My ranger owns a longbow with the frost magical ability.
When I use the manyshot feat, I would expect that the frost magical damage (1d6) is applied to both arrows, as they are both "ammunition", and both hit the target.
On the other hand, my DM says that, as I only throw 1 ToHit dice, the two arrows count as a single hit and the magical damage is applied only once.
My ranger owns a longbow with the frost magical ability.
When I use the manyshot feat, I would expect that the frost magical damage (1d6) is applied to both arrows, as they are both "ammunition", and both hit the target.
On the other hand, my DM says that, as I only throw 1 ToHit dice, the two arrows count as a single hit and the magical damage is applied only once.
Who is right?
Cheers
elleon
Only Rogues, Ninjas, Scouts and Rangers only get to add their bonuses once.
yes, apply bonus damage to each arrow except for sneak/skirmish/etc. damage.
On that subject: just re-read the 'special' of manyshot, which states the additional sneak attack damage is only applied to the 'first' arrow.
which arrow is that? (since you are supposed to fire multiple arrows at once.....)
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I have to disagree (being the GM mentioned in the original post). The manual is clear: "The weapon deals 1d6 points of damage on a successful hit". The weapon (not the ammunitions) provides the additional damage giving 1d6 on a successful hit. As with manyshots you hit once (namley you make only one attack roll) the additional damage is 1d6 bestowed upon any number of ammuntions you are firing.
A frost weapon deals an extra 1d6
points of cold damage on a successful hit. Bows, crossbows, and
slings so crafted bestow the cold energy upon their ammunition.
Note the second line.
Edit: and also welcome to enworld!
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Last edited by Herzog; 28th November 2008 at 01:44 PM..
I have to disagree (being the GM mentioned in the original post). The manual is clear: "The weapon deals 1d6 points of damage on a successful hit". The weapon (not the ammunitions) provides the additional damage giving 1d6 on a successful hit. As with manyshots you hit once (namley you make only one attack roll) the additional damage is 1d6 bestowed upon any number of ammuntions you are firing.
For a composite bow do you add the str bonus to damage for each arrow or only for each "hit"? How about the enhancement bonus?
From the FAQ
Quote:
When you use Manyshot, does your Strength bonus from a mighty composite bow apply to each arrow’s damage?
Yes, as would the enhancement bonus from a magic bow.
Oh and a ranger's favored enemy damage applies to each arrow - it is not considered precision damage.
Also from the FAQ
Quote:
If the ranger uses the Manyshot feat against a favored enemy, does the favored enemy damage bonus apply to all arrows fired in the attack?
Noted. The point is how much energy they bestow. I think it is 1d6 for every successful hit.
I get that the bow bestows the Frost magical ability to its ammunition, i.e. the two arrows. Each arrow then deals the 1d6 magical damage when it hits the target. The fact that the two arrows share the same ToHit roll to verify if they hit should have no influence on this mechanism...
@Umklapp: I'm beginning to see your point, although I'm not convinced yet.
@irdeggman: those damage bonusses are not appended with the quoted text from the DMG.
As I now see it, since the quoted text mentions bestowing 'the' cold energy to the ammunition, and 'the' amount of cold damage being specified applies to a successfull hit, the question becomes: what is a successfull hit?
Umklapp reasons that, since there is only one attack roll, there is only one successfull hit.
I think that, although only one attack roll is made, each arrow fired is a successfull hit.
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Last edited by Herzog; 28th November 2008 at 02:14 PM..
@Umklapp:
Umklapp reasons that, since there is only one attack roll, there is only one successfull hit.
I think that, although only one attack roll is made, each arrow fired is a successfull hit.
I could not have explained it better myself I associate hits with successful attack rolls and damages with damage rolls. I do not see many other ways to define hits (if you associate them with damages or "sources of damage" then things get complicated in case of regeneration, damage reduction, etc)
I get that the bow bestows the Frost magical ability to its ammunition, i.e. the two arrows. Each arrow then deals the 1d6 magical damage when it hits the target. The fact that the two arrows share the same ToHit roll to verify if they hit should have no influence on this mechanism...
elleon
The other possibility is that the bow add 1d6 to its projectiles every time IT hits and since there is only one attack roll... Besides, I would find odd if you could increase the magical power of your bow by using a feat that is neither magical nor related specifically to that bow
The other possibility is that the bow add 1d6 to its projectiles every time IT hits and since there is only one attack roll... Besides, I would find odd if you could increase the magical power of your bow by using a feat that is neither magical nor related specifically to that bow
On the other hand, if only 1d6 of damage is bestowed, on which of the two arrows would you bestow it? Only one of them (in this case, which one?) or would it be evenly spread over the two arrows?
This is relevant in case the target has the Deflect Arrows feat: the target would deflect one of the arrows and the other would hit. How much Frost damage would be dealt in this case?
On the other hand, if only 1d6 of damage is bestowed, on which of the two arrows would you bestow it? Only one of them (in this case, which one?) or would it be evenly spread over the two arrows?
This is relevant in case the target has the Deflect Arrows feat: the target would deflect one of the arrows and the other would hit. How much Frost damage would be dealt in this case?
Benefit: You must have at least one hand free (holding nothing) to use this feat. Once per round when you would normally be hit with a ranged weapon, you may deflect it so that you take no damage from it. You must be aware of the attack and not flatfooted. Attempting to deflect a ranged weapon doesn’t count as an action. Unusually massive ranged weapons and ranged attacks generated by spell effects can’t be deflected. Special: A monk may select Deflect Arrows as a bonus feat at 2nd level, even if she does not meet the prerequisites. A fighter may select Deflect Arrows as one of his fighter bonus feats.
If we are sticking with the "ONE HIT", Once per round when you would normally be hit with a ranged weapon. With DEFLECT ARROWS you can deflect both arrows.
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If we are sticking with the "ONE HIT", Once per round when you would normally be hit with a ranged weapon. With DEFLECT ARROWS you can deflect both arrows.
I have not considered this, but... why not? These are arrows that fly together and could be both deflected with just one action.
Well... since noone here would probably argue the point that against DR Manyshot salvos do count as several hits (otherwise no archer would ever have a problem again with DR monsters), I vote for +1d6 for every arrow.
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Well... since noone here would probably argue the point that against DR Manyshot salvos do count as several hits (otherwise no archer would ever have a problem again with DR monsters), I vote for +1d6 for every arrow.
DR and other resistances are explictly mentioned in Manyshot description as applying to each arrow. However, IMO, this vary fact supports my interpretation that otherwise the Manyshot salvo should be regarded as a single shot.
DR and other resistances are explictly mentioned in Manyshot description as applying to each arrow. However, IMO, this vary fact supports my interpretation that otherwise the Manyshot salvo should be regarded as a single shot.
How do you come to this conclusion? If each arrow counts as a different damaging force, how do you jutify something doing its bonus damage from an enhancement like Frost or Flaming only once for the volley?
If Manyshot is considered a single shot because of its one attack roll, no archer would bother with damage boosting enchantments. There goes a major source of damage, making it harder for the entire party.
what would you rule when the frost ability was placed on the arrows?
how about one arrow with frost, the other with flame?
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I associate hits with successful attack rolls and damages with damage rolls. I do not see many other ways to define hits (if you associate them with damages or "sources of damage" then things get complicated in case of regeneration, damage reduction, etc)
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