Dungeon Magazine Rescue at Rivenroar Posted - Page 2

Jack of Shadows · 13th July 2008, 06:49 AM

Well,

It looks like it was either awfully rushed or the editor was asleep at the switch. It is full of inconsistencies, bad grammar, poor descriptions and irrational design.

As an example, the second encounter starts with the "PC's outside the tavern." Except there is no tavern noted on the map for the encounter. There is both an Inn and a Bar but neither matches the dimensions of the tavern the characters just fought in.

Later a dwarven prisoner gives highly detailed directions. Unfortunately it doesn't say what/who the directions are to.

I don't know what's going on in the DDI offices at WotC but it's like they are deliberately trying to sabotage themselves.

JoS

Rechan · 13th July 2008, 06:55 AM

Quote:

will they be releasing the maps, unmarked, in a separate PDF or zip file. This is one thing that Paizo did well.

Are you talking about when Paizo did Dungeon? Because I haven't seen them do this for their modules.

Ebon Shar · 13th July 2008, 07:04 AM

I have to say, I hate the online version of Dragon and Dungeon. My poor printer cannot handle a high-graphic 45 page document. I'd MUCH rather just purchase a magazine like in the good old days. Not a rant against 4E, which I love. This is a rant against what I think is a ridiculous business decision to go all digital on the magazines.

Vanuslux · 13th July 2008, 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack of Shadows

Well,

It looks like it was either awfully rushed or the editor was asleep at the switch. It is full of inconsistencies, bad grammar, poor descriptions and irrational design.

As an example, the second encounter starts with the "PC's outside the tavern." Except there is no tavern noted on the map for the encounter. There is both an Inn and a Bar but neither matches the dimensions of the tavern the characters just fought in.

Later a dwarven prisoner gives highly detailed directions. Unfortunately it doesn't say what/who the directions are to.

I don't know what's going on in the DDI offices at WotC but it's like they are deliberately trying to sabotage themselves.

JoS

You know, the funny thing is that the other 4E Dungeon adventures don't seem to have the same problems. Of course, I haven't read them in as much detail as this adventure, as I'm currently playing in one of them, but I haven't heard these kinds of complaints. You would think that if they're going to try to do an adventure path, one of hte most popular features of Paizo's Dungeon, they'd at least put a little extra effort into putting their best foot forward.

Foundry of Decay · 13th July 2008, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ebon Shar

I have to say, I hate the online version of Dragon and Dungeon. My poor printer cannot handle a high-graphic 45 page document. I'd MUCH rather just purchase a magazine like in the good old days. Not a rant against 4E, which I love. This is a rant against what I think is a ridiculous business decision to go all digital on the magazines.

I can't help but agree with this.

While I do see some advantages to digital versions of the magazines such as the 'playtest' of the Artificer class, or that changes can be easily made if mistakes are found, I really wish that when they released the final compiled version that they would offer a printed magazine that you could buy/order as well.

I really do miss being able to just sit and relax with a coffee and a Dragon/Dungeon magazine.

caudor · 13th July 2008, 09:23 AM

I broke down the adventure to see what level my PCs should be at the completion. Let's see, we have:

18 Encounters (13 of Level 1 & 5 of Level 2)
If my math is right, these come to a total of 10105 XP

There is also a major & minor quest, worth 500 & 100 respectively.

Finally, there are 3 skill challenges (200zp, 200xp, 300xp)

Assuming the party of 5 complete every encounter, quest, and skill challenge, the grand XP total would be: 11405 XP, or ...

2281 for each PC. That would put them barely over 3rd level.

So should we expect the next adventure to begin at 3rd level?

If someone sees an error with my math, please don't hesitate to point it out.

Hussar · 13th July 2008, 10:35 AM

Caudor- that's likely really. Most of the AP mods were for 2 levels or so. This AP is supposed to be 18 mods, so we can figure a few extra at the high end and that gives us 2 levels per.

Asmor · 13th July 2008, 11:52 AM

There's also the optional travel rules, which include random encounters and a guaranteed 100 xp each way they travel (since, in order to reach their destination, they have to pass the challenge).

Phaezen · 13th July 2008, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vanuslux

Since I'm here though, I suppose I may as well air my own complaints:

2. The do it yourself, look at your player's wishlist approach to treasure.

Oddly enough, I rather like this approach, the treasures in the module are all called out in the front, not hidden within the text of the adventure. Also, with the magical items' level given and not specific items, I can decide what is appropriate for the party, including looking at the characters wishlist of items. As it is it only leaves you making 5 or so item choices.

Phaezen

Bagpuss · 13th July 2008, 02:38 PM

And just where is Rivenroar?

Or the key to the map of Brindol?

Very disappointing start to the first AP, especially if you look at the support Paizo gave to adventure paths.

catsclaw227 · 13th July 2008, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rechan

Are you talking about when Paizo did Dungeon? Because I haven't seen them do this for their modules.

Yea, they had their supplemental downloads with images and maps. Not miniature scale, but hi-res enough to use for online play.

Jack99 · 13th July 2008, 04:55 PM

Gonna pimp my blog a bit..

I wrote a review (or some observations) about RaR in my blog, if anyone is interested. Reading through this thread, I see that I missed a few things. /shrug

Cheers

Vanuslux · 13th July 2008, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack99

Gonna pimp my blog a bit..

I wrote a review (or some observations) about RaR in my blog, if anyone is interested. Reading through this thread, I see that I missed a few things. /shrug

Cheers

Not too shabby. I hadn't been aware that there's supposed to be RoR supplemental stuff in next month's Dragon...that does seem absurdly dumb to me...it would have made a lot more sense to hold back the adventure another month and give it some much needed polish.

Hussar · 14th July 2008, 02:51 AM

Dungeon/Dragon have been doing this with the last two adventure paths. Savage Tide and Age of Worms had monthly supplement articles for players in Dragon. It does make some sense when you think about it - you can give your players the Dragon magazine to read through for all the player info, while not having to worry about spoilers.

I would also imagine that we'll see a Backdrop article for the city of Brindol and surroundings in this issue of Dungeon.

I think this is one of the disadvantages of the online format where everything is available piecemeal. It does make it very disjointed. If I got a Dungeon print magazine, it would have all that in one place. Granted, I'd get it THREE MONTHS after release, but, I'd still get it.

helium3 · 14th July 2008, 05:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hussar

I think this is one of the disadvantages of the online format where everything is available piecemeal. It does make it very disjointed. If I got a Dungeon print magazine, it would have all that in one place. Granted, I'd get it THREE MONTHS after release, but, I'd still get it.

Well, the flip side is that the online version has some advantages. I just haven't seen them taken advantage of yet.

Hussar · 14th July 2008, 05:52 AM

Oh, for sure. The fact that I can just lift the images straight out of the pdf and onto something like OpenRPG is a BIG bonus. Cut and paste is FANTASTIC. I'd LOVE to have my STAP modules in the same format.

Zil · 14th July 2008, 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bagpuss

And just where is Rivenroar?

I was wondering the same thing. If you're going to show us an area map, then why not mark on that map where the bulk of the adventure takes place? It seems surprisingly sloppy.

Eosin the Red · 14th July 2008, 07:15 AM

Hmm, IO would not know. Once again the site won't let me log in and has an error when I request a new password.

Piece of garbage. I'll try again every few weeks. Usually the site magically remembers me without warning and everything works once more.

GlassJaw · 14th July 2008, 04:03 PM

Considering the incredibly high production values Paizo has been putting into the Pathfinder series, this doesn't even come close. WotC is supposed to be the industry leader right? Right?!

And that treasure system is incredibly lame.

Wormwood · 14th July 2008, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GlassJaw

And that treasure system is incredibly lame.

And while I thought the module itself was fairly pedestrian (with the exception of the barfight and street battle of course), I have *never* been more excitied with D&D's handling of treasure than I am right now.

The parcel system is easily my favorite part of DMing 4th edition, and I fully expect continued supporting in all future modules. Thunderspire, I'm looking at you.