General RPG DiscussionDiscussion of all RPGs and non-system-specific topics. DM/GM/player issues, settings, etc. Rules discussion belongs in one the forums below.
Ugh, this is disgusting. Elfs? Dwarfs? Learn English syntax before you write a review!
Right back atcha. Technically, these are right and the D&D versions are wrong, though I will probably always prefer the latter anyway.
__________________ Jeff Heikkinen
Know the difference: Jibe: To agree with ("That doesn't jibe with...") Jive: Swing music, or deception.
Also, "criterion" is singular, "criteria" is plural. Not the other way around!
"But thog just finished step 3: stuffing potato salad into giant wooden alpaca!"
- Thog
There's the very real possibility that D&D is moribund. It's not obvious because it's happening very slowly but it is happening. The average age of gamers is increasing and we're not going to live forever. If we don't find new players, the game will eventually fade.
I'm 18 (turning 19 soon), been a gamer for 7, nearly 8, years and have introduced easily 30 people to D&D. Trust me, this new generation has RPGs (or at least D&D) under control
Ooh! Ooh! I'm of the new crowd, Well, I'm 20, but that's still relatively young. I'm pushing my sister (16) to get interested in it. In my neck of the woods, everything still seems A-OK.
I can understand your concern, but the problem isn't as bad as you think. While I personally think that D&D is changing, it's not going away. If you compare it the way it is now to back when I first started (AD&D)...
When I started gaming which was several years before you were born, there were many more young gamers. Nowadays, at cons, stores and clubs near me and at least one store nearer to you (and others I've been to worldwide), I see many more people in their 30s and 40s than in their teens and 20s. There may be young gamers but not enough to replace the old timers like me.
The only glimmer of hope is from gamers of my generation introducing their kids, nephews and nieces to the hobby. That could be D&D's salvation. WotC should do more to target parents as DMs and kids as players instead of assuming that both DM and players will be of the same age/level of exposure to D&D.
Books such as The Elfish Gene won't help to bring teens into the fold but it won't impact kids who are too young to understand what 'uncoolness' or 'geekyness' are.
__________________ "What Simkin does, he does for his own amusement." Legacy of the Darksword by Margaret Weis and Tracy Hickman
"Some of us think that Gygaxian fantasy, a rich and meaty stew of great fantasy authors spiced with classical mythology and medieval legend, just tastes better than WOTC's homogeneous corporate gruel." Clavis
I gotta admit Zander, I'm not with you on this. While I don't go to cons, I do play over OpenRPG. Of the past 50 or so people I've gamed with, well over half were under 25. In my current game, at 34, I'm the oldest, with the next one being 25 (I think) and everyone else younger. I know that's just my experience, so take it for what it's worth, but, I think that looking at cons isn't a good gauge. I know that in the few cons that I did go to, almost exclusively, players were all over 20.
I've never been to the bigger con's admittedly, but, back in the day, how many teens, and particularly young teens, would you see at something like Gen Con?
I think that perhaps the perception of the aging gamer is fueled by the fact that back in the day, seeing a gamer over 35 was an exception. Now, we just have a wider spread of ages.
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I double-dog-dare you to make your game sound super cool without comparing it to other editions. - paraphrased from Umbran.
At the gaming stores I frequent there are just about as many ten-or-so year olds as there are 30+ year olds, what seems to be missing is the 15 to 30 crowd, which I know through my time in college, is still alive and well. In terms of not seeing young people at cons, how many eleven year olds can afford airfare to Milwaukee or California and not get grounded for missing that much school?
__________________ "The Owl of Minerva spreads its wings only in the Twilight" - GWF Hegel
It's funny to be the constant target of abuse labeled as humor?
Please show me where the bad comedian touched you.
This is funny. I doubt anyone will take it seriously. If you don't believe that it can be funnt please see Dave Chappelle (sp?), Carlos Mencia, Richard Pryor and others.
__________________ "On two occasions, I have been asked [by members of Parliament], 'Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?' I am not able to rightly apprehend thekind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question." - Charles Babbage
On the topic of aging gamers and the need for replacements to fill out the ranks... I'd like to remind everyone that you don't die when you turn 40! I'm an original 80's gamer, started with the red box. I am 35 years old. Statistics says I've got another 35 or so years of natural life ahead of me barring accidents, bad habits, etc.
So we don't need to 'replace' any of our grey gamers -- we need to just continue to have fun and be open to new players from any source. There is definite room for growth, but I don't think it's quite the time to get alarmed about gamers dieing of old age. The Baby Boomers are in the rest home, D&D's generation are the children of Baby Boomers... we have another generation to go before the nursing home begins to house D&D sessions as often as bingo night.
__________________ Grimwell - old, cranky, mean, obsessive
Member - HoS
The average age of gamers is increasing and we're not going to live forever. If we don't find new players, the game will eventually fade.
One of the reasons I want to live to be 100 is to throw off these kinds of calculations. That's the thing about averages. I think it's to be expected that the group of us that started playing in the 80s is going to get older (hopefully). Wait till we get to the retirement homes, then it's really going to look unpleasant. I expect to see them start building retirement communities that look like Rivendell and advertising them in Dragon.
what simkin does, he does for his own amusement. -- one of the dark legacy books iirc
__________________ Story Hour
OMG! The SKY IS FALLING! --JoeGKushner
Myself, I plan to masturbate less -- der_kluge
I know that I've never really liked d20. I think it was designed by a bunch of hacks --- Monte Cook
I am sickened beyond belief. The half-orc wizard is obviously the best possible PC, and I only had to read 10 pages of the book to figure it out. D&D is dead to me! -- Mike Mearls
FWIW, I'm on the design team and I pretty much find WoW as fun and interesting as banging my head against a brick wall. -- Mike Mearls
you happen to say that 4E reminds you of the reasons you decided against a career as a special-Ed teacher--noted rpg author Darrin Drader
The title of this thread sounds like its trying to say gamers are a persecuted minority or something like that, lol! The books light-hearted and means no harm, goodness gracious, get over it and don’t take things so serious, it's just a bit of a geeky hobby that we do for fun right? At least it's not LARPing!
Actually, elves has always been the correct form. I know that growing up before I played D&D that Santa had elves and not elfs.
Heh, even the Firefox automatic spellchecker recognizes elves and not elfs.
Dwarves was revived by Tolkien, but not invented, I believe.
As it is now, Dwarfs refers to humans with dwarfism, and Dwarves refers to a race of fantasy creatures with big beards and axes.
Elfs, Elves, and even Elphs have all been accepted spellings of the word, going by many sources. (For elphs take a look at Percy's Relics and Childe's Ballads.)
Dwarves was a word created by Tolkien, since he was a student of languages he reasoned that the word would change if it were more commonly used, as would be likely in a world that contained a race of such. Thus, as calfs became calves, halfs became halves, and wolfs became wolves - dwarfs would become dwarves.
Sorry about the threadjacking, but....
The Auld Grump, how much the world has been changed by the invention of the dictionary, and how much more static spelling has become.
__________________ Oh, I am a cook, and a captain bold, and the mate of the Nancy brig,
The midship mite,
And the Bo'sun tight,
And the crew of the captain's gig...
I fail to see how this is any different to books poking fun at men, women, blondes, stamp collectors, cricket fans or hairdressers.
Criminey, it's a MEMIOR! Not a JOKE BOOK!
I could probably write a similar book about some of my D&D experiences. Of course, it would be more filled with beer runs, football stars, male bonding rituals, smashing stuff in the woods, and gaming with extremely beautiful college women and being very well-adjusted sexually, so it wouldn't be very interesting...
....now my book on Anime Conventions....THAT thing is going to be HILARIOUS!
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