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Dragonlance was the first setting to really push the idea of a campaign story and I will always love it for that.
I think you may be on to something here. It seems that for FR and GH, the world was created first and plots were then created and scatter throughout that world. For DL, it seemed that the campaign storyline was the main thing and made first and then the world was created to accomodate the storyline.
Well, it was the default vehicle for the fantasy version of SAGA and I really liked that system (even if all of the wrinkles didin't get smoothed out until WotC took some corrective action). More to the point, however, this makes Dragonlance the only official D&D setting to date that has been published for use with a role-playing system other than D&D. That's pretty special.
Not only was Dragonlance the reason I ended up working professionally as a game designer and writer, it was the first world to really get me hooked on the notion of continuity (and, at times, lack of same), characterization, and conflict. Until Tracy and the gang came up with what's arguably D&D's first true adventure path (as opposed to a few linked scenarios a la GDQ and Slave Lords) with its own rich setting, D&D for me was a sort of vague and generic anywhen. I wasn't a fan of Tolkien, didn't read Vance, hadn't heard of Moorcock or Leiber, but Dragonlance woke me up to that and everything since.
I'm proud to have worked for the past six years and change on Dragonlance, and to have contributed to the truly enormous body of work that makes it up. I know it's got its detractors, but that's the nature of genre fiction and gaming. The fans, the creators, and the hundreds and thousands of Dragonlance game-fiends in its 25 years of life are all the reason I need to remain entranced and inspired by Krynn.
it was the first world to really get me hooked on the notion of continuity (and, at times, lack of same), characterization, and conflict.
Yeah War of the Twins was the first non fighting-fantasy or Tolkien fantasy novel I read, I started playing DnD BECMI because of it. Inspiring, and I bet you can guess the name of my Magic User
The bolded bit though, I remember a big WTF moment when I was reading (the 3E? IIRC) rulebook time-line that had Huma, a knight of Solamnia, running around hundreds of years before the nation of Solamnia was formed
The 1e Dragonlance Adventures hardcover was pure, powergamey munchkin-ness at its finest! Irda and Minotaurs FTW!-O
True. But Unearthed Arcana was already out (or was put out the same time) and that was the trend for a bit. But, DLA at least put a cap at 18th level (though most people I knew promptly ignored it in their quest to become a Raistlin clone/killer.)
The bolded bit though, I remember a big WTF moment when I was reading (the 3E? IIRC) rulebook time-line that had Huma, a knight of Solamnia, running around hundreds of years before the nation of Solamnia was formed
No, that was in the 1E version, and one of many many errors in the book. I believe there was an article correcting it in Dragon.
The first couple modules came out before I found the first novel, and they were the biggest, most beautiful thing I had ever seen in D&D up to that time (I think I was 14).
I kinda hated the novels, but IIRC they actually got ahead of the final modules, story-wise, so I read them anyway as a preview of the adventures.
The best thing about Dragonlance is the original adventures. These contain some of the coolest adventure locales ever created. The 3-D mapping that was such a revelation in I6 Ravenloft was exceeded by the maps of the sunken city of Xak Tsaroth, that glorious floating tomb pictured above, and the Tower of High Clerist. Oh, and there's a cursed elven realm caught in a nightmare dream-state, and the players get to infiltrate an evil port city where rivers of lava flow through the city from the surrounding volcanoes.
The thing is, I'm not sure what the appeal of the setting is apart from being the background for the specific adventures in DL1-16.
I've been trying to run a non-railroady reworking of the original adventures for years now. The only problem is, all my potential players have read the novels - except my wife, and the daughter of my best friend. Unfortunately, I think the books ruin the idea of running these otherwise great (if railroady-as-written) adventures.
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Rarely have story, rules and art worked together as well. While the novels did a lot to bring the setting to life, the illustrated calendars really set the bar for fantasy art very high.
I agree. For me, the art has huge appeal. Not only for Dragonlance but for D&D in general. This has never been surpassed in later editions of the game.
A) Never had a campaign setting be more in tune with its art (arguably Dark Sun comes close, but then you have the Baxa pieces...).
B) Never had a campaign setting had better maps. Seriously, i look at those maps again. They SING adventure.
C) Never had a campaign setting created better signature heroes. They might have been cliché, but every character was interesting and had depth.
D) Most importantly: Finally, a D&D Campaign allowed itself to show emotion. No longer were the PCs treated like uncaring mercenary-types. Song and story, loss and tragedy were interwoven (often cheesily, but what did you expect for the first try?) into the adventures.
Heck, one of the modules asked the DM to sing the Canticle of the Dragon to the players!
E) Elmores pr0n: making us look at the legs and not at the dragons since the 1980s.
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I liked Dragonlance's take on alignment and the cosmology of good v. evil v. neutrality and how too much of anything was a bad idea. I mean, the first Cataclysm was caused because there was too much Good in the world al la Istar and the Kingpriest. The characters of Dragonlance were bound more by common cause than moral alignment, and again, no where was this shown better than in the character of Raistlin Majere. You felt sorry for him, empathized with him, even (in a guilty way) liked him, but never for moment did you fool yourself into thinking that he was not evil. All the Companions were very flawed people, and usually got into the most trouble when they tried to deny that fact. It's just that Raistlin was the most well done and prominent example.
In short, Dragonlance as both setting and story actually deemphasized the importance of alignment, and I liked this very much being the moral bankrupt person I am
The Kingpriest? Too much good? Didn't he run some kind of theocratic police state that disappeared its dissidents? And didn't the supposedly good gods murder thousands of people directly (and more indirectly) just because one guy annoyed them? That's an interesting definition of moral behavior.
Me, I've never really seen the need for the world to be a place of murder, robbery, rape, and cruelty. Dragonlance characters, according to their 'Balance of Alignments' theory, see these as necessary, as long as it's not in their backyards.
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The Kingpriest of Istar was actually tested by the gods IIRC (as were other characters in Dragonlance). That's one thing I didn't like about the setting, the gods test the mortals, some of course fail (e.g. Kingpriest, Lord Soth), their failures lead to the Cataclysm, and the gods just leave them with all that mess (which is, of course, just another test).
What I liked most about the setting was the second continent of Taladas. The gnomes there were really badass, building metal ships to fight a war against fire elementals on a sea of lava. Not your typical "1+1=3" tinker gnomes. Also savage jungle elves, degenerate mind flayers, a minotaur-ruled league, proto-draconians, and humans sailing on plains of glass. Taladas had a dark, gritty feel, quite similar to the PoL concept in many places.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keefe the Thief
E) Elmores pr0n: making us look at the legs and not at the dragons since the 1980s.
My only complaint about the modules and setting was that you played the main heroes and thusly were railroaded. I am of the opinion that there are other things going on during the War that player characters can be doing. No war hinges on a small group of scrappy adventurers. Maybe several groups...but not one.
__________________ "Fortune favors the brave". - Virgil (Roman epic poet and author of The Aeneid.) (70 BC - 19 BC)
My only complaint about the modules and setting was that you played the main heroes and thusly were railroaded. I am of the opinion that there are other things going on during the War that player characters can be doing. No war hinges on a small group of scrappy adventurers. Maybe several groups...but not one.
You were not required to play the pregens in the original modules, but it was part of the approach they decided to take in the Dragonlance project that the players would feel they had some part to play in the greater story. The modules had moments of story constraint, but the railroading is nowhere near as prominent as people remember. There's as much if not more of it in 3e modules and adventures, including the Paizo adventure paths.
When we revised the original modules for 3.5, we made sure to keep the idea of archetypes and roles, but made sure it was possible to make up your own party of characters. The adventures don't need you to have Raistlin, but they do need a Sage, for example. This worked out pretty well, I think.
I am no fan of the Hickman Railroad, but that's no warrant to knock the setting. The original modules feature some pretty splendid locales and NPCs, and the wider world has plenty of distinctive flavor.
The grim situation of a continent reeling from cataclysm, plunged into war, and deprived even of its gods was certainly striking: a milieu in which iron was truly more precious than gold!
Well I don't consider the modules a railroad. They were there to allow people to play the books, if you wanted a normal adventure then you shouldn't buy the DL1-9(?can't remember, I have them in my shelf somewhere). If you are railroaded in a module which is not based on a very famous and popular series, then complain. But the DL series was not a railroad.... they were just pretty poor modules
I agree that the original modules weren't as "railroady" as people believe. I recall the first module starts sandbox style. You get to run into different encounters around the area pretty much at your leisure before running into the main plot.
I suspect DMs trying to stick to the novels were partially responsible for this perception.
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For me, the really unique thing about Dragonlance was how they took alignment and made it an important, even central aspect of the whole setting.
The wizards of High Sorcery are divided by alignment, yet all united; the gods form three pantheons based on their location on the good-neutrality-evil axis; the whole struggle between Paladine and Takhisis, and the Ansalon-spanning wars that ensued; elves, humans and ogres as the original good, neutral and evil races; and perhaps most impressively, the good vs. evil dragons!
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How so? I think they hold up very well today. Even if you remove the "Dragonlance" trappings, for the most part, they were good modules. Sure there were some holes and a few unbalanced encounters. but they had great environments, interesting things to meet & kill, and lots of opportunity to roleplay.
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