PHB2 Races = Mos Eisley Cantina

[proto128]

I fail to see how this is necessarily a bad thing. Please explain, with less hyperbole if possible.

[Nightchilde-2]

I think the real problem here is...who *really* drew first?

[dmccoy1693]

Originally Posted by Mad Zagyg

It looks like a terrible space fantasy for little kids!

...

When did Spelljammer become the default game world!

It's just so RIDICULOUS! It's like the Mos Eisley Cantina threw up all over the D&D universe.

I wish these designers would ease back on the cheese throttle.

Its always hard when you find out that you are no longer the target demographic of your favorite hobby. Pathfinder is here with waiting arms. Hopefully you can find a place there like myself and so many others have.

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Originally Posted by Nightchilde-2

I think the real problem here is...who *really* drew first?

Good chances that the artist that got his art request first also drew first, but we can probably never be sure.

[Mallus]

Originally Posted by Mad Zagyg

It looks like a terrible space fantasy for little kids!

I feel the same way about the 1e Fiend Folio --and parts of the Monster Manual. Except replace 'terrible' with 'crudely awesome'.

THIS is Dungeons & Dragons?

For about 35 years now.

[twilsemail]

Originally Posted by Mallus

I feel the same way about the 1e Fiend Folio --and parts of the Monster Manual. Except replace 'terrible' with 'crudely awesome'.


For about 35 years now.

Hear, hear.

When I started reading this thread, and the line about "Space fantasy" in particular, I started thinking back to the books that've been sitting on my shelves/gaming table for the past couple of decades. All I can really ask is, "Is this supposed to be something new?" I mean there's always been a touch of space fantasy to D&D, at least for the 20-some years I've been playing. Heck, look at the Githyanki and Githzerai.

[Mallus]

Originally Posted by twilsemail

Heck, look at the Githyanki and Githzerai.

Or mind flayers, which were directly inspired by a pulp sci-fi novel's cover.

[Sarck]

I am looking at the PHB II right now and I really have to work to feel even slightly distasteful towards the page mentioned by the OP. Respectfully, I think the OP needs to learn to use less hyperbole. It's in no way a terrible book, and the new races are intended to be exotic.

Firstly, OP, you say a tavern looking like Mos Eisley is a BAD thing? Think of it in context. Luke goes from living on a farm and dealing with maybe the odd alien once or twice (similar to seeing a few tieflings or dragonborn in town) into a major, exotic spaceport where cultures and peoples mix. It's like taking your human/elf/dwarf 1st level character from their home town to a major seaport and ducking into an inn, introducing them to the myriad fantastical creatures and cultures that spread throughout the greater realm (and the planes). It added a bit of mystery and wonder to the universe that Luke lived in, and it'll do the same for your characters.

Secondly... so variety is bad, in your opinion? And apparently the art is not to your liking? Then ignore the art (are you going to cut out the page and stick it on the gametable? No? Then you can feel safe in rarely ever seeing it again) and limit the races by talking with the DM or using DM-power. PRESTO CHANGE-O, magically you are now able to play with blinders and see only the more traditional races. It'll be like playing 3.x, but streamlined!

Finally, I'd just like to add that while it may be fun to jump on the nearest bandwagon and scream along with the guys at the gameshop about how terrible something or another is, if you'll just look for yourself and actually think about what you're seeing... maybe you'll reconsider getting online immediately and posting about how _____ sucks/destroys all your hopes, dreams and fanciful memories. "THIS is Dungeons & Dragons", eh? No. Dungeons & Dragons is whatever you and your gaming group make it. This is just a book to give some rules for new races and classes. Your childhood memories are safe from those terrible game designers who want to innovate and maybe even make some money for their effort. They can't force you to play the game by their rules.

Don't panic. Just enjoy what you want and look for the positive, rather than whinge about the negative. Maybe I'm crazy for thinking that's good advice. Oh well.

[Klaus]

Originally Posted by ferratus

The dragonborn is just too monstrous to really "fit in" a casual social gathering at a pub or a fancy dress party. This is especially problematic for romance subplots. While all the other PC races are near-human enough to be able to kiss and be relatively assured that they have the proper parts, dragonborn can only really have romance subplots with other dragonborn.

The internet in general disagrees with you. Weirder things can be found online.



But seriously, dragonborn have been described (in the Ecology of the Dragonborn article) as seeing mating/reproducing as a purely mechanical activity, not as a romantic endeavour. So it's quite possible for a dragonborn to mate with another dragonborn for some egg-laying, and still have a platonic romance (Beauty & The Beast-style) with, say, a human.

As for tieflings, they are descendants of evil humans, and their appearance is a testimony of what happens when you make deals with the devils. Some will shun them with prejudice, some will pity them, others will embrace them to demonstrate that not everyone judges a person by their appearance/family history.

[frankthedm]

Originally Posted by dmccoy1693

Its always hard when you find out that you are no longer the target demographic of your favorite hobby. Pathfinder is here with waiting arms. Hopefully you can find a place there like myself and so many others have.

Pathfinder? Nah, come on over to WFRP and burn those mutants at the stake!

Originally Posted by ferratus

I just can't get over the whole "sure you're descended from ultimate evil who betrayed the gods who provide us succor and seek to enslave us and suck out all of our souls to fuel their war against goodness itself, but you've been our neighbours for awhile now so we know you're good people" backstory for tieflings. They just shouldn't be common inhabitants of most small towns, with one operating your local general store in Winterhaven. It really takes the vinegar out of what made tieflings cool in the first place, namely that they're a bad seed.

Sadly Wotc does not want to encourage freakish PCs being lynched, stoned, drowned or Burned at the stake by angry mobs. I heartily recommend it however.

[Henry]

Originally Posted by Nightchilde-2

I think the real problem here is...who *really* drew first?

HAN SHOT FIRST!

[Hexmage-EN]

Originally Posted by dmccoy1693

Its always hard when you find out that you are no longer the target demographic of your favorite hobby. Pathfinder is here with waiting arms. Hopefully you can find a place there like myself and so many others have.

Oh, yeah, this was a totally necessary post that added to the discussion. Thank you so much for your street corner proselytizing.

Seriously, though, how the heck are the PHB2 races that weird compared to many of the other races in DnD's history?

I also happen to like the "Mos Eisley Cantina" feel. The idea of a tavern filled with a cast of diverse and weird characters is awesome. Sometime soon I'm going to feature a bar run by an orc with a "No Mindflayers!" sign beside the front door.

[ehren37]

If goliaths flip your switch, stay far, far away from Oathbound. The telekintetic jellyfish will make your head explode.

I personally love that there's more choices than the same old, same old. Its not like you cant run a traditional Tolkien derived campaign with the stuff in the PhB1.

ANyone want to hazard a guess on PHB 3? From what I gather, it has ki/psiionics. Assuming the same number of new races, Hengeyokai, Spirit folk, Kobolds, Duergar and Xephs seems like a good mix to me.

[chaotix42]

@ Mad Zagyg: Was your whole game store laughing hysterically when they first released the half-orc, goliath, and shifter back in 3e? Or is it only when they're together along with a gnome and deva (another glowing celestial in a long line of glowing celestials) that they become too much for you to stomach? Did you see the FRCG spread with the genasi, drow, eladrin, and other races? You'd probably do a backflip!

Lots of people like pie, but we all can't agree on the best flavor.

[exile]

This thread made me look through my catalog of 4E characters (all made for the LFR campaign and prior to teh release of PHB2). I'd be curious what other players' character selection looks like.

Human x 8
Halfling x 1
Tiefling x 2
Genasi x 1
Half-elf x 1
Warforged x 2
Elf x 1
Dwarf x 2
Dragonborn x 1

Those that have actually seen play include an elf rogue, human cleric (x2), and dwarf wizard.

Chad

[chaotix42]

So far in our games:

Bugbear - 1
Dragonborn - 1
Dwarf - 1
Eladrin - 3
Elf - 1
Genasi - 1
Halfling - 1
Half-elf - 1
Human - 1
Warforged - 1

I'm sure the PHB2 races will find their way in as new games start and old characters die/retire.

[Kask]

Originally Posted by Dice4Hire

I really do not have a problem with any race in the PHBI or PHBII. Having them all be equally common in my world I have major problems with.

I don't have a problem with a player choosing any balanced race. The PC may be lynched and burned at the stake the 1st time they enter a town but that's the players choice not the DMs.

[doctorhook]

Originally Posted by dmccoy1693

Its always hard when you find out that you are no longer the target demographic of your favorite hobby. Pathfinder is here with waiting arms. Hopefully you can find a place there like myself and so many others have.

3E was at least as bad as 4E is for providing all kinds of "circus freak" races, and I daresay that the phenomenon has been a part of the game for plenty longer than that. If such races have been a part of D&D for so long, I'm curious what game Pathfinder must be based upon, that you imply didn't bear the "Mos Eisley Cantina" effect in its adventuring parties. I had thought Pathfinder was based on 3.5E, but that can't be right, given how common the aforementioned effect was in that edition.

[Lord Mhoram]

For years, part of the description of my fantasy campaigns (regardless of system, but 3.x was one of them, as is 4E) - "And major metropolitan areas have a large mix of all the races. When you go into some bars, it looks like the Cantina from Mos Eisley."

So I embrace the new races and look forward to more in future PHs.

[La Bete]

heh.

You want a freak show? Complete Humanoids Handbook (2e). Though one player discovered their own 'Dalek' issue - Wemic + Ladder didn't mix.