Swordmages and half-orcs hit the streets!

[ascendance]

I think we now know why the Githyanki have +2 Con and +2 Int - those are clearly the prime requisites for the Swordmage class, and Githyanki are going to by far make the best Swordmages.

[Atlatl Jones]

Originally Posted by Wish

Higher levels, figure 14 (plate) +6 (enhancement) + 2 shield for 22 AC and 2 Reflex for the paladin. 5 (hide) + 6 (enhancement) + 8 (Int) + 8 (shield) for 27 AC.

That's pretty marginal at first level, decent at high level (I'm assuming a Demigod for the stat boost for the swordmage), but still only 3 better in total defense for the swordmage, even with the Demigod boost.

A character who started with an 18 Int can have a +8 Int bonus at 28th level even without the demigod bonus. A character who starts with an Int of 20 and has the demigod destiny can have an Int bonus of +10 by 28th level. That would give your example a 31 AC bonus, which is just plain broken.

I'm amazed that they would double the Int bonus instead of just giving a set bonus. Doubling a stat bonus cannot help but mess with the underlying math, dramatically altering the expected progression of AC values. I wouldn't be at all surprised if, in the final version, it's something like a straight +4 bonus.

[Khaim]

Originally Posted by Atlatl Jones

I'm amazed that they would double the Int bonus instead of just giving a set bonus. Doubling a stat bonus cannot help but mess with the underlying math, dramatically altering the expected progression of AC values. I wouldn't be at all surprised if, in the final version, it's something like a straight +4 bonus.

That's still really good, unless it totally replaces armor. See, Dex/Int heavy characters in Hide are roughly equal to guys in Plate. If you max out Dex or Int as much as is possible, the light armor actually exceeds Plate anyways. Giving them a +4 bonus on top of that is just sick. By the way, the classes with Dex or Int as their attack stats are naturally good because of this- the same stat controls both their attack and defense, so they get lots of utility out of it.

[Rechan]

Considering how messed up the pregens have been out of WotC, I woudln't be surprised if it's riddled with errors.

[Otterscrubber]

Originally Posted by Dm_from_Brazil

I just received the RPGA adventure "Return to the Moathouse" (by Mike Mearls), which I ´m going to DM at a local event... and there IS playable SWORDMAGE character, AND a half-orc NPC...
< Ok, the half-orc NPC is useless, as a fountain of information, as it is also a "half-elemental" creature, and don´t have no identifiable "orkish" features - but still, it means that they don´t totally give up in the half-orc race "because it implies a very bad backstory" >

Anyway, here are the SWORDMAGE powers (it´s a 5th level character):

At-Will Powers:



Sword Burst
Swordmage Attack 1
A sweep of your sword blasts those around you with force.
At-Will ✦ Arcane, Force, Implement
Standard Action Close burst 1
Target: Each enemy in burst
Attack: +6 vs. Reflex
Hit: 1d6 + 4 force damage.

Interesting, they get an at-will power equal to a ranger encounter (Dire Wolverine) power, and it is against Reflex and not AC. That hardly seems fair. I hope this is not the first of many broken splat powers to come.....or that I am reading this wrong.

[Zsig]

Originally Posted by Otterscrubber

Interesting, they get an at-will power equal to a ranger encounter (Dire Wolverine) power, and it is against Reflex and not AC. That hardly seems fair. I hope this is not the first of many broken splat powers to come.....or that I am reading this wrong.

It has the Implement keyword, and not Weapon keyword.

Which means, you don't get to add prof. bonus to attack, that justifies the "vs Reflex".

If it's broken? I have no idea.

All I know is that when I first heard about Swordmages I didn't give a damn... now all of a sudden, I want to play one.

[small pumpkin man]

Aegis of Shielding
Swordmage Feature
You create an arcane link between you and a foe, allowing you to instantly
respond to its attacks with a counterassault.
At-Will ✦ Arcane, Teleportation

This is, well, wierd. Do you teleport over there, half block the strike and teleport back? Do you teleport your weapon? I guess my question is, why does it have the teleportation keyword? Why doesn't it just themed tie the target up with webbing or thunder which hinders it's strikes/magic?

If it actually teleported you next to the the target, that would be cool, but it doesn't seem to, so I don't understand why it has the teleportation keyword. Not a big deal, just strange.

Originally Posted by Otterscrubber

Interesting, they get an at-will power equal to a ranger encounter (Dire Wolverine) power, and it is against Reflex and not AC. That hardly seems fair. I hope this is not the first of many broken splat powers to come.....or that I am reading this wrong.

It's not "equal", as it does two or three points less damage, and the targeting reflex is offset by the implement keyword. It does seem to be pushing the power level of non-controller at-wills, allthough I would call it "power creep" more than outright broken.

[bjorn2bwild]

Originally Posted by Otterscrubber

Interesting, they get an at-will power equal to a ranger encounter (Dire Wolverine) power, and it is against Reflex and not AC. That hardly seems fair. I hope this is not the first of many broken splat powers to come.....or that I am reading this wrong.

Well it's an implement power, not a weapon power, so in order to use it effectively at later levels, the swordmage is going to have expend a bunch of actions that round or lose that extra AC bonus everyone keeps talking about (requires a free hand). --this is assuming that swordmages can't use thier swords as implements.

As far as we know, It's less damage than Dire Wolverine could be (1d4 vs 1[w]).

And, um, if you don't like this one what are your thoughts on Thunderwave-- the wizard at-will that does more damage to a potentially larger amount of targets AND pushes bad guys away?

edit--ninja'd!

[Zsig]

Originally Posted by small pumpkin man

This is, well, wierd. Do you teleport over there, half block the strike and teleport back? Do you teleport your weapon? I guess my question is, why does it have the teleportation keyword? Why doesn't it just themed tie the target up with webbing or thunder which hinders it's strikes/magic?

If it actually teleported you next to the the target, that would be cool, but it doesn't seem to, so I don't understand why it has the teleportation keyword. Not a big deal, just strange.

Who said you don't Teleport? For all it's worth it could be you teleport next to ally to intercept foe's attack and then quickly teleports back to origin so fast that no one would even notice!

Now, to be completely honest, I don't get the Teleport keyword either...

[Otterscrubber]

Originally Posted by bjorn2bwild

And, um, if you don't like this one what are your thoughts on Thunderwave-- the wizard at-will that does more damage to a potentially larger amount of targets AND pushes bad guys away?

edit--ninja'd!

Well, thunderweave has its drawbacks in that once your melee fighters engage opponents you may not want them to be pushed as it will mess up flanking and whatnot. We've only used it once in an adventure after our wizard leveled up and decided to take it, and when he used it he messed up a lot of positioning and made the fight a lot tougher for us actually. Monsters I've noticed seem to have all sorts of cool shifting abilities. But like I said that was just one instance, can't claim to have used it enough to be sure of its usefulness.

[small pumpkin man]

Originally Posted by Otterscrubber

Well, thunderweave has its drawbacks in that once your melee fighters engage opponents you may not want them to be pushed as it will mess up flanking and whatnot. We've only used it once in an adventure after our wizard leveled up and decided to take it, and when he used it he messed up a lot of positioning and made the fight a lot tougher for us actually. Monsters I've noticed seem to have all sorts of cool shifting abilities. But like I said that was just one instance, can't claim to have used it enough to be sure of its usefulness.

You don't have to push people with thunderwave(or any other power) if you don't want to, or you can push them, but less than the maximum amount if you want.

The only response to "thunderwave is better than Dire Wolverine" I have is that area effects are a controllers "schtik", so the Ranger is giving up damage to get some controller abilities.

That and Dire Wolverine Strike just isn't very good. The only time it does more damage than Two Fanged Strike is when you're surrounded by three or more creatures, and unless they're minions, Evasive Strike is probably better in that situation anyway. (and if they ARE minions, I'd most often not want to waste my encounter power on them because twin strike and an at will blast from an actual controller works better anyway)

[catsclaw227]

Here's the blurb about the adventure on Wizard's website:

[Black Flame Zealot]

I created the character. It was based on a miniature from the upcoming Against the Giants set (it's a cool-looking dwarf in light armor with a longsword; he's technically not a swordmage, but he certainly looks the part).

I'm 99% certain that the swordmage's bonuses are all correct based on the document I had when I created him. I did a couple of playtests with the characters, had a couple folks in the office look at them, and did 3 cross-checks to make sure the bonuses were right.

I'm surprised no one's found the other new information yet on the character sheets...

[Black Flame Zealot]

Originally Posted by catsclaw227

Here's the blurb about the adventure on Wizard's website:

Note that this is a stand-alone adventure, so if you have a group with RPGA numbers, you can order it and test it out. Mike also wrote it for us, and it's playing here at Origins right now. Tons 'o fun with a surprise ending.

[Rechan]

Originally Posted by Black Flame Zealot

I'm 99% certain that the swordmage's bonuses are all correct based on the document I had when I created him. I did a couple of playtests with the characters, had a couple folks in the office look at them, and did 3 cross-checks to make sure the bonuses were right.

I'm surprised no one's found the other new information yet on the character sheets...

So then can you explain the AC wackiness?

I do however appreciate your diligence in making sure the numbers are right.

[Old Gumphrey]

And the negating of almost 10 damage any time a specific monster attacks?

[Black Flame Zealot]

I really don't want to go into calculations used for the final numbers at this point. Suffice to say, I know the AC and damage negation are correct from the copy that I possess.

[Cryptos]

Originally Posted by Dm_from_Brazil

At-Will Powers:

Aegis of Shielding
Swordmage Feature
You create an arcane link between you and a foe, allowing you to instantly
respond to its attacks with a counterassault.
At-Will ✦ Arcane, Teleportation
Minor Action Close burst 2
Target: One creature in burst
Effect: You mark the target. The target remains marked until you use
this power against another target. If you mark other creatures using
other powers, the target is still marked. A creature can be subject to
only one mark at a time. A new mark supersedes a mark that was
already in place.
If your marked target makes an attack that doesn’t include you
as a target, it takes a ---2 penalty to attack rolls. If that attack hits and the attacker is within 10 squares of you, you can use an immediate
interrupt to reduce the damage dealt by that attack to any one
creature by 9 points.

I don't get why this has the Teleportation keyword.

1) Target is marked. Standard fine print on the mark.
2) If target attacks someone else, -2 to attack rolls. Standard defendery effect.
3) If it does attack and hits, you reduce the damage dealt by the marked target's attack by X damage.

Did I miss a teleportation effect somewhere?

[epochrpg]

Originally Posted by Cryptos

I don't get why this has the Teleportation keyword.

1) Target is marked. Standard fine print on the mark.
2) If target attacks someone else, -2 to attack rolls. Standard defendery effect.
3) If it does attack and hits, you reduce the damage dealt by the marked target's attack by X damage.

Did I miss a teleportation effect somewhere?

yes, you teleport in front of them, parry the attack, and teleport back to your space.

[the_redbeard]

Originally Posted by lostpike

and from what i am seeing Wizard of the Spiral Tower seems like it will work well with this!

Race: Githyanki as folks have pointed out.

Class: Infernal Warlock - multi-classing to Swordmage.

I'm thinking that the Warlock's temp hit points and cursing with whatever the swordmage MC ability is, and a few of the sword mage defender powers could be a nice combo.

Use your pact blade as your implement. Your cursed opponent gets damaged from the plus and your curse when he attacks you.

Infernal warlock has nifty powers that provoke damage when attacked. Could be good. Con and Int are primaries - looks similar here.

Have to spend some feats on getting armor.

Stats something like:

Str: 12
Con: 16+2=18
Dex: 8
Int: 16+2=18
Wis: 12
Cha: 10

Or, if you want to get the Blade Opportunists feats (serious MAD to do so):
(starting stats only)
Str: 14
Con: 15+2=17
Dex: 13
Int: 15+2=17
Wis: 10
Cha: 8

Will defense sucks, and perception sucks. But you're all the deadlier up close because you'll have more effective opportunity attacks.