Martial Power and Races: Dragonborn and Tieflings

[thecasualoblivion]

Dragonborn

Paragon Paths

Inner Dragon(Fighter)--Breath Weapon Machine!!! Action Point also triggers Dragon Breath, get +2 to attacks when bloodied, and Dragon Breath deals ongoing damage. You get another Breath Weapon attack as an encounter(and this one blinds), you get a nasty defensive daily utility, and a Daily stance that deals Con mod elemental damage on each hit. I think this is actually pretty good, as Breath Weapons have great synergy with the Fighter class.

Feats: Fighter--boost to Invigorating powers and a sweet Paragon feat

(Heroic)Bloodied Invigoration--Get +2 temp hp from invigorating while bloodied. I haven't decided how much I like Invigorating yet.
(Heroic)Bracing Breath--Get +1 to attack with Invigorating after Dragon Breath. See above.
(Paragon)Draconic Arrogance--Deal extra damage equal to Str mod when you push or knock prone. This is nice.

Feats: Ranger--Meh

(Heroic)Breath Resistant Beast--Beast companion gains resistance to your Breath Weapon type. Meh.

Feats: Rogue--Meh

(Heroic)Brutal Teamwork--Gain +2 damage when adjacent to ally. Probably better feats to take.

Feats: Warlord--One feat you'll probably take...

(Heroic)Bravura Spirit--Allies get +2 to attack or move with Bravura Presence. Worth taking.
(Paragon)Bloody Inspiration--When you use Inspiring Word while bloodied on a target that isn't you, give another ally Temp HP equal to 2x Con mod. Situational.

Feats: Any Martial Class--More Breath Weapon fun!

(Paragon)Dragonbreath Warrior--After you Dragon Breath, your next melee weapon attack deals an extra 1[W]. Use big weapons and this is solid.
(Epic)Dragon Warrior--Regain Dragon Breath when first bloodied. If you're specializing in Breath Weapon, you want this.



Tieflings

Paragon Paths

Tiefling Warfiend(Fighter)--Regain Infernal Wrath w/ Action point, marked enemies who don't attack you take fire damage, combat challenge attacks and opportunity attacks deal extra fire. Solid but unremarkable powers. An ok, unspectacular Paragon Path.

Hellborn Shadow(Ranger)--Gain temp HP when you kill Quarry, Spend AP to deal hunter's quarry damage directly(fire), hitting Quarry removes fire resistance. Attacks are above average, and utility is encounter Flight. This PP is very specific, but it could work, though Tieflings ill suited to Ranger class.

Tiefling Hellstalker(Rogue)--defense boost when concealed, spend action point to gain concealment, infernal wrath grants combat advantage. Encounter and Daily attacks both make you invisible, and daily utility gives you long duration darkvision and see invisible. This lacks in raw power, but looks like a blast to play. Possibly the best ranged Rogue possible.


Feats: Fighter--Tiefling Fighter gets candy!

(Heroic)Lingering Wrath--Infernal Wrath bonuses last until target is no longer marked. Its worth being a Tiefling Fighter just for this.
(Paragon)Fiendish Defender--You can use Infernal Wrath against a marked enemy who just hit an ally. Situational, and probably better things to do with your feat.

Feats: Ranger--Not the best Race/Class mix.

(Heroic)Fiendish Companion--Beast companion gains fire resistance. Meh.
(Paragon)Wrathful Hunter--Infernal Wrath against Quarry gets +3 attack instead of +1. If for some reason you are a Tiefling Ranger, you should take this.

Feats: Rogue--These are decent, if unspectacular feats.

(Heroic)Cunning Ambusher--Infernal wrath while having combat advantage adds Intelligence to attack/damage. This is worth 14 Intelligence, and not a bad feat to take.
(Paragon)Infernal Sneak Attack--Sneak attack plus Infernal Wrath deals an extra die of Sneak attack. This is ok, but you might not have an extra feat.

Feats: Warlord--Tiefling Warlord deserves more than one feat...

(Heroic)Unbalancing Wrath--Infernal Wrath also gives your allies combat advantage. You want this.

Feats: Any Martial

(Epic)Infernal Warrior--Respond to critical hit with Infernal Wrath as a free action, even if already expended. Ok, not spectacular.

[James McMurray]

Originally Posted by thecasualoblivion

(Heroic)Lingering Wrath--Infernal Wrath bonuses last until target is no longer marked. Its worth being a Tiefling Fighter just for this.

Would this give a Tiefling Fighter / Paladin an encounter long Wrath when he marks them? Or (to make it harder for the Challenge to leave) a ranger / paladin?

[thecasualoblivion]

Originally Posted by James McMurray

Would this give a Tiefling Fighter / Paladin an encounter long Wrath when he marks them? Or (to make it harder for the Challenge to leave) a ranger / paladin?

Its a Fighter specific feat, so a Ranger/Paladin couldn't do it. A Tiefling Fighter/Paladin who uses Divine Challenge would have an encounter long challenge, as would a Fighter as long as he can attack the same target every turn.

[Cadfan]

Originally Posted by thecasualoblivion

(Paragon)Draconic Arrogance--Deal extra damage equal to Str mod when you push or knock prone. This is nice.

Its more than nice. My gut instinct is that its too good. It gives you a Tide of Iron of 1[W]+2[Strength]. Its +5 damage to Tide of Iron when you get it, and it just goes up from there.

(Heroic)Breath Resistant Beast--Beast companion gains resistance to your Breath Weapon type. Meh.

Is the resistance high enough that you can safely use your breath weapon over top of your animal companion? If so, its worth taking. Workmanlike, perhaps, but I'd definitely want it.

(Epic)Infernal Warrior--Respond to critical hit with Infernal Wrath as a free action, even if already expended. Ok, not spectacular.

Wait, do you get to activate Infernal Wrath as a free action? Or do you get to actually make an attack as a free action? I'd probably pass on this.

[thecasualoblivion]

Originally Posted by Cadfan

Its more than nice. My gut instinct is that its too good. It gives you a Tide of Iron of 1[W]+2[Strength]. Its +5 damage to Tide of Iron when you get it, and it just goes up from there.

I think I have to agree here. This is stupid good, as in you plan your whole career around using a shield and take this feat at level 11, and you don't even consider alternatives.

Originally Posted by Cadfan

Is the resistance high enough that you can safely use your breath weapon over top of your animal companion? If so, its worth taking. Workmanlike, perhaps, but I'd definitely want it.

Resistance is 5+1/2 your level. You might be right.

Originally Posted by Cadfan

Wait, do you get to activate Infernal Wrath as a free action? Or do you get to actually make an attack as a free action? I'd probably pass on this.

Activate Infernal Wrath as a free action, no attack. Agreed on the pass.

[Cadfan]

Could you clarify how Invigorating and Rattling work?

[arcseed]

Grr. Even worse, draconic arrogance stacks entirely too well with Trample the Fallen, giving that build 1[W]+2[STR]+CON tide of iron at level 16. Since your dragonborn fighter is gonna want a high con for the breath anyway, and that build wants wis and dex a little less...

Ouch.

[thecasualoblivion]

Originally Posted by Cadfan

Could you clarify how Invigorating and Rattling work?

Invigorating--If you are trained in Endurance, you gain your Con mod in temporary HP when you hit with an Invigorating power. If you have the Battlerager Vigor class feature, these temp HP stack with other temp HP, and if you are wearing chainmail or lighter, you gain a damage bonus as long as you have temp HP. Yes, there is an Invigorating At-Will, which is just a generic attack with Invigorating.

Rattling--If you are trained in Intimidate and you deal damage with a Rattling power, the target takes -2 to attacks.

[yesnomu]

Originally Posted by arcseed

Grr. Even worse, draconic arrogance stacks entirely too well with Trample the Fallen, giving that build 1[W]+2[STR]+CON tide of iron at level 16. Since your dragonborn fighter is gonna want a high con for the breath anyway, and that build wants wis and dex a little less...

Ouch.

Wow. My dragonborn barbarian was already going to go Iron Vanguard, and this feat seems brokenly good to add on top...

Geez, imagine that with Thunderhawk rage. Every round, deal Str+Con damage to an enemy, for free. Yikes.

[Atlatl Jones]

Originally Posted by arcseed

Grr. Even worse, draconic arrogance stacks entirely too well with Trample the Fallen, giving that build 1[W]+2[STR]+CON tide of iron at level 16. Since your dragonborn fighter is gonna want a high con for the breath anyway, and that build wants wis and dex a little less...

Ouch.

It's even more obscene when used with a multiclass Barbarian, whose Pressing Strike at-will can be used with a two-handed weapon, and who gets many powers that automatically push and prone every round.

Then, for extra-special icky grossness at epic level, use a halberd and take Polearm Gamble and Knock-Back Swing: When you make an OA with an axe, hammer, mace, or pick, you push the target 1 square even if the attack misses.

[Byronic]

I must say, I'm quite happy that Race is starting to matter beyond the first level benefits. Now we just need a Heroic Tier.

[arcseed]

Originally Posted by Atlatl Jones

It's even more obscene when used with a multiclass Barbarian, whose Pressing Strike at-will can be used with a two-handed weapon, and who gets many powers that automatically push and prone every round.

Wait. So the barbarian gets a 2-handed at-will that lets him push with HBO/glaive and Polearm Gamble? It's even worse with that epic thingy, but that's still pretty bad.

[James McMurray]

He also gets a stance that knocks anything he hits prone. Basically it means the enemies are going to kill another PC instead of bounce off of the barbarian's temporary hit points, because they can't get near the barbarian.

[Zsig]

Originally Posted by thecasualoblivion

Invigorating--If you are trained in Endurance, you gain your Con mod in temporary HP when you hit with an Invigorating power. If you have the Battlerager Vigor class feature, these temp HP stack with other temp HP, and if you are wearing chainmail or lighter, you gain a damage bonus as long as you have temp HP. Yes, there is an Invigorating At-Will, which is just a generic attack with Invigorating.

Question:
Ok, Invigorating stacks with other stuff, but does it stack with itself?

[Vomax]

Originally Posted by Zsig

Question:
Ok, Invigorating stacks with other stuff, but does it stack with itself?

No, you are just allowed to have both 'temporary hit points' and 'Invigorating temporary hit points'. They follow all the same rules, you're just allowed two kinds.

[arcseed]

Originally Posted by James McMurray

He also gets a stance that knocks anything he hits prone. Basically it means the enemies are going to kill another PC instead of bounce off of the barbarian's temporary hit points, because they can't get near the barbarian.

Ok. Thinking about it more, I guess it's not so bad. Or, really, only very situationally useful, if you've got a good enough bottleneck, and better ranged attackers than the other guys.

[Doctor Proctor]

Originally Posted by arcseed

Grr. Even worse, draconic arrogance stacks entirely too well with Trample the Fallen, giving that build 1[W]+2[STR]+CON tide of iron at level 16. Since your dragonborn fighter is gonna want a high con for the breath anyway, and that build wants wis and dex a little less...

Ouch.

This. I wanted to go Iron Vanguard anyway, since pumping Con works for that PP and it synergizes with the Dragonborn abilities. Now it's even more awesome!

I wish you could take two Paragon Paths though, because I really want to unleash my inner dragon as well...