an option we’re exploring after reading your feedback on Lore Mastery and seeing interest in a war mage option."



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    Comments 74 Comments
    1. Juomari Veren's Avatar
      Juomari Veren -
      Wow, I'm so happy that they listened to what appears to be 0% of the critiques of the Theurge Wizard, and then made a new tradition that looks almost entirely useless at surface-level compared to every other tradition.

      This is the first UA I think I've genuinely despised in every way.
    1. TerraDave's Avatar
      TerraDave -
      Not as over-powered as the uber-mage they did sometime back, these seem fine on the surface.

      But is wizard the class that needs two more options (and 11? 12? 13? in total)?
    1. darjr's Avatar
      darjr -
      http://dnd.wizards.com/articles/unea...zard-revisited

      Also the Mistic survey is titled midway 14
    1. MonkeezOnFire's Avatar
      MonkeezOnFire -
      Part of me was hoping that the UA for wizards was just going to consist of new spells instead of subclasses. I'm pretty satisfied with the arcane traditions in core, but new spells are always appreciated.

      War wizard seems okay. Each of it's powers is good but not great. I find it overall a bit boring narrative wise to justify it getting included in a hardcover.

      Theurge seems the same from last time I remember it. Something was probably reworked to not be as broken as the last but I can't seem to recall the details to see the difference. Getting access to cleric spells and channel divinity still feels a bit too good.
    1. Aaron L's Avatar
      Aaron L -
      I'm really liking the War Mage Tradition.

      I could easily see an Eldritch Knight choosing to shift his focus into pure Wizardy later in his career and muticlassing into the War Mage Tradition, what with the same focus on Evocation and Abjuration magic for both Classes.

      The Theurgy Tradition as yet another take on the Divine Wizard seems fine... yet I am always confounded by the text invariably describing the Knowledge and Light Domains as good choices for a Wizard to choose if granted access to a Domain. Those Domains already work to emulate Arcane Magic and grant access to Arcane spells... why would a Wizard given access to Divine Magic choose a Domain full of more Arcane spells? And that's not just from a min-maxing perspective, as a character in-universe would know that he could learn to cast those spells in the normal progression of the study of Wizardry and so would be better served by choosing to focus on other areas of his god's portfolio, like Life, which the PHB says "almost any non-Evil deity can claim influence over," especially sun gods who would grant access to the Light Domain. But that's really just a pet peeve of mine and has no bearing on the way the mechanics of the Tradition work.

      I think these are fine additions.
    1. ZeshinX's Avatar
      ZeshinX -
      Can't say I'm impressed with the Theurge. A cleric with the Arcane domain from SCAG is a better theurge than this (in almost every regard). The concept behind it is interesting (a faithful wizard)...but the execution is just....well, meh, really. They just plunked cleric channeling and a few spells into the wizard. Letting a wizard gain access to a domain capstone ability BEFORE a cleric with that domain?? Nope, not on board with that at all.

      War Wizard...meh. Deflecting Shroud is not as deadly as it would like you to think. Sure, nice to spread it around, but that close and only 7 damage? (10 at 20th level). You're not wizarding well if you let critters get THAT close (10 ft. range). Useful against lower CR critters and/or mobs, but against more appropriately challenging critters for 14th level...you won't be that close and if you somehow find yourself that close...I don't think a gentle spank (even a Force damage spank) will bother them overmuch, especially when you've now borked yourself into only casting cantrips for a turn.
    1. Valetudo's Avatar
      Valetudo -
      Meh.
    1. Al2O3's Avatar
      Al2O3 -
      So, how is Theurge different from Arcana cleric or a wizard with the acolyte background? I seriously thought "wait, didn't they already print this in SCAG?" for the first half of the central description.

      The war mage seems perfectly fine to me. Almost a pity they didn't have it in time to include it in SCAG.

      Sent from my Nexus 6 using EN World mobile app
    1. Istbor -
      I don't feel like the Wizard really needs a lot of this right now. They have a good amount of choices already.

      What is more, while I like the war magic well enough, the Theurge rubs me the wrong way. Especially how they gain domain abilities faster than a Cleric of the same domain.
    1. The Human Target's Avatar
      The Human Target -
      They really needed some magic feats.
    1. Lanliss's Avatar
      Lanliss -
      I am slightly disappointed in the war mage. The first thing I thought of when I read it was a Wizard for mass combat, and this guy will not do well in that. I would have liked some range increase, possibly some siege style ability like "Your evocation spells bypass the Damage Thresh hold of buildings".

      On the Theurge, meh. Not personally a fan of divine stuff.
    1. ppaladin123's Avatar
      ppaladin123 -
      Quote Originally Posted by darjr View Post
      http://dnd.wizards.com/articles/unea...zard-revisited

      Also the Mistic survey is titled midway 14
      Midway! Due November 2017. That suggests it will show up in that book. PHB 2?
    1. ppaladin123's Avatar
      ppaladin123 -
      The Theurge appears identical to the previously shared version. Same problem...out classing the cleric by getting the level 17 feature at level 14.
    1. Eubani's Avatar
      Eubani -
      Considering how many Wizard subclasses are available it it seems the design team is making the same mistake they do in just about every edition past, which is too give an already full wizard more spells and more add ons such as subclasses or PrC's whilst classes that need attention or have had no or little extra support languish on the sidelines. It seem the old Wizard that lives by the sea has a bit of bias that he cannot seem to throw. We get it WotC you love wizards and have a distaste for martial, but you are not making this game for yourselves. I feel better now that I have got that out of my system.
    1. zaratan's Avatar
      zaratan -
      Man, I really don't like how theurge get exactly the cleric features. Make something different, as favored soul, or just forget theurge.
    1. gyor's Avatar
      gyor -
      Yeah I don't like how the thuege was done, it's just a straight up rip off of the cleric, only that one channel divinity was original. I don't think they changed it from the last one because it sounds like they made the mistake of not doing a survey that time, so they aren't likely to make changes until after the survey.

      Some suggestions, given that Wizards already have access to the Find Familiar spell, why not make more of the features use your familiar as a kind of intermediary with the Wizard's deity some how?


      A couple of the Warmage's features could use some umph, but otherwise I like it, it's the first UA Wizard subclass that I did.
    1. cbwjm's Avatar
      cbwjm -
      I love the theurge concept, not sure how this version is different but I would happily include either of them. Gaining the clerics 17th level ability at level 14 doesn't bother me in the least.

      The war mage is an interesting concept, looks like it needs something else to make it really interesting though. I'd allow it in my games but probably would take it for any of my wizards.
    1. Kobold Avenger's Avatar
      Kobold Avenger -
      The challenge with the War Mage is not having it completely overlap with the the Evoker.
    1. Benji's Avatar
      Benji -
      Quote Originally Posted by darjr View Post
      http://dnd.wizards.com/articles/unea...zard-revisited

      Also the Mistic survey is ti tled midway 14
      Well spotted I guess that solves what 'Midway' is going to be.
    1. Dire Bare's Avatar
      Dire Bare -
      Not seeing much love for the Theurge, including complaints Wizards are getting too much love.

      In the history of the D&D game, there have been many popular "subclasses" (in various rules incarnations) of the Wizard that haven't even been touched on yet. The Theurge is one of them, as the "Mystic Theurge" in 3E. It is intended to blend the Wizard and Cleric. I'm liking the version they are giving us so far, but of course, some real playtesting rather than armchair quarterbacking should toughen up the archetype a bit. The War Mage is another, also from 3E, and again seems good. I'm liking both archetypes so far.
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