General RPG DiscussionDiscussion of all RPGs and non-system-specific topics. DM/GM/player issues, settings, etc. Rules discussion belongs in one the forums below.
I have only GMed two session now with WFRP. But its by far the best system i have ever owned and i have run everything from D&D (3 editions) to D20 games, to World of darkness, rifts, gurps, and now this.
The class system seems wonky at first. But one thing you have to realize is your not in your first class for very long at all. You start allready having all the skills and talents you need to move to your next career, and with at least one advance on the other stuff.
Plus the randomness is fun if you do it right. My game now has: 2 elven hunters, 1 elven apprentice mage, 1 human noble woman, 1 dwarf outlaw, and 1 human entertainer (storyteller).
Seems random.... But they are all in a small village with a bridge along a major river in the western part of the empire. The reason they came together is simple and so far it revolves around the elven apprentice mage and the storyteller.
The storyteller is a spy for the nearest baron who wants to usurp rule of the village and taxation rights to the bridge.
The elven wizard is a representative of the college of fire sent here to surrepticously investigate the rumours of an ancient temple from the humans who lived here before the empire. He is dressed as a scout and as has been pretending to be a wilderness scout and hunter to gather info and blend in more then a wizard would.
One of the elven hunters is just on the run from a beastman rise in the forests to the west of town and looking for somewhere to go to avoid trouble... problem is that there really isnt anywhere with whats going on in the greater world so he stayed in this town to sell the furs he has been catching while he figures out his next move.
The human noblewoman is a runaway from a "deceased" husband who is pretending to be a mercenary and just wanted to see the greater world. The dwarf is on the run because he slew a human border official due to a mistake and when his clan said his honor demanded he present himself for justice he got scared and ran.. In his constand roaming over the last few years he just happened to find himself on the road east of town looking to make a living in the chaos of the area.
The other elf is an emissary from the nearby elven community sent to get help defending the hopelessly outnumbered elves from beastmen and orc raiders.
How did all these people come together?? Well the apprentice mage had nailed this town down as the closest one to where he thought the temple might be. So he was using it as a base while investigating the area.
The entertainer was in town just gathering info and playing at the bars, she happened to walk over to the elf mage because elves are unusual and she thought he might be important, or know something important since he had been sticking around.
The elven hunter who was running started talking to the elf mage just because they were both rare elves in a small human town.
The mage meanwhile had signed on as a scout in the towns forces because it was a good cover and being a mage is a suspicous thing anyway.
So while they're all chatting a runner from the sherrif comes and asks the mage to come to a meeting because some farmers have gone missing. The mage brings the rest, and they head out hunting. They find out a big warparty is coming and head back to town.
Just then the dwarf and noblewoman head into town at near to the same time. The entertainer is doing her best to convince people on the west side of town to move across the bridge, the hunters are wandering the forest keeping track of the creatures, the dwarf volunteers himself to see to what defenses can be thrown up quickly and the mage hangs around being unobtrusive and "scouting out archery posts".
fast forward some RP and the entertainer convinced most people to go back to the defenses. The hunters storm in just ahead of the beasts. The noble has been hanging out on the wall and helping with the labor so she is ready to roll, and the mage has his archer post all picked out.
The fight goes by, there arent many combatants on either side. And after a good hard battle all are fast friends and put together as the villages "outlander corps" based on the french foreign legion.
Simple easy, all are freinds. Of course no one knows there is a wizard and noble in the party but me. But still, all these crazy races/classes that usually have no business being together are now a solid team verging on being freinds. Wasnt so hard was it?
An elf apprentice wizard in a humans' college? As far as I'm concerned the elves study magic by their own, with a little help of their own masters who reside in the Old World, then journey to Ulthuan and study the High Magic (something like DnD high level spells) there. In my team there is such an elf, but he has already advanced to the journeywizard career, co he can cast effective fire spells that burn the enemies with ease (2 fireballs do the job well as my priest of Ranald has noticed).
See, if D&D were at all realistic, adventurers would rapidly be suffering from major Post-Traumatic Stress disorder. I mean, even the most hardened adventurer is not going to survive having been partially digested by a giant worm, had his face burned off, or his best friend possessed by a demon without some psychological damage. Then there's the physical toll. Even assuming cure light wounds does a really dandy job, it really ain't the years, it's the mileage when it comes to slogging around in heavy armor, swinging a sword, packing your skull with mindbending spells day in and day out. And on the way to somewhere, you would constantly be picking up an annoying little cough, or malaria, or flesh eating bacteria, or whatever, and hopefully you have a cleric who can cure disease and has plenty of spell lots. After a few years, you'd be missing an arm or an eye, most of your friends and coworkers would be dead, and your family long since devoured by spiteful mind flayers or vampires. Heroes would be famous precisely because it would be such a miracle for someone to make a living as a slayer of evil, live to some level of useful experience, and successfully vanquish a mighty foe and have a relatively happy ending after that. In the face of daily peril, battles against implacable foes with few resources at your command, you would be struggling against low morale and spiritual dissolution. And that's assuming you yourself don't get transformed by the touch of pure evil.
WFRP kind of brings that experience home.
If you don't think bored peasants and socipathic rat catchers ganging up to mug a lone orc and take his head for a reward from the local constable is funny, or that watching your Knight get ripped in half by an ogre is a "good way to go, he would have wanted it that way, if actually living to a ripe old age were not an option on the table" then it may not be the game for you.
Evil that is really evil and will kill you, cartoon violence that kills, wrestling with trolls bringing about the predictable results, getting into trouble with the local authorities over "exploring ancient tombs" i.e. grave-robbing the rich and long dead, that's the WFRP experience for you.
Now my big question is: can I use it to run CITY? Because I'll try... oh I'll try.
I don't see why not. I know our very own Rel is using it to run a dark fantasy version of Pirates of the Caribbean as we speak and by all accounts, it's been a resounding success.
I I know our very own Rel is using it to run a dark fantasy version of Pirates of the Caribbean as we speak and by all accounts, it's been a resounding success.
In WFRP there some awesome sea careers, something DnD lacks, since I love such adventures. "The WFRP Companion" is really filled with sea/river stuff. Unfortunately, our GM loves mainland...
I have a couple questions about 1st edition WFRP. Is anyone familiar with the first Realms of Sorcery book written by Ken Walton? If so, is it recommended? The authors themselves admit that the magic system was both rushed and flawed; this was supposed to fix it. Does it?
Second question--in addition to the Ememy Within and the two city supplements, are there any other must-have 1st edition books you would recommend?
D&D is like the average rock'n roll you hear on the radio hear in the US.
WFRP is Rammstein!
I love it. It is such a breath of fresh air after playing up with D&D/d20 for years. The only thing I don't like about it is that the books are somewhat pricey--but that's the way things are going these days.
Edit: Oddly enough, I can't stand Warhammer Fantasy Battles!!!
__________________ "Farewell, Friend. I was a thousand times more evil than thou!"
--Stormbringer
It's difficult to compare both games. WFRP is low magic, grim and gritty; DnD high magic, epic and heroic.
After playing a lot of DnD it is a breath of fresh air, indeed. And when you are bored with the Old World and realms beyond it, it's good to be back on the planes. It's a great wheel ... one year you play the first game, the next year - the second one.
I have a couple questions about 1st edition WFRP. Is anyone familiar with the first Realms of Sorcery book written by Ken Walton? If so, is it recommended? The authors themselves admit that the magic system was both rushed and flawed; this was supposed to fix it. Does it?
Second question--in addition to the Ememy Within and the two city supplements, are there any other must-have 1st edition books you would recommend?
I didn't think that the first RoS book was so bad and I have both (v1 & v2)to blend together. I give wizards more petty and lesser magic than is suggested to allow mages to emulate some of the effects of other schools of magic to a lesser degree and why not? The hazards are still the same.
Aside from TEW, Marienburg and Middenheim, I would suggest Dwarfs: Stone and Steel, the Apocrypha Now! and Apocrypha 2: Chart of Darkness. I also am working on a modified Doomstones campaign and have the two Realm of Chaos books to compliment the new Tome of Corruption.
__________________ "Three may keep a secret, if two of them are dead."
---Benjamin Franklin
D&D is like the average rock'n roll you hear on the radio hear in the US.
WFRP is Rammstein!
I love it. It is such a breath of fresh air after playing up with D&D/d20 for years. The only thing I don't like about it is that the books are somewhat pricey--but that's the way things are going these days.
Edit: Oddly enough, I can't stand Warhammer Fantasy Battles!!!
I would say that DnD is like the works of Vance, Leiber, Howard and Lovecraft with a bits of Tolkien mixed in, blend well and serve warm.
Warhammer is the Lord of the Rings read when on double-dip LSD while listening to The Mind is a Terrible Thing to Taste or Psalm 69 by Ministry. Good stuff indeed.
__________________ "Three may keep a secret, if two of them are dead."
---Benjamin Franklin
I liked Warhammer a lot at first but then the lack of detail about the campaign world started to do my head in. Things like the Warhammer world not having a name (or one isn't ever mentioned) and some of the intended humour is rubbish and distracting/cheesy.
The river 'waz' :\
'Bol a hat', 'giants causeway' and many other things are just annoying after a while.
Me and shilsen have been debating whether CITY is too high magic for WHFR's base set of assumptions --of course we were doing this without actually having cracked open WHFR...
CITY was conceived of a low-present-day magic, which didn't survive contact with the first group of players. It's pretty high magic now; with Meiji, Burne and Atlatl Jones (I don't think you've met him yet) at 11th level. We've been trying to figure out if that kind of player-controlled magic is important to the feel of the game.
Quote:
I know our very own Rel is using it to run a dark fantasy version of Pirates of the Caribbean as we speak and by all accounts, it's been a resounding success.
Cool.
__________________ "We're pimps and killers, but in a philanthropic way." -- Boyd, Dollhouse.
Me and shilsen have been debating whether CITY is too high magic for WHFR's base set of assumptions --of course we were doing this without actually having cracked open WHFR...
CITY was conceived of a low-present-day magic, which didn't survive contact with the first group of players. It's pretty high magic now; with Meiji, Burne and Atlatl Jones (I don't think you've met him yet) at 11th level. We've been trying to figure out if that kind of player-controlled magic is important to the feel of the game.
Well, the feel of it'll certainly change a bit. It is a lower magic setting, and it is more grim and gritty.
I guess I didn't realize how high your PCs had become lately; from what I remembered of the story hour I thought they'd fit in pretty nicely with those mechanics.
'Bol a hat', 'giants causeway' and many other things are just annoying after a while.
If there is one thing that the real world has taught me, it's not to worry about goofy place-names.
__________________ "Conversely, I'm amazed at the number of people queueing up to tell people that don't like 4e that they are wrong. Why can't people just agree to disagree, and get on with actually playing the game?" --Delericho
If there's one dragon, it's a solo monster.
If there's five dragons, they're standard monsters.
If there's a dozen dragons, either most of them are minions or your DM is tired of the campaign.
--Lizard
While I haven't convinced my regular players to give more than a one-shot to the "Grim World of Perilous Adventure", I love the setting, and I love what Green Ronin has done to vitalize the rules and make them very consistent while at the same time preserving the feel of the Old World. In fact, it was Rel who turned me on to the new Warhammer, after his recount of the campaign his group was running prior to his current Caribbean-themed one.
__________________ "Conversely, I'm amazed at the number of people queueing up to tell people that don't like 4e that they are wrong. Why can't people just agree to disagree, and get on with actually playing the game?" --Delericho
If there's one dragon, it's a solo monster.
If there's five dragons, they're standard monsters.
If there's a dozen dragons, either most of them are minions or your DM is tired of the campaign.
--Lizard
I keep hearing about this Caribbean campaign. Do You use the mechanics and real world or have you placed the game in WFRP setting? (I don't know if there are any islands near Lustria).
... one year you play the first game, the next year - the second one.
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