Dragonstar 4e?

Negflar2099 · 22nd October 2008, 12:00 AM

I've asked this question before but when I saw the 4e sci-fi thread I was tempted to ask it again (and I didn't want to derail that thread). Basically does anyone know if there's any hope for a 4e Dragonstar? I know as rule set it had its problems but the setting was so good. If it's possible I think a 4e Dragonstar would be incredible. Is there hope or should I just finally give up?

Reveille · 22nd October 2008, 01:37 AM

Fantasy Flight abandoned the property before 3.5 came out. Unless another company buys the rights for it I highly doubt any other product for the line will see print/pdf.

Mustrum_Ridcully · 22nd October 2008, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Negflar2099

I've asked this question before but when I saw the 4e sci-fi thread I was tempted to ask it again (and I didn't want to derail that thread). Basically does anyone know if there's any hope for a 4e Dragonstar? I know as rule set it had its problems but the setting was so good. If it's possible I think a 4e Dragonstar would be incredible. Is there hope or should I just finally give up?

Doesn't look too good, as Reveille described.

Ranger REG · 23rd October 2008, 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reveille

Fantasy Flight abandoned the property before 3.5 came out. Unless another company buys the rights for it I highly doubt any other product for the line will see print/pdf.

What if someone were to make a clone of that setting? It's not like Fantasy Flight Games are the only one to come up with the idea of mixing spaceships with dragons into the setting elements.

Then again, they did come up with a cool name, more likely it is already trademarked.

Aries_Omega · 24th October 2008, 12:39 AM

What if one of three things happen....for that matter has anyone heard of this happening with Dragonstar...if so I'd like to see the material.

Fan Convert to 4E - Under the new GSL can someone do that? Not for profit but for fun?
Fan Convert to 3.5 - Just a small update and all? Doesn't seem too hard.
Fan Convert to Pathfinder (AD&D 3.75) - This is the route I'd like to see myself.

I have really taken to the Pathfinder and cherry picked some things for it. I am waiting for a few products to come out and have my players play with the changed rules more before we change over whole hog.

Dragonstar is one of those setting I am itching to run. I hinted at it existing in my own campaign and all but they have yet to go offworld and all.

Ranger REG · 24th October 2008, 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aries_Omega

What if one of three things happen....for that matter has anyone heard of this happening with Dragonstar...if so I'd like to see the material.

Fan Convert to 4E - Under the new GSL can someone do that? Not for profit but for fun?
Fan Convert to 3.5 - Just a small update and all? Doesn't seem too hard.
Fan Convert to Pathfinder (AD&D 3.75) - This is the route I'd like to see myself.

I have really taken to the Pathfinder and cherry picked some things for it. I am waiting for a few products to come out and have my players play with the changed rules more before we change over whole hog.

Dragonstar is one of those setting I am itching to run. I hinted at it existing in my own campaign and all but they have yet to go offworld and all.

I'm more interested in options #2 and #3, though other gamers would prefer #1. Ideally, I prefer Convert to d20 Modern. It seems more at home with that rules (or Star Wars Saga Edition rules ... minus the Jedi and Force).

Lord Xtheth · 24th October 2008, 03:52 AM

Hm?

How does one aquire the rights to old (extinct?) games anyhow?

GMforPowergamers · 24th October 2008, 04:05 AM

I think Dragon star 4e could be great...imagin the ship to ship combat as...A skill challange.

DM: The enimy ship is fireing on you
Player 1 (Captain) "Sheilds UP" {ooc: can I use my warlord command strike to give someone else a chance...you know As I give the order... DM: ok but only this once...
Player 3 (Tacticle officer) I roll computer use and activate the defences...I rolled a 12 +9 is ...21?
DM: One success your sheilds are holding they are still puring alot of fire power on to you though
Player 2 (Helms men) I roll Piolt...I rolled a 3...use my piolt feat to reroll that...yea 11 +10 is 21!!! "Taking avasive manuvers sir"
DM Nice start to success no failurs
Player 3 (tac off) I retuern fire... I rolled a nat 20...crit
DM Wow way to go 3 successes...as your ship flips through the barrage of fire you shot back, crippling there manuvering thrusters...
Player 4 (Communications) I hail them and offer to except there surrender...Intimadate roll... 5 +8 is 13???
DM No now we have 3 success to 1 fail...they let you eat static and start to hammer your aft sheilds are down to 50%
Player 5 (Engenner) "I'm rerotting power to those sheilds" repair...shot nat 1 +11 is only 12...
DM You over load the generaters, normaly backups would kick right in, but the sheilds are to compramized...your sheilds are down...3/2 not looking good

Player 1: I make a History roll...what do I know of the tactics this ship is useing? I rolled a 19...I am in the 30's
DM Success...but only to help someone else apply a +2 to another member of the crew
Player 1 "Player 3 take the plus." "I see an opening...wait for my command then opening up on there underside..."
Player 2: I want to open our port air lock to depressuriz and push us into a spin...they wont see that comeing...
DM: Um...what...you mean like make yourself out of control on purpose???
Player 2: Yea but planing it out as a betteer evasion...
DM: Roll computer use I guess
Player 2: 19 total...
DM 4/2...those aliens didn't see that comeing...so way to go you get a few seconds to breath...
Player 3 Action point...Use player 1 tac presence then fire a corrdnated shot at the weak point he found.... then I follow it up with a presise shot taking out there aft guns...
DM OK...start with an attack with your +2 and your +3 from the tac lord...
Player 3: I rolled a 16...I total nailed it...
Dm Ok now make a Mechanics check to see if you can pin point those weapons...
Player 3: I rolled a 17...but it is untrained so I missed the DC 20...
DM: 5/3 still got a chance
Player 4: I am going to get fake a broad cast from hyperspace saying back up is on the way...Bluff... I made a 24
DM 6/3 you are getting out of the woods...they apper to be regrouping in a defencive postur..still fireing
Player 5: I want to jurry rig the shields back up...mechanics...I made a 30
DM 7/3 sheild are back at 35%...but holding it looks like you might just make it
Player 1: "put them on speaker...'If you surrender you will not be killed...you have 6 seconds' comm off" I roll intimadate...4 +9 13...man today is not the day for intimadation is it
DM: no it isn't but 4 failed before 8 success...you failed... One last shot rockes the ship as you start to lose those last bit of sheilds...one system failur cascaids to another...scanners...propulsion...weapons...life support. You are dead in the water... Now the pirats in the ship are going to board you......

Ranger REG · 24th October 2008, 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Xtheth

Hm?

How does one aquire the rights to old (extinct?) games anyhow?

Find the IP owner and ask. In the case of Dragonstar, the owner would be Fantasy Flight Games.

Krensky · 24th October 2008, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aries_Omega

What if one of three things happen....for that matter has anyone heard of this happening with Dragonstar...if so I'd like to see the material.

Fan Convert to 4E - Under the new GSL can someone do that? Not for profit but for fun?
Fan Convert to 3.5 - Just a small update and all? Doesn't seem too hard.
Fan Convert to Pathfinder (AD&D 3.75) - This is the route I'd like to see myself.

1. I don't think the GSL would stop you from doing so, but the fan site policy may. (I doubt it will, but stranger things have happened at sea.)

2. This has been done at least once. Dragonstar - Version 3.5

3. How hard this will be depends a lot on the final nature of 3.P. It will probably be no harder then updating to 3.5. The main things that come to mind would be converting the DS specific classes (maybe), races, and the domains.

Personally, I'll probably be spending some time converting it to SC2.0/MC next summer.

Ranger REG · 25th October 2008, 06:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Krensky

1. I don't think the GSL would stop you from doing so, but the fan site policy may. (I doubt it will, but stranger things have happened at sea.)

Technically, it would. Dragonstar is FFG's IP and is subject to the standard IP law. The GSL mandate you abide by the standard IP law, meaning you'll need FFG's permission to use their IP. See GSL Sections 10.2 ("Third Party IP") and 12(d).

Krensky · 27th October 2008, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ranger REG

Technically, it would. Dragonstar is FFG's IP and is subject to the standard IP law. The GSL mandate you abide by the standard IP law, meaning you'll need FFG's permission to use their IP. See GSL Sections 10.2 ("Third Party IP") and 12(d).

The OP seemed to be discussing writing up a conversion of Dragonstar to 4e by fans. I presumed he planned on putting this on a website as HTML or PDF rather then as a product (even a free one) in DriveThru or a hard copy.

The GSL wouldn't even apply unless he signs it, which as you pointed out he couldn't. But I don't think the OP was referring to a product as much as he was a fan project. If the fansite policy has similar clauses, then it would prevent it.

The issue of using FFG's IP would be between the OP and FFG; WotC, the GSL, and the fansite policy would not enter into that.

Kwalish Kid · 27th October 2008, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mustrum_Ridcully

Doesn't look too good, as Reveille described.

Chig lover!

Ranger REG · 28th October 2008, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Krensky

The OP seemed to be discussing writing up a conversion of Dragonstar to 4e by fans. I presumed he planned on putting this on a website as HTML or PDF rather then as a product (even a free one) in DriveThru or a hard copy.

The GSL wouldn't even apply unless he signs it, which as you pointed out he couldn't. But I don't think the OP was referring to a product as much as he was a fan project. If the fansite policy has similar clauses, then it would prevent it.

The issue of using FFG's IP would be between the OP and FFG; WotC, the GSL, and the fansite policy would not enter into that.

As I said (and you have agreed above), you can't use the GSL, technically.

You still want to argue YOUR Statement #1 further?

Krensky · 28th October 2008, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ranger REG

As I said (and you have agreed above), you can't use the GSL, technically.

You still want to argue YOUR Statement #1 further?

The GSL has no impact on what I believe the OP is discussing. The GSL would not apply because he would not be signing it because he does not need it, and it is not applicable to this hypothetical fan based project.

As an analogy, the Sarbanes-Oxley Act does not require me to hire a financial auditor because not only am I not a publicly traded comapny, I am not a buisness, so it's regulations regarding accounting and oversight do not apply to me.

The GSL or the lack of it does not prevent a bunch of people setting up a web site and making Dragonstar crunch 4e compatable, or describing how to massage the setting to make it fit 4e better. The GSL doesn't apply to the project in the first place.

Ranger REG · 28th October 2008, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Krensky

The GSL has no impact on what I believe the OP is discussing.

No, but YOU did brought up the GSL. End of this particular discussion.

As I said before, as much as Dragonstar were able to market a well-known albeit short-lived "D&D in spaceships" type setting, it cannot be the only one. The concept is out of the bag. Draw inspiration from that and create a whole new sci-fantasy setting.

As for Fantasy Flight Games, they had so many potentials but so many opportunities have been wasted, ever since they STOPPED their Blue Planet line. We don't know how far they could take us with Dragonstar but the possibilities are limitless. What a sad, sad company.

Krensky · 28th October 2008, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ranger REG

No, but YOU did brought up the GSL. End of this particular discussion.

Ares_Omega brought it up. I responded that it wouldn't prevent what he said, and then you set up a straw man and launched into an argument.

ProtoClone · 28th October 2008, 11:29 PM

Gah, yes I would love to see a Dragonstar update to 4e.

Derulbaskul · 19th April 2009, 07:05 AM

Does anyone know any sites with 4E conversion projects for Dragonstar?

Starfox · 19th April 2009, 10:11 AM

I don't think Dragonstar would work very well under the 4E paradigm. The 4E classes are locked into roles too tight for dragonstar - or at least, the selection of roles would have to be very different. With Dragonstar's very lethal ranged weaponry, the Ranger would simply outclass everyone else.

People say Twin Strike is badass with a bow. Try it with a laser!