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Yikes. Virtually everything on that release schedule is crunch or prepackaged modules or books of prepackaged modules.
It's like late 3.x's run of the "Complete X, Y, Z and the kitchen sink" redone with a different ruleset. They've read my mind, seen what things and playstyles I don't care for, and published it all. Yikes indeed from my perspective.
__________________ "I can just see the 4e adventure anthology "Tale from the Limited Staircase"." - Ken Marable
Not necessarily. It could be "official" DDI-only. Which probably ticks some folks off like the Arcane book supporting an FR-only (book-wise).
I suppose it might be. Or it might be released in the printed dragon compilation they mentioned. But given that they seem to be keeping the limited DDI material free for now and that they appear to be well behind schedule, if it's a DDI exclusive, maybe the Bard will be free!
Still guessing it's in PHII, but I wouldn't be surprised if I'm wrong.
Yikes. Virtually everything on that release schedule is crunch or prepackaged modules or books of prepackaged modules.
It's like late 3.x's run of the "Complete X, Y, Z and the kitchen sink" redone with a different ruleset. They've read my mind, seen what things and playstyles I don't care for, and published it all. Yikes indeed from my perspective.
You know, it's funny. I completely understand your aversion to the heavy loading of crunch and modules. I'll likely be skipping on most if not all of the modules myself (as well as the cards). However, I'm kind of glad that they are frontloading a lot of 'complete' type books-- meaning books filled with powers for existing classes. One of the concerns some of the folks at my table had when trying out 4th was the lack of options for character builds available in the PH. Putting out books with 100 extra powers for each class-- while not 'sexy'-- could go a long way to solving that concern.
Now, if they end up releasing a million books per power source, then I'll not be so happy.
Out of curiousity-- is it more fluff type stuff that you are interested in? Fiendish Codex type stuff? I like that as well.
I withhold judgement on the cards until after we see them.
The fact that we're already being hit with the "Complete X" books does not bode well. At all.
__________________ Psionics are too sci-fi, not like the traditional method of spell casting that has existed only in D&D, involves research, laboratory work, and formulas, and was cribbed directly from a series of science fiction novels. I mean, come on, calling forth the power to alter the world from your own center of will? That's not magical in the slightest! Not at all like my wizard's spell "Telepathy!"
Out of curiousity-- is it more fluff type stuff that you are interested in? Fiendish Codex type stuff? I like that as well.
Flavor text heavy books that are inspirational and can be pillaged for campaign elements. Monster books with more flavor text and ecology (and a knowledge check chart with one line per range of numbers is not a good ecology section, it's a cheap way out of writing one). Setting books and supplements with lots of world elements, history, etc.
Anything but more classes, feats, powers, PrCs, etc etc
__________________ "I can just see the 4e adventure anthology "Tale from the Limited Staircase"." - Ken Marable
Flavor text heavy books that are inspirational and can be pillaged for campaign elements. Monster books with more flavor text and ecology (and a knowledge check chart with one line per range of numbers is not a good ecology section, it's a cheap way out of writing one). Setting books and supplements with lots of world elements, history, etc.
Anything but more classes, feats, powers, PrCs, etc etc
Fair enough. I'm quite fond of that material as well. I just don't have the same aversion to the 'crunch' books.
About Arcane Power: It seems there will be more Arcane Classes than Martial ones (no problem with that), I'm just surprised that Sorcerer is Arcane and not Primal.
Also what is with the Artificer, isn't he an arcane Class too?
BTW, does anyone remember the spell cards from 3rd edition? Do you really think 3rd edition was designed to force you to use spell cards? How is this different?
It's different because people have noticed that these cards are actually useful. Which means people feel more compelled to get them. And somehow that makes them more offensive . . . .
Re: the powers added by the 'Power' line of books, I honestly don't see the new abilities being a huge imposition. After all, the classes as they are in the PH, paragon paths and all, have around 90 powers apiece. They're basically doubling the options. In fact, depending on the basic powers to paragon paths ratio, it's quite possible that the better chunk of the new power cards will only apply to a percentage of the purchasing players; we'll just have to see how that turns out.
I withhold judgement on the cards until after we see them.
The fact that we're already being hit with the "Complete X" books does not bode well. At all.
I'm thinking the opposite, but then again you are a critic/cynic of 4th edition and I am a fan/optimist of it.
the PHB is fuller than ever with powers this time as all class get these neat things to do, now in the PHB there are 4/3 options at each level including paragon paths, while this is playable, I as well as many others would like even more options, which is what these complete power books will hopefully provide I imagine an extra 3-4 powers per level + 4-5 paragon paths and 4-8 epic destinies.
It seems also they are only releasing them when the Power Source has reached its full complement of classes, 4 from what I can see. This would leave me to believe the Divine Power coming out in autumm(fall)/Winter next year and the Primal Power coming out in spring next year, with the PHB 3 which will contain the Shadow and Psionic and hmm another source, with 4 of one source and 2 each of the other two leading to a Power book of one of those sources in autumn that year.
So I see the release list a bit like this (in terms of PHB's and Power books):
2008 Summer: PHB
2008 Autumn/winter: Martial Power
2009 Spring: PHB 2
2009 Summer:Arcane Power
2009 Autumn/winter: Divine Power
2010 Spring: PHB 3 [for Psionic, Shadow and Ki? heroes]
2010 Summer: Primal Power
2011 Autumn/winter: [Something Power] the source which has 4 classes from PHB 3
2012 Spring: PHB4
2013 Summer: [Something Power] one of the 2 sources which has 2 classes from PHB 3 and 4
2014 Autumn: [Something Power] the remaining of the 2 sources which has 2 classes from PHB 3 and 4
__________________ Ginnel
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Originally Posted by Shabe
Of course you may be talking about all of the above in character where all the characters in the party count every single coin and keep track of it individually and all know the exact price of items, all can divide big numbers in their heads and all carry around a handy set of dice with them for when the roll off occurs, then of course you are fine, else well done you've taken some of the r out or rpg.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ginnel
If you want to create something different do it.
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Bang I've just changed my world do the same with yours.
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Last edited by Ginnel; 31st July 2008 at 11:13 AM..
Flavor text heavy books that are inspirational and can be pillaged for campaign elements. Monster books with more flavor text and ecology (and a knowledge check chart with one line per range of numbers is not a good ecology section, it's a cheap way out of writing one). Setting books and supplements with lots of world elements, history, etc.
Anything but more classes, feats, powers, PrCs, etc etc
I like the knowledge check parts mostly because they are directly usable in game. If I want to know what the PCs should know and what not I just consult the chart and let them roll. At the same time, they don't "over define" a monster for me.
For now, I am planning to use the H1 to E3 series of adventure books, but eventually I _will_ homebrew, and more monster fluff is no longer inspirational to me, but limiting. I feel like I am throwing away way too much information.
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Anything but more classes, feats, powers, PrCs, etc etc
Well, I'd like to eventually see supplements with more fluff, too.
However, at this point, they're really better off to first publish more crunch. Many if not most of those still on the fence about switching to 4E are holding off because 4E doesn't yet have support for their favorite race/class/character concept.
Myself, I'll be ready to make the switch after the release of the psionic classes and a good setting (either Eberron, or a non-WotC setting like Age of Legend (Earthdawn)).
Well, I'd like to eventually see supplements with more fluff, too.
However, at this point, they're really better off to first publish more crunch. Many if not most of those still on the fence about switching to 4E are holding off because 4E doesn't yet have support for their favorite race/class/character concept.
Myself, I'll be ready to make the switch after the release of the psionic classes and a good setting (either Eberron, or a non-WotC setting like Age of Legend (Earthdawn)).
I think another setting is what 4e really needs right now. The complaints about 4e range in two parts - the lack of peoples' favorite concepts, and that they dislike the imposed 4e setting. Bringing in Eberron to kind of say "Guys, look, I've still got the old stuff, just how you like it" would, in my opinion, do a lot to help bring more players in.
Unfortunately, they really shot themselves in the foot with Forgotten Realms.
__________________ Psionics are too sci-fi, not like the traditional method of spell casting that has existed only in D&D, involves research, laboratory work, and formulas, and was cribbed directly from a series of science fiction novels. I mean, come on, calling forth the power to alter the world from your own center of will? That's not magical in the slightest! Not at all like my wizard's spell "Telepathy!"
Maybe you super savvy folks already had confirmation from somewhere else, but that's new for me. It's also new that the sorcerer is a definite for the book (though I'd heard it rumored).
Yeah, it's all but confirmed that the Bard is an Arcane Leader and the Sorcerer an Arcane Controller (wild magic action).
-Bringing in Eberron to kind of say "Guys, look, I've still got the old stuff, just how you like it" would, in my opinion, do a lot to help bring more players in.
-Unfortunately, they really shot themselves in the foot with Forgotten Realms.
-Eberron will be released next year, I believe.
-Why do you feel this way? I think FR needed a face-lift.
An arcane class that doesn't officially appear until after Arcana Power. What we have is only the playtest version of half of the class.
Yes, but we received said "half-a-class" some nine or ten months before Arcane Power gets released. It would be silly if its final version wasn't complete long before then.
I really, really want Arcane Power to support the Artificer, and I don't give a damn if it comes out before the class itself.
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