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Out of curiosity, what's wrong with their site. Note, I'm not talking about Gleemax, that's a different issue. But, the D&D site is pretty easy to navigate and read. I've never had a problem with that site. What are these huge issues you are worried about?
This is just one example that got a pretty decent thread going.
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Brain: The same thing we do every night....TRY TO TAKE OVER THE WORLD!
The copyright expires (under current law, the 4e preview articles will expire in 2128).
I know I'm looking forward to it! Unfortunately, all the characters and playtesters mentioned will be continuously trademarked, making it impossible to the article in anything other than a scholastic context.
No, that's how the site could be better. I didn't say that it was perfect. I was just questioning these massive problems that people are talking about.
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No, that's how the site could be better. I didn't say that it was perfect. I was just questioning these massive problems that people are talking about.
You seriously don't have any problems with the site? I'm forever at a loss trying to find any article that's fallen off the front page. My brain hurts just looking at the front page.
You seriously don't have any problems with the site? I'm forever at a loss trying to find any article that's fallen off the front page. My brain hurts just looking at the front page.
/derail
I agree it's pretty bad and it's a shame that we won't be able to read articles here on EnWorld. I'll miss reading the stuff, but not enough to deal with the awful D&D home page.
I actually haven't bothered reading an article on the Wizards site for weeks for that very reason. It's completely atrocious and the "payout" for finding the stuff isn't worth the hassle.
I agree it's pretty bad and it's a shame that we won't be able to read articles here on EnWorld. I'll miss reading the stuff, but not enough to deal with the awful D&D home page.
I actually haven't bothered reading an article on the Wizards site for weeks for that very reason. It's completely atrocious and the "payout" for finding the stuff isn't worth the hassle.
You don't have to "find" it, you merely need to follow a link from here directly to it. It's one extra click.
This reminds me of a work story someone has told me:
One our key account manageners had checked out the newest version of our application.
Later, he asked one of the developers on a feature:
"I can't seem to open the new online photo search feature. When I click on the button, nothing happens?"
"Huh? That can't be, it's working fine here." (That's what developers always say). "Let's check it out."
Developers starts program, clicks, button, everything works.
"Strange. What did you do exactly?"
"Well, I moved the mouse cursor on the button, and then left-clicked it"
"Left-click? I thought I had to do a right-click?!"
"???" We might be ignoring some standards (no menu bar, since not desired by management), but switching all button interaction from left to right-click would be going a bit too far, wouldn't it?
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The easiest way to kep up with the car crash that is the Wizard's site is to subscribe to their RSS feed. That way you can actually see what's new, as opposed to digging around through counter-intuitive menus for ages.
The easiest way to kep up with the car crash that is the Wizard's site is to subscribe to their RSS feed. That way you can actually see what's new, as opposed to digging around through counter-intuitive menus for ages.
car crash? your being awfully nice. that site (especially the "new" gleemax forums) seem to have an uptime percentage just over 20%... its atrocious. Probably the worst web offering of any major company I have yet to run across.
I have noticed some WotC articles actually change in content over time, especially preview type articles such as the 4e stuff - some FR articles come to mind. If they were cut and pasted, the copies would no longer be current, or an accurate reflection of the product. Granted there is some value in the archived version - like the "wayback" machine philosophy, but it gets messy if people are discussing the content of an article and the details are different.
When a company publishes an article on the internet and allows it to be viewed, for free, by anyone who bothers to tack an "authenticate=True" condition on the end of the address, can they really claim they didn't release it into the public domain?
If there's a copyright notice attached, then by definition, yes; it has not been released to the public domain.
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It should be turned off by default, but when turned on, you no longer see any news item or article that essentially is a link into DDI with no intrinsic value for non-subscribers.
I would hate for ENWorld to become a site peddling Wizard's pay-to-use initiatives. Which it would, if you continuously stumble over links taking you to "sign up to enjoy this content" messages.
It should be turned off by default, but when turned on, you no longer see any news item or article that essentially is a link into DDI with no intrinsic value for non-subscribers.
I would hate for ENWorld to become a site peddling Wizard's pay-to-use initiatives. Which it would, if you continuously stumble over links taking you to "sign up to enjoy this content" messages.
The news page already marks items that require DDI content.
And do you also need a filter to filter out references to books you don't have and don't want to buy either?
Thoughts of the Arch Chancellor - My weblog on EN World - containing game related material, like: house rules, design theories, reviews, play reports, adventure ideas
Secret Member of <Think we would just hide our secret with a spoiler tag, eh?>
It should be turned off by default, but when turned on, you no longer see any news item or article that essentially is a link into DDI with no intrinsic value for non-subscribers.
I would hate for ENWorld to become a site peddling Wizard's pay-to-use initiatives. Which it would, if you continuously stumble over links taking you to "sign up to enjoy this content" messages.
I really can't see any reason why this would be needed, any more than a filter that somehow works out what books you do or don't have is needed.
If you're not a DDI subscriber, you can't see everything. Same as if you don't purchase a book. ENWorld is not peddling WotC's pay-to-use initiative - they're simply very popular because many people on the site use it and think it's a good thing.
Thanks for completely and intentionally not seeing my point. Sheesh.
In poker terms, I'd say you're right. They didn't "see" your point. They "raised" it. If "Sheesh" is a fold, then the hand may be over.
I'm as sensitive as anybody I know to ubiquitous advertising, but the DDI updates are as relevant as any other commercial product that gets touted on the main page. That's the point of that site component: updates from publishers touting their latest wares.
I came here to voice an opinion: that if ENWorld doesn't take action, it will probably become unbearable to use without a DDI subscription. That's not a game or something to be taken flippantly.
This filter would be relatively simple to implement. As a bonus, it would considerably reduce the power of WotC's marketing scheme for 4E (I'm not the only one who avoids Wizards' own site).
The bottom line is that DDI will make up a large part of the news items from the by-far biggest manufacturer in the business that ENWorld is in. By reproducing news that more-or-less consist of nothing but a link that slaps up a "subscribe now" dialog in your face, ENWorld will actively promote DDI regardless of what you say.
And become considerably less useful in the process. This would be a shame, considering how easy it would be to implement a solution.
Not taking a stand is taking a stand too, you know.
Edit: Let's discuss Google News. When that free service started out, a considerable number of links led to subscription-only news sites. This was clearly very unpopular. After some time they (Google) added a small note to each such link, saying it required a subscription. Eventually, however, consumer choice culled away most subscription sites naturally - it still happens once in a while, but it's now sufficiently rare I can use the site not thinking about it.
In the case of ENWorld, there aren't several hundred more-or-less identical sources to link to. Only one. So ENWorld needs to be much more proactive than Google had to be.
A filter saying "don't show items with links to subscription sites" would be great. Much better and much simpler than some message that you'd easily miss anyway.
Last edited by CapnZapp; 12th December 2008 at 01:24 PM..
Reason: Added Google News comparison
I came here to voice an opinion: that if ENWorld doesn't take action, it will probably become unbearable to use without a DDI subscription. That's not a game or something to be taken flippantly.
I think you might be over-reacting. Unbearable?
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As a bonus, it would considerably reduce the power of WotC's marketing scheme for 4E (I'm not the only one who avoids Wizards' own site).
Why should ENWorld actively work to reduce the efficiency of ANY companies marketing effort? Is it really US against THEM?
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Not taking a stand is taking a stand too, you know.
It's cool. You have a greater opportunity to express your feelings about the community than consumer/fans have ever had in the past. Good times.
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Let's discuss Google News....
Google news is an international news aggregation site. The "product" is free information. Woot! I agree it is awesome.
ENWorld is a fan and advertiser subsidised D&D community site about a given (family of) commercial product(s). Product releases are going to be added perpetually to the home page. DDI updates are product releases.
If you aren't interested in the product, you don't click on the link, right? YOU are the best filter you've got.
It should be turned off by default, but when turned on, you no longer see any news item or article that essentially is a link into DDI with no intrinsic value for non-subscribers.
I would hate for ENWorld to become a site peddling Wizard's pay-to-use initiatives. Which it would, if you continuously stumble over links taking you to "sign up to enjoy this content" messages.
You might get a better audience with your request by making a new thread in the meta forum with this and stating your case there.
Having said that, i don't think it is a terrible idea (some may find it useful and/or helpful), but at the same time i don't agree that it is necessarily needed if it takes a lot of effort to implement or more server load). But no reason you can't make your case and request it to the people whose opinion actually matters (i.e. my opinion doesn't matter )
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A filter saying "don't show items with links to subscription sites" would be great. Much better and much simpler than some message that you'd easily miss anyway.
This is unlikely to happen. As an alternative, you'll probably want to avoid any ddi-related Wizards links.
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