Here's The Pathfinder 2nd Edition Skill List!
  • Here's The Pathfinder 2nd Edition Skill List!


    It's another Tuesday, which means another look at the previous night's Pathfinder 2nd Edition preview! There's only a couple of month to go until the full playtest rules are released (I have the hardcover on pre-order). Until then, Paizo continue with their twice-weekly glimpses into the ruleset - and this time we look at skills!







    • 17 base skills down from 35.
    • Lots of consolidation -- Athletics contains a bunch, and Use Magic Device is replaced by the relevant Lore skill
    • You are trained in more skills than before -- fighter has an extra one, for example (3+ Int mod)
    • Skill list --
      • Acrobatics (Dex)
      • Arcana (Int)
      • Athletics (Str)
      • Crafting (Int)
      • Deception (Cha)
      • Diplomacy (Cha)
      • Intimidation (Cha)
      • Lore (Int)
      • Medicine (Wis)
      • Nature (Wis)
      • Occultism (Int)
      • Performance (Cha)
      • Religion (Wis)
      • Society (Int)
      • Stealth (Dex)
      • Survival (Wis)
      • Thievery (Dex)

    • Skill proficiency --
      • Untrained -2, trained +0, expert +1, master +2, legendary +3 (plus level and ability modifier)
      • Each level of proficiency unlocks new skill uses
      • Medicine's Administer First Aid ability is available at the untrained level, being trained allows you to Treat Disease and Treat Poison

    • Skill feats --
      • Usually at even levels you choose a skill feat
      • Rogues get them every level
      • Prerequisite is a level of proficiency in a skill (e.g. "legendary in Medicine")
      • Example is the Legendary Medic, which lets you remove diseases and conditions.
      • Stealth has skill feats like Quiet Allies (help your party sneak), Swift Sneak (move at full speed while sneaking), and at legendary level you just sneak everywhere constantly.

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    Comments 67 Comments
    1. Baumi -
      I wonder what the difference between Arcana and Occultism is.
    1. Aldarc's Avatar
      Aldarc -
      Quote Originally Posted by Baumi View Post
      I wonder what the difference between Arcana and Occultism is.
      Possibly tied to their Occult Adventures book in PF1, but I also vaguely recall that it may have something to do with runes.

      My first reaction to the skill list was to groan when I saw that Performance is still there. It's mostly a bard-only skill was previously something of a skill tax. But who knows how Paizo will change things up for PF2 when it comes to this skill.
    1. Kramodlog's Avatar
      Kramodlog -
      Gaining skill feats is neat. It is what the game needs to let players excel in and out of combat. Didn't Mearl or Baker say that he loved some skill feat he created for essentials, it wasn't worth taking because combat feats were too good?
    1. Eltab's Avatar
      Eltab -
      I am guessing that "Society" is the old "Streetwise", renamed so it sounds appropriate when applied to a variety of levels of social class, not just 'petty criminals'?
    1. Ghal Maraz's Avatar
      Ghal Maraz -
      There ain't no "Streetwise" skill in 3.X.

      I guess it will have a function combining Knowledge (Local) and Knowledge (Nobility & Royalty), perhaps with a twist of Gather Information (that was consolidated into Diplomacy in PF1).

      Regarding Performance: we already know it's used as a Downtime activity to make a living out of it. Let's see whatever else it does.
    1. ddaley's Avatar
      ddaley -
      I don't care for level being a factor in skill calculations. I would prefer skill level having a larger impact on the skill use. Seems a bit odd that a level 4 character who is untrained in a skill would have the same bonus as a level 1 who is a master...
    1. Charlaquin's Avatar
      Charlaquin -
      It’s weird to me that Arcana, Occultism, and Society don’t fall under Lore. I could maybe see Arcana as a separate skill if it stands in for Use Magic Device as the “interact with magic stuff” skill instead od just the “know stuff about magic” skill. I don’t really like pickpocketing and lockpicking/trap disarming being lumped together under Thievery. I’d much rather have Sleight of Hand and Disable Device back. Otherwise I like this.
    1. Markn -
      Quote Originally Posted by Baumi View Post
      I wonder what the difference between Arcana and Occultism is.
      I believe there are 4 spell lists now. Arcane, Divine, Occultism and Primal. Presumably Occultism is for that list of spells (as in identification, etc).
    1. jmucchiello's Avatar
      jmucchiello -
      Quote Originally Posted by Markn View Post
      I believe there are 4 spell lists now. Arcane, Divine, Occultism and Primal. Presumably Occultism is for that list of spells (as in identification, etc).
      If this is true, shouldn't there be a Primal skill?
    1. Charlaquin's Avatar
      Charlaquin -
      Quote Originally Posted by jmucchiello View Post
      If this is true, shouldn't there be a Primal skill?
      Nature
    1. Koloth's Avatar
      Koloth -
      Another one that thinks char level shouldn't have such a large influence on proficiency rolls.

      If a 0 lvl character is a Trained Farmer, she has a prof modifier of 0. She decides the heck with farming and takes up adventuring. Five years later, she returns as a 20 lvl character having never farmed another minute. But now she has a Farming prof modifier of 20. Char lvl of 20 + Trained (0) = 20. She is now a much better farmer, at least at basic farming skills, then her sister who has spent the last five years farming. Don't see this is a believable system.
    1. jmucchiello's Avatar
      jmucchiello -
      Quote Originally Posted by Charlaquin View Post
      Nature
      Missed that. Thanks.
    1. PezlerPolychromatic's Avatar
      PezlerPolychromatic -
      What slightly confuses me is that being trained in Medicine allows you to Treat Disease, but the skill feat Legendary Medic allows you to remove it. Are they the same? Or is it that Treat Disease lets you alleviate the symptoms temporarily without getting rid of it permanently?
    1. lightblade's Avatar
      lightblade -
      Quote Originally Posted by PezlerPolychromatic View Post
      What slightly confuses me is that being trained in Medicine allows you to Treat Disease, but the skill feat Legendary Medic allows you to remove it. Are they the same? Or is it that Treat Disease lets you alleviate the symptoms temporarily without getting rid of it permanently?
      I suspect Treat Disease is the equivalent of providing long-term care: if you do it for the better part of a day (or more), you give those under your care a bonus to their daily saving throw versus the disease. Legendary Medic is more comparable to the Remove Disease spell, or perhaps getting a Paladin to Lay on Hands with the right Mercy.
    1. Yaarel -
      There is no ‘spot’, ‘listen’, or ‘perception’ skill?

      YAAAAAAAAY!

      Hurray.
    1. Yaarel -
      Instead of a perception bonus, if trying to perceive signs of an animal, then add the nature bonus. If trying to find someone is hiding, add the stealth bonus to the attempt to perceive.

      Similarly, if trying to discern if someone is telling the truth, add the deception bonus to the attempt to perceive.
    1. Yaarel -
      I wish they would combine arcana, religion, and occultism, into a single skill. Essentially it is various forms of magic and mysticism, including planar lore (including afterlife, faerie, and so on).

      Combine athletics and acrobatics, into a single skill called athletics. It defies reason to learn to jump and climb without also learning to fall, or tumble without jumping, or so on.

      Combine nature and survival, into a single skill called nature.

      It makes sense to apply a skill bonus to one or more ability checks, depending on how one is applying the knowledge, training, and experience.
    1. Staffan's Avatar
      Staffan -
      Quote Originally Posted by Yaarel View Post
      There is no ‘spot’, ‘listen’, or ‘perception’ skill?

      YAAAAAAAAY!

      Hurray.
      They mentioned in an earlier blog that since Perception was such a must-have skill, they just made it Trained for everyone.
    1. Yaarel -
      I think I would combine Performance and Craft into single skill, called ‘Art’. Any kind of check for esthetics or craftsmanship would add the art bonus. Likewise, art would be used to appraise the value of precious items, and so on.
    1. Yaarel -
      Quote Originally Posted by Staffan View Post
      They mentioned in an earlier blog that since Perception was such a must-have skill, they just made it Trained for everyone.
      Good enough.

      But better, is to represent someone with a ‘trained eye’ to notice and discern certain kinds of things.

      An alchemist will notice and recognize faint chemical smells, but might be oblivious to animal foot prints or to structural cracks in a supporting pillar.

      A covert operative who studies stealth is better able to detect someone else who is employing stealth.

      And so on.
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