Utalia: Yeah or Nay?

**Leopold** · 18th April 2002, 03:14 PM

It has come to my attention that the Utalia info might not be acceptable for everyone. If everyone can please look over it that has a concern about it and post what needs to be changed or altered and then we can either approve it or disaprove it, it would be greatly appreicated.

You can find it here:
http://www.d20reviews.com/Daemonforg...nts/Utalia.doc

GreyOne · 18th April 2002, 04:06 PM

I can't remember who wrote this. Was it Sidran? I think there's a ton of creative stuff in there, I just really don't like the anglicized names (or the Spanish ones). Whenever I see one it automatically creates a disturbance in my mental picture of the world.

Some of it is in the glossary, though I don't have time this morning to check.

**Leopold** · 18th April 2002, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by GreyOne
I can't remember who wrote this. Was it Sidran? I think there's a ton of creative stuff in there, I just really don't like the anglicized names (or the Spanish ones). Whenever I see one it automatically creates a disturbance in my mental picture of the world.

Some of it is in the glossary, though I don't have time this morning to check.

is this an issue with the names, if so why? What's wrong with spanish or anglicized names?

Other than that what other issues is there?

GreyOne · 19th April 2002, 02:07 AM

Like I said, it creates a jarring disturbance in my mental picture of the world. To me, it's like reading a Conan story and having him meet a Roberto or a Samson while travelling through Aquilonia.

**Leopold** · 19th April 2002, 06:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by GreyOne
Like I said, it creates a jarring disturbance in my mental picture of the world. To me, it's like reading a Conan story and having him meet a Roberto or a Samson while travelling through Aquilonia.

ture, but you would get all sorts of linguistical oddities. I can see spanish names appearing as well as african, aborigninie, or perhaps french. As long as it coincides with the realm in questions is fine, I prefer a well rounded nationality to draw from so the player cannot just be limited to germanic/english type names. Heck we have names that sound klingon but they are in there. If roberto rodriguez is in there I have no issue with it, but it's on an island nation (picture puerto rico) and that's utalia. We can change the names if you like, feel free to edit them and send the draft to me. I don't think whomever did this is on here.

Rangerwickett what's your thoughts oh DF editor?

RangerWickett · 19th April 2002, 07:58 AM

What was everyone's problems with it? I would like to see a little more clarification on what the step-city looks like, since it's kind of vague right now whether the buildlings are built on the steps, or if they are dug into the island like caves.

As for the names, I'd like either a little more consistency ("I am Thomas Vespucci de Gato of the island of Utali, and this is my wife, Lalilulelo Stormwinder, from the Island of the Dragon's Teeth"), but that's a problem for the whole setting, at least somewhat. I kinda like eclecticism, and it certainly fits the feel of DF, what with the interbreeding and such, but I do know that some people don't like real world stuff intruding into fantasy. What I normally do is take real words and change them a little, or use Latin, since almost no one complains about Latin. Sometimes I might use more obscure languages, like the "Ken'onna warriors of Chi'niko," which is a slight twist on the Japanese for "Sword Women of Little Cat."

Maybe instead of things like "Roderiguez de la Loca," you could mess with them a bit and have "Roderages dal Loces." Keep a similar pattern to real-world languages, without messing with people's suspension of disbelief.

Wasn't there something involving psionics with Utali? Or am I confused? People might have been unhappy with the psionics, I suppose.

GreyOne · 19th April 2002, 04:15 PM

Okay, RW, I'm with you on that. Changing the real-world names enough so that they do not jar me out of my suspension of belief is good, similiar to George Martin's Song of Fire and Ice. ex. Eddard instead of Edward.

I don't think the campaign has a bunch of English sounding names either, and if it did that would be even more jarring. The names should be exotic and otherworldly. Names that you wouldn't encounter on Earth, especially in modern times.

Maybe we should come up with the languages spoken and build names from that for some internal consistency.

Example; Islandspecht (and its many dialects) is the language spoken in the Shattered Isles (is 'specht' a German word? I didn't know when I wrote it).

Common is spoken in the Kessel and is of course the mixed tongue that developed.

Kesselan is the ancient tongue spoken by the original Kessela before the other peoples came.

**Leopold** · 19th April 2002, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by GreyOne
Okay, RW, I'm with you on that. Changing the real-world names enough so that they do not jar me out of my suspension of belief is good, similiar to George Martin's Song of Fire and Ice. ex. Eddard instead of Edward.

I don't think the campaign has a bunch of English sounding names either, and if it did that would be even more jarring. The names should be exotic and otherworldly. Names that you wouldn't encounter on Earth, especially in modern times.

Maybe we should come up with the languages spoken and build names from that for some internal consistency.

Example; Islandspecht (and its many dialects) is the language spoken in the Shattered Isles (is 'specht' a German word? I didn't know when I wrote it).

Common is spoken in the Kessel and is of course the mixed tongue that developed.

Kesselan is the ancient tongue spoken by the original Kessela before the other peoples came.

languages: Hmm interesting topic. How do we approach it?

Sprecht is speak in german.

ok now someone is going to have to 'butcher' the names, maybe come up with a standard way to go about chaging the names. Anyone care to grab the 'offending' names and post them for us to go over? GreyOne you seem to know which ones are in question can you do this so we can discuss them?

GreyOne · 20th April 2002, 01:00 AM

Sure. People probably won't agree, but this has always been a sticking point for me.

**Leopold** · 20th April 2002, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by GreyOne
Sure. People probably won't agree, but this has always been a sticking point for me.

so far noone has DISAGREED so lets take RW's idea and go with it...make those changes as you see fit and then shoot me it via email bd_92@yahoo.com. I will then post the changes for one week. Any complaints we revise it. No complaints we post it as gospel.

LRonKnieval · 20th April 2002, 05:13 PM

I believe it was Sidran who wrote the Utalia doc. come to think of it.
I really like a lot of doc. (which is why I brought it up again)
I'm all for changing the names around,
but the other reason I think we should examine it is for geographic inconsistancies with the existing land masses. I only notice these things cause when I try to map them out, they don't always make sense.

At one time, I tried to map it into the kessel map, but was asked to pull it and revert to the earlier version (sans utalia). Basically the physical proximities of the locations should be straighted out according to politcal tensions and fairly logical geographics. For example, Weyamos is supposed to be the second of two large island, but also a desert. According to the original map it would be odd for the second largest island to be a desert and the cities that are already there aren't described as being in a desert setting. My original solution was to add another, large desert island farther south in the ocean, closer to the burned lands. Anyway, there are a few thing like that which should be dealt with. Over all though, I really liked the utalia doc, so I think we should keep it.

**Leopold** · 20th April 2002, 08:16 PM

a desert island in this area? I think that might be a typo. It wouldn't make any sense to have lush jungle in this area and then a few miiles south have a barren wasteland. If you move that to the southern tip of the burning god's land that would be appropriate. The topology can be changed right now so that's fine with the move.

LRonKnieval · 28th April 2002, 12:07 AM

Leopold,
You've got the Utalia version of the map right?
check the document as it is now against the Utalia map version to see what jives and what doesn't. Also check it against current documentation on the Shattered Islands, then let me know how close the map is to both of them.
From there you can change text that needs to be fixed and I'll make any changes you thing should be nade to the map.. Including any name adjustments.

L.Ron

**Leopold** · 30th April 2002, 06:01 PM

the name adjustments are going to come from GreyOne i believe, that's his deal with the names. I personally don't mind having a spanish flair to the names but that's his choice on the project.

as for the locations didn't we have to move the isles around? Weren't there geographical imposibilities?

Sidran · 16th September 2002, 03:41 AM

I just wanted to belatedly say boo!!!

The express reason I put spanish sounding names into the Utalian stuff was for regional flair. I am not satisfied with a unified world naming flick where every ones name is Jim, or Bill

or Mr. Smith

Sure I was writing out my ear when I orriginally wrote most of the Utalian stuff. ( And the whole of the Utalian Island chain is way south so if you stretched it Weymanos could be off the coast of the burned lands. )

Yes I know a lot of my stuff is not up to par or wasn't up to par with the way written material should be.

But how I have handled stuff lately is through the P.C. Wrede's World Building Questions so I may be willing to take a crack at the Isles again

Below is the Note map that I drew of the Isles when I first started writing the Doc.

**Leopold** · 16th September 2002, 04:04 PM

nice details on it..like I said, spanish names are fine with me, I have no issues with it