Can a wizard use Alacritous Cogitation to cast a metamagicked spell, assuming he has the appropriate metamagic feat? For example, could he cast a silent grease using an open 2nd-level slot, or a substituted (lightning) fireball using a 3rd-level slot?
I like the flexibility of the Alacritous Cogitation feat for my wizard, but the 1/day limitation is a concern. If I could also use it to spontaneously apply metamagic, that would probably put it over the top for me.
__________________ "You're human?"
"Barely. I'm a lawyer."
Of course, it's worth it just for the little issue that it can turn 1-round casting times (such as the Summon line, Enlarge Person, or Sleep) into a full-round action at no particular additional cost ... at level 1 (the Errata prevents it from functioning this way on anything with a casting time of longer than 1 round). The distinction? With a 1-round casting time, you're vulnerable to disruption when someone else's turn comes around, and the spell doesn't take effect until your next turn. With a full-round action, it takes effect the same round you begin casting, and you're not subject to being disrupted by someone's normal turn.
__________________ Of course, by the time I finish this post, it will already be obsolete. C'est la vie.
Let's try this a different way: does anyone think it would be a bad idea to permit the application of metamagic to spells spontaneously cast with the Alacritous Cogitation feat?
__________________ "You're human?"
"Barely. I'm a lawyer."
Well, if you can cast a spell spontaneously, you can spontaneously apply metamagic to it. That's the general rule.
It works for spontaneous casters, like the Sorcerer, and for spells cast spontaneously by a prepared caster, like the Cleric casting cure/inflict spells or the Druid summoning nature's allies.
Don't see why this should be any different.
The casting time reduction (for some spells with really long casting times, like hours) could potentially be pretty crazy, BTW.
Bye
Thanee
__________________
In our world, immortality is not for the living. The legend lives on!
In Memoriam Dave Arneson ( April 7th, 2009) & Gary Gygax ( March 4th, 2008).
Wondering what the Dungeon Tiles are like? Take a look here (up to DU5 Sinister Woods).
The casting time reduction (for some spells with really long casting times, like hours) could potentially be pretty crazy, BTW.
That loophole was mostly Errata'd out; no Planar Binding with 1 full-round action anymore, sorry. You can do it with 1 round spells like Summon Monster, Sleep, or Enlarge Person, but that's the limit.
__________________ Of course, by the time I finish this post, it will already be obsolete. C'est la vie.
I like the flexibility of the Alacritous Cogitation feat for my wizard, but the 1/day limitation is a concern. If I could also use it to spontaneously apply metamagic, that would probably put it over the top for me.
I would guess that Alacritous Cogitation is less useful for narrowly defined wizards, and usually I, too, would turn my nose up at a 1/day feat or ability, but I really do love Alacritous Cogitation+Collegiate Wizard for my utility-focused wizard. And even when I have reason/need to prepare a narrow selection of spells, I still have the rest of my relatively bulky spell book to call upon when the unexpected comes up and I need a particular spell right now, which does seem to happen often....
__________________ It's times like this I wish I had 500 foot bottle of tequila.
Have you considered Alacritous Cogitation + Heighten Spell + Reserve Feats?
Since you can (potentially) cast any spell you know using the slot, you can empower all Reserve Feats you have with it.
The Heighten Spell is, of course, to lift your spells to the level you have the open spell slot.
Additionally, if you are an elf and use the Generic Wizard racial substitution option, you always have an extra spell slot at your highest castable level which you can use for this.
__________________ If you, at any time, downloaded a conversion from the conversion library, would you be so kind as to upload it? The conversion library seems to be gone forever, and rather than waiting for recovery, or new creations, we would like to try to recollect earlier work. Thank you: Attempt to rebuild the conversion library. Please upload conversions to 3.5 here.
I would guess that Alacritous Cogitation is less useful for narrowly defined wizards, and usually I, too, would turn my nose up at a 1/day feat or ability, but I really do love Alacritous Cogitation+Collegiate Wizard for my utility-focused wizard. And even when I have reason/need to prepare a narrow selection of spells, I still have the rest of my relatively bulky spell book to call upon when the unexpected comes up and I need a particular spell right now, which does seem to happen often....
Exactly - my Wiz5 is an academic with the Collegiate Wizard feat who spends most of her cash on adding to her spellbook.
We're also using the Action Point mechanic for recovering spells just cast, so that + Alacritous Cogitation can give her several castings of a spell she didn't prepare. Great for, e.g., counterpelling a sorcerer who would otherwise be throwing multiple fireballs at the party.
__________________ "You're human?"
"Barely. I'm a lawyer."
Have you considered Alacritous Cogitation + Heighten Spell + Reserve Feats?
Since you can (potentially) cast any spell you know using the slot, you can empower all Reserve Feats you have with it.
The Heighten Spell is, of course, to lift your spells to the level you have the open spell slot.
That's only works if your DM doesn't read the Complete Mage Reserve Feat Header closely.
See, it seperates out the requirements - "A spellcaster who prepares spells each day (such as a wizard) must have an appropriate spell prepared and not yet cast" (Complete Mage, page 37). For "A spellcaster who does not need to prepare spells (such as a sorcerer) must know an appropriate spell and must have at least one unused spell slot of that spell's level or higher"
Now, while this may technically let Alacritous Cogitation work (you don't strictly need to prepare spells, as you can cast spontaneously... once per day...), Heighten Spell doesn't work with it - when you have heighten spell, you don't technically know that spell at that level, you have a means by which to cast that spell at that level.
__________________ Of course, by the time I finish this post, it will already be obsolete. C'est la vie.
Now, while this may technically let Alacritous Cogitation work (you don't strictly need to prepare spells, as you can cast spontaneously... once per day...), ...
That would be a bit too far-fetched...
The distinction is clearly between caster types and a Wizard with Alacritous Cogitation is still a Wizard and as such still a spellcaster who prepares spells each day and a Sorcerer with Arcane Preparation is still a spellcaster who does not need to prepare spells (even though he can ).
Bye
Thanee
__________________
In our world, immortality is not for the living. The legend lives on!
In Memoriam Dave Arneson ( April 7th, 2009) & Gary Gygax ( March 4th, 2008).
Wondering what the Dungeon Tiles are like? Take a look here (up to DU5 Sinister Woods).
The distinction is clearly between caster types and a Wizard with Alacritous Cogitation is still a Wizard and as such still a spellcaster who prepares spells each day and a Sorcerer with Arcane Preparation is still a spellcaster who does not need to prepare spells (even though he can ).
Bye
Thanee
Well, yes, but either way, it's not particularly broken, and most DM's will let the Arcane Preparation bit fly (hey, you're burning two or three feats to do something very minor... and you don't get bonus feats) - about the only reserve feats that are actually worth the action in a battle are Minor Shapeshift (swift-action temp HP - very handy) and Dimensional Jaunt (standard action get-out-of-grapple cheap card). The others, while flavorful, are only useful in fairly specialized circumstances (if you want to play a different type of trapfinder, mostly; but also in the army of mooks scenario, and there's also an evil healer build that makes use of Summon Elemental).
__________________ Of course, by the time I finish this post, it will already be obsolete. C'est la vie.
@Thanee:
A Wizard with Alacritous Cogitation is a spellcaster who prepares spells each day AND casts spontaneously from a list of spells known.
A Sorcerer with Arcane Preparation is a spellcaster who casts spontaneously from a list of spells known AND prepares spells each day.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Mage p.37
The primary benefit can only be activated if the caster has a spell of an appropriate variety (of a particular school, subschool, or descriptor) available to cast. The definition of "available to cast" depends on whether the character prepares spells or casts spontaneously from a list of spells known.
The wizard and sorcerer have been picked out in the text following this quote as examples. Adding Alacritous Cogitation or Arcane Preparation to these classes changes the way these classes work, which means they no longer 'match' the examples given.
@Jack Simth:
I hadn't read the text this closely before, and I'll go as far as admit your interpretation is probably correct.
As a DM, I would still allow it, since it hardly seems overpowered (you still need to keep the slot uncast), but also because of the reading of Heighten Spell:
Quote:
Heighten Spell actually increases the effective level of the spell that it modifies.
Since you are able to cast a spell of the appropriate level using Heighten Spell, i would qualify that as 'available to cast'.
__________________ If you, at any time, downloaded a conversion from the conversion library, would you be so kind as to upload it? The conversion library seems to be gone forever, and rather than waiting for recovery, or new creations, we would like to try to recollect earlier work. Thank you: Attempt to rebuild the conversion library. Please upload conversions to 3.5 here.
As said above, the distinction is clearly between the primary casting method.
The feats are irrelevant for that distinction, IMHO.
It's different to, say, a prestige class requirement of "able to prepare spells" (which Arcane Preparation fulfills).
Besides, the wording for the spontaneous casters is "does not need to prepare spells" (and Alacritous Cogitation does not change that at all), which certainly is also true for every prepared caster, if you want to read it that way, as noone forces them to prepare their spells. You could also say, that the Wizard does not qualify for "prepares spells each day", as soon as there is one day, during which the Wizard did not prepare spells in his life.
But I guess you know what I mean.
Bye
Thanee
__________________
In our world, immortality is not for the living. The legend lives on!
In Memoriam Dave Arneson ( April 7th, 2009) & Gary Gygax ( March 4th, 2008).
Wondering what the Dungeon Tiles are like? Take a look here (up to DU5 Sinister Woods).
are they even able to use reserve feats?
if so, how are they supposed to be doing that?
can they use both methods?
As you say, the strictest interpretation of the text would mean none of the text applies, or leads to no one actually being able to use reserve feats
My conclusion from that is that there should be some leeway in interpreting these rules, and I guess my interpretation is less strict then yours.
__________________ If you, at any time, downloaded a conversion from the conversion library, would you be so kind as to upload it? The conversion library seems to be gone forever, and rather than waiting for recovery, or new creations, we would like to try to recollect earlier work. Thank you: Attempt to rebuild the conversion library. Please upload conversions to 3.5 here.
Linear Mode
And yet another word from our sponsors
