General RPG DiscussionDiscussion of all RPGs and non-system-specific topics. DM/GM/player issues, settings, etc. Rules discussion belongs in one the forums below.
Conan retroclone = ZeFRS, for Zeb (Cook)'s Fantasy Roleplaying System.
The Mongoose RQ SRD, as I recall, does not include the characteristic ranges for humans -- or for more than a perhaps not adequately representative handful of other critters. Swapping in scores from a 3E (or 4E?) Monster Manual might be close enough to "git 'er done", though.
Labyrinth Lord and OSRIC2 are quite comprehensive, though.
Right, we can only speak from our own experience and knowledge. It is entirely possible you don't game with people who have the amount of experience I have.
__________________ Being a DM does not require that you check your brain at the door. Much to the chagrin of munchkins & powergamers.
I find it odd when people who've been playing for years tell someone "if you are new to the game, you should start using X", where X is a game different to the one they started with. It's like saying "I don't think you're smart enough to enjoy the old games".
Not at all. They're simply recognizing that the path they took wasn't necessarily the best path they could have taken.
I learned to drive a stick shift by climbing into a friend's pickup truck and lurching around a parking lot all night. Later, I learned to ride a motorcycle, which also involves shifting gears manually. I have since formed the opinion that it would have been easier to learn how to shift on a motorcycle first rather than a pickup. Does this mean that anyone who first learns how to shift gears on a motorcycle is not smart enough to first learn how to do it in a pickup truck like I did? Of course not.
I find it odd when people who've been playing for years tell someone "if you are new to the game, you should start using X", where X is a game different to the one they started with. It's like saying "I don't think you're smart enough to enjoy the old games".
It might be a trick...
When an application offers you the option between "basic", "advanced" and "expert" mode, what do you pick?
Of course, it might also be that they remember having quite a few troubles to learn their first system, and that the new one seems indeed easier.
I don't know. Getting into D&D was hard for me at first. My first game was Shadowrun (3e). I created my first character there and made a lot of mistakes. But I slowly grew to understand the system.
But D&D was so different. Vancian Magic, Hit Points... It all didn't make sense to me. Who'd come up with such an unrealistic system? Spell slots, what is wrong with drain?
Thoughts of the Arch Chancellor - My weblog on EN World - containing game related material, like: house rules, design theories, reviews, play reports, adventure ideas
Secret Member of <Think we would just hide our secret with a spoiler tag, eh?>
It could be that I actually enjoyed that part about being confused and not really knowing very well what it was all about. We started with RuneQuest (3rd edition, I think - the Avalon Hill one) and yes, we mad mistakes, but that were part of the fun. Discovering by ourselves how was it done.
I don't think we would have had as much fun if we had a "beginner-friendly" game as our first experience.
That said, the basics of a RPG aren't as hard as we'd like to think. If you want to do something, roll a die (or a handful of dice) and check the results. That's it. So, when I'm being asked about starting with RPGs, I usually point to the direction where I think the fun is, that is, I recommend a game I've had fun playing. If anything, I limit myself to games which have been published in Spanish, for obvious reasons The only other limitation is that, if I'm trying to hook someone into RPGs, I recommend games which are complete in just one book.
My picks are usually Call of Cthulhu or Aquelarre (Spanish Middle Ages game, with an interesting view of how faith and the occult work), for this exact reason. If RuneQuest was still being published here or we had Spanish language versions of Labyrinth Lord or OSRIC, I would consider that, too.
Right, we can only speak from our own experience and knowledge. It is entirely possible you don't game with people who have the amount of experience I have.
Perhaps you should start charging for your advice. Do you have a paypal account?
I find it odd when people who've been playing for years tell someone "if you are new to the game, you should start using X", where X is a game different to the one they started with. It's like saying "I don't think you're smart enough to enjoy the old games".
Perhaps they just think that some of the new games are better than the choices they were limited to when they started.
__________________ It was one of those nights when you turn out the lights, and everything comes into view
The combat system should be based on the world design. The world design should not be based on the combat system.
My 4 year old ties a towel to her shoulders and pretends to be a superhero. Roleplaying is not between the covers of a book.
As an extension of that, if you tell me that any game is the same just because you roleplay the same, then as far as I am concerned, you don't get the point.
"I just want D&D to run smoothly, palpate my gamer gland, and bring the metal." - A 4E fan
"I've got to have all that, but I require intelligent conversation as well." - Me
Umm, if you are DM who has run his campaign up to that level you know. If you don't, you aren't ready to competently run a high level game and your experienced players will trounce you.
I am a highly competent DM that loves to run EPIC campaigns.
I always have to look up variables and such. I just happen to have a system.
Saying that someone is not competent enough to run high level adventures, or that DMs that run high level adventures are somehow better than DMs that run low level adventures wreaks of Bantha POODOO.
I find it odd when people who've been playing for years tell someone "if you are new to the game, you should start using X", where X is a game different to the one they started with. It's like saying "I don't think you're smart enough to enjoy the old games".
I dunno. If you've been playing long enough, the game you started with is long out of print and harder to find (particularly with previous edition PDF sales being withdrawn).
I started with Basic D&D (Holmes edition) and prefer 3.5. To make a recommendation based on that and for an edition in print, I would recommend Pathfinder.
__________________ Bill D
"There's a fine line between a superpower and a chronic medical condition."
- Doctor Impossible
A new player does not have to start with the 'simplest game'.
I would suggest to choose a genre you wish to play in, then explore game systems. Just accept that your first game session is going to be bumpy with the new system. Usually you can knock out the kinks in the first couple of combats. I am experienced with d20 and still have some bumpy sessions with Mutants and Masterminds, as I only ran 2 sessions. PArt of the problem is d20 assumptions that do not fit in M&M.
What I do before running a new system is a trial for about 3 hours with just myself. I roll up a character or party, and take these characters through some encounters so I can spot potential problems and learn the system from preparation to combat. Basic rules are great for this (like when a system has the watered down rules included).
3rd edition especially at first level is not difficult. You won't be fit to play a werewolf yet but you will get there within a few sessions.
Pathfinder beta is free, complete, and easy. I would suggest starting there.
If you are looking for simplicity I find Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay very simple as well.
Last edited by Mournblade94; 5th May 2009 at 04:21 PM..
Reason: clarification
I would expect that a DM at that level to know roughly what most of those spells do. But there is a difference between knowing roughly what the spells do and specifically what the spells do.
This has been my experience with it. Yeah, I have a good idea of what a spell might do, and 80% of the time I just make the call and move on, but 20% of the time I am nose in book, looking for the spell or effect. Thank heavens for the compendium books, it really cut down the number of books I needed to lug around.
You would probably have players who play rather than flip madly through the PHB trying to figure out what BAB is?
Don't you think you're misrepresenting my position just a little? I'm not talking about knowing how attack rolls are made, I'm talking about knowing that the maximum range of Insect Plague cast by a 13th level cleric is 920'. And I stress that I talk about KNOWING that. Looking it up or making an educated guess is, apparently, a sign that one is not competent enough to DM high level games.
Boy oh boy, if all my players were like you...
__________________ Belphanior
"This is a cool sig."
Don't you think you're misrepresenting my position just a little?
I was making a joke. However, a DM that would introduce a Pit Fiend as an encounter and by game time, NOT know how it operated is somewhat less than competent based on my experience. YMMV.
As far as having a player like me, well, if a DM doesn't know what he's doing he may find his NPCs being flattened like Mini that goes up against an M1A1...
__________________ Being a DM does not require that you check your brain at the door. Much to the chagrin of munchkins & powergamers.
I was making a joke. However, a DM that would introduce a Pit Fiend as an encounter and by game time, NOT know how it operated is somewhat less than competent based on my experience. YMMV.
As far as having a player like me, well, if a DM doesn't know what he's doing he may find his NPCs being flattened like Mini that goes up against an M1A1...
A game that requires me to reference several source books to make sense of a monster stat block might also just be a little too demanding if you want to play every week and have a full work schedule and have other hobbies besides RPGs.
Thoughts of the Arch Chancellor - My weblog on EN World - containing game related material, like: house rules, design theories, reviews, play reports, adventure ideas
Secret Member of <Think we would just hide our secret with a spoiler tag, eh?>
Not a funny one. In fact, it was kind of insulting. Scale back the snark and the ego, please.
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