4e / GSL WotC to Revise D&D 4th Edition GSL and SRD

[Orcus]

Originally Posted by GVDammerung

Bingo! Wotc would not be backtracking unless 4e needed the help. If 4e sales were rocking there would be no leverage internally with legal, I suspect, for this kind of a reversal. Of course, it remains to be seen if the actual changes are substantive or merely cosmetic. I'll guess minor changes to dispose of stock but no change to the at will termination clause, and no change to the once GSL, no OGL clauses. Lipstick on a pig, I'm thinking. Unless 4e is REALLY in trouble!

GVD-

Man, you are so negative.

This is not a "backtracking" or a "leverage" situation. How about--some good people (Scott and Linae) finally got listened to when it became apparent that the GSL was not doing what it was supposed to be doing.

I guess you are entitled to your own opinion of what to expect as to whether the changes will be "cosmetic" and "lipstick on a pig." I, on the other hand, expect them to be substantial. In fact, I am very hopeful that all the issues I have with the GSL will be addressed and Necro will be able to announce 4E support. That is my hope anyway. I guess we will see who is right. (smart money is on me)

Clark

[Brown Jenkin]

We are all mising option F) WotC hates Necromancer Games with an otherworldly passion and conspired to wait until Orcus gave back the rights to the Ari's Player Guide before announcing changes to the GSL

[El Mahdi]

“We recognize the important role third party publishing support plays in the success of the 4th Edition of Dungeons & Dragons. We have listened to the community and our valued colleagues and have taken their concerns and recommendations to heart. Our commitment to the health of the industry and hobby gaming lifestyle is reflected in the revisions to the Game System License.”
--Linae Foster D&D Licensing Manager



Don't ever let it be said by anyone again (even those here on ENWorld), that the opinions of gamers on ENWorld and other Forums, and the importance of 3PP's, that they Do Not Matter. The argument that "ENWorld is such a small percentage of WoTC customer base that they do not listen to us", has been undeniably refuted. Without being to melodramatic, this news has renewed my confidence in WoTC that they believe our opinions are important and that gamers have a level of ownership of this hobby.

Now, we just have to wait and see what the new GSL says and how 3PP's receive it. I'm interested in it just to see their tone, and what intentions that may mean for their guidelines on fansites.

[dogoftheunderworld]

Originally Posted by Orcus

I am voting for D.

I'm with you in my public support for the fight Scott and Linae have been fighting to make things happen. I'm not counting my chickens before they hatch, so to speak, but I remain optimistic as I have been that the needed changes and clarifications will happen. Which, of course, will mean that Necro can then support 4E, as we have long wanted to do.

Clark

Or F) Orcus's massively singular email campaign brought down WOTC's servers, causing them to close Gleemax and re-double there efforts to appease the mighty one

Seriously, as part of the lurking majority, THANK YOU Linae and Scott for doing your best to help out gamers at large.

[El Mahdi]

Now let's work on getting the PDF prices dropped.

[Thaumaturge]

Originally Posted by dogoftheunderworld

Seriously, as part of the lurking majority, THANK YOU Linae and Scott for doing your best to help out gamers at large.

Hear, hear.

Thaumaturge.

[Agamon]

Originally Posted by GVDammerung

Bingo! Wotc would not be backtracking unless 4e needed the help. If 4e sales were rocking there would be no leverage internally with legal, I suspect, for this kind of a reversal. Of course, it remains to be seen if the actual changes are substantive or merely cosmetic. I'll guess minor changes to dispose of stock but no change to the at will termination clause, and no change to the once GSL, no OGL clauses. Lipstick on a pig, I'm thinking. Unless 4e is REALLY in trouble!

Oh, yeah, I'm on the internet. Thanks for the reminder.

[Filcher]

Golly, what will we use to vilify Wizards now?

Of never mind, this is a sign that 4E is failing.

The big dog just can't win.

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

Originally Posted by Brown Jenkin

We are all mising option F) WotC hates Necromancer Games with an otherworldly passion and conspired to wait until Orcus gave back the rights to the Ari's Player Guide before announcing changes to the GSL

To make sure that Orcus doesn't have any regrets in that regard (and I doubt he does, since he didn't have to give back the manuscript, and just did it because he's a mensch), I'll happily preorder Folio of Fiends if you can create any sort of mechanism in place to take such preorders, Clark.

[Brown Jenkin]

Originally Posted by Filcher

Golly, what will we use to vilify Wizards now?

Well the DDI is still available

[FATDRAGONGAMES]

Originally Posted by Whizbang Dustyboots

To make sure that Orcus doesn't have any regrets in that regard (and I doubt he does, since he didn't have to give back the manuscript, and just did it because he's a mensch), I'll happily preorder Folio of Fiends if you can create any sort of mechanism in place to take such preorders, Clark.

Ditto.

[Rechan]

I'm glad Linae and The Rouse are on the case, but I'm not going to hold my breath that things will be Better(tm).

I'm in Wait'n'See mode.

[FourthBear]

If 4e was doing poorly in sales, I have to think that the *last* thing on WotC's mind would be spending any resources on increasing third party support. Further, considering how long it takes companies to move from data to action, I don't think it's too likely that they would move on poor sales data (remember, 4e only came out a couple of months ago) to changing the GSL in this time frame.

I think it's far more likely that the GSL was so long delayed because of competing pressures between legal, business and those with a closer relationship with the third parties in question. The version was released with agony like pulling teeth with far more restrictions than many would like. In the meantime, those in the company who wanted a different GSL writing kept fighting for another version. The GSL produced a general lack of interest in using the license (and a subsequent closer examination by some of the options available to the third parties if they did not accept the GSL). This was then used to convince the powers that be that a GSL that produced no interest was pretty pointless and needed to be revised.

[Shemeska]

Originally Posted by Brown Jenkin

Well the DDI is still available

Or not as the case might be.

[Mouseferatu]

Originally Posted by Whizbang Dustyboots

To make sure that Orcus doesn't have any regrets in that regard (and I doubt he does, since he didn't have to give back the manuscript, and just did it because he's a mensch), I'll happily preorder Folio of Fiends if you can create any sort of mechanism in place to take such preorders, Clark.

This--unless, of course, I'm in a position to contribute to FoF (which I'd very much like to do), in which case I won't need to order it.

Oh, and bonus points to WD for use of the term "mensch."

[Crothian]

A big thanks to Linae and The Rouse and all the hard workers over at Wizards.

[Filcher]

I would have loved to track Clark's blood pressure these last several months ...

[JVisgaitis]

Any chance of getting some more information by attending the 4e Q&A at Gencon?

[jokamachi]

Wotc played chicken with the 3rd party publishers and lost.

[Darrin Drader]

Originally Posted by evilref

I get that you like to criticise WotC but given you have no idea, making statements like this is just yet another example of poor reasoning and logic.

I find this comment interesting. How exactly is it poor reasoning and logic that would lead me to the possibilities I posted? They are perfectly logical conclusions, and I suspect they carry with them more than just a bit of truth.