General RPG DiscussionDiscussion of all RPGs and non-system-specific topics. DM/GM/player issues, settings, etc. Rules discussion belongs in one the forums below.
I haven't played SotC, but I can say that the little thingy where you write the novel blurbs to tie your characters together before the campaign actually starts? That's now a permanant, required houserule for every game I ever run ever again. No matter what system.
That made such a huge difference in the last game I ran (am running still, actually) that I can't imagine ever not using it again.
I think I'd be tempted to incorporate the mustache somehow -- "It's The Mustache, Right?", or something like that. But that might be too silly, I dunno.
That's not too silly. In fact, it's perfect.
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You could tag it maybe when you're trying to help out said sucker, or when you yourself have been suckered...
Thanks, that's what I was missing. For some reason I couldn't see the how that Aspect might be beneficial. Obviously, it helps you accomplish things while you're being suckered. Also, it might make some people who once duped you take pity and help you out.
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I might try compelling "So Easy..." to get you to act overconfidently ("of course you should KO the pilot; you can always land the plane -- it's so easy, a caveman could do it!"), or otherwise bite off more than you can chew.
Yup, that's how I see it working.
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I might, as GMIt would fit more easily if the aspect were "Square Peg, Round Hole - No Problem", or along those lines.
I like that. Primarily I see SP/RH as the ability to temporarily fix devices through a combination of ignorance and violence. Of course, this breaks the device (after working for a short, dramatically appropriate period of time).
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So, the GM might compel this to have you sapped from behind, and carried off to meet some miscreant or otherwise wake up in a precarious position.
I see the character being compelled to hit the wrong person at the wrong time.
__________________ "We're pimps and killers, but in a philanthropic way." -- Boyd, Dollhouse.
-- that seems unfair, since the player probably intends that they be the BONKer, and others be the BONKee...
Yep. Initially I was thinking of a stunt that let me bring a club --actually a 'long-barreled .44 Magnun' used as a club-- to a gunfight and win. This morphed into a more general tendency to leap before looking.
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I feel like Square Peg and Caveman have a lot of overlap -- which is good, since you can tag both for a +4 to the roll! -- but something I tend to try to avoid.
I see Square Peg as being a sort of caveman Fonzie, fixing things by hitting them, and So Easy as the ability to drive a car or fly a crop-duster without any training (because those things just aren't as hard as they look). Should they be a single Aspect?
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You might consider taking something like Mastadonian Physique or similar to reflect your Cro-Manon construction; as is, you wanted to be the tough guy but don't actually have anything that makes you hard to knock out.
Done. Though I'll call it 'Built Caveman Tough' or some such.
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Edit: the mustache, PI License, and block-of-ice could both form good aspects too. ::shrug::
And done.
__________________ "We're pimps and killers, but in a philanthropic way." -- Boyd, Dollhouse.
Yep. Initially I was thinking of a stunt that let me bring a club --actually a 'long-barreled .44 Magnun' used as a club-- to a gunfight and win. This morphed into a more general tendency to leap before looking.
Makes sense. You can usually find something to use as a club in a scene, so you only really need the aspect if it's a really defining part of who you are. Your take on it sounds fun and is definitely reasonable.
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Originally Posted by Mallus
I see Square Peg as being a sort of caveman Fonzie, fixing things by hitting them, and So Easy as the ability to drive a car or fly a crop-duster without any training (because those things just aren't as hard as they look). Should they be a single Aspect?
Purely a matter of taste. As a DM, I can't really think of any situations where I'd let you use Square Peg where I wouldn't let you use Caveman, but I can think of a few where you could use Caveman but not Square Peg. Neither is really Compel-fodder, so the only reason I could see (mechanically!) to have both is so that sometimes you could have +4 to rolls to fix things.
I'd axe one of those, personally, but it's valid to leave them both.
Edit PS: another BONK! compel: Hit first, ask questions later, to lash out in surprise or break something when a gentler touch would have been helpful (such as when opening a bottle or something).
Last edited by Lackhand; 10th June 2009 at 09:04 PM..
One thing you might want to look at if want to take SotC out of its 20s/pulp roots is Starblazer adventures from Cubicle 7. I believe it was just released in print, but you can also get it as a PDF. It gives you spaceships, agency, aliens and technology rules that you can port over to the system in general.
I ran a game set in the Firefly universe before having this, and in hindsight it would have been soooo much easier with these extra rules. Still, the game was a fantastic success and sold my group on rules light games.
I wish you a fantastic summer of gaming!
--Steve
__________________ Be a rebel...order your coffee in one of these three radical sizes: small, medium or large.
"Sure as I know anything, I know this. I aim to misbehave."
--Capt. Malcolm Reynolds, Serenity
I play 4E, and it's every bit as much Dungeons and Dragons as any other edition, including the one(s) you play. No more, and no less.
As a DM, I can't really think of any situations where I'd let you use Square Peg where I wouldn't let you use Caveman, but I can think of a few where you could use Caveman but not Square Peg. Neither is really Compel-fodder, so the only reason I could see (mechanically!) to have both is so that sometimes you could have +4 to rolls to fix things
I think I'll drop Caveman then. Square Peg is easier to Compel --and that's an important part of choosing Aspects, isn't it?-- since it implies that the thing being forced to work might break.
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Edit PS: another BONK! compel: Hit first, ask questions later, to lash out in surprise or break something when a gentler touch would have been helpful (such as when opening a bottle or something).
Nice! I'm definitely going to use that. I see some shattered Ming vases in my character's future.
__________________ "We're pimps and killers, but in a philanthropic way." -- Boyd, Dollhouse.
One thing you might want to look at if want to take SotC out of its 20s/pulp roots is Starblazer adventures from Cubicle 7.
I'll check it out.
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I wish you a fantastic summer of gaming!
Thanks! If everything goes according to plan, we'll be playing SotC, "little black book" Traveller, and the last act of long-running my "Chronicle of Burne, et al" 3.5e campaign.
__________________ "We're pimps and killers, but in a philanthropic way." -- Boyd, Dollhouse.
Thanks for posting about this, and especially for the Wiki link. I'm very intrigued.
__________________ Ryan "RangerWickett" Nock
Author of the War of the Burning Sky serialized novel, free at EN World. Part Two, The Irons Have Tolled, now available.
One thing you might want to look at if want to take SotC out of its 20s/pulp roots is Starblazer adventures from Cubicle 7. I believe it was just released in print, but you can also get it as a PDF. It gives you spaceships, agency, aliens and technology rules that you can port over to the system in general.
I ran a game set in the Firefly universe before having this, and in hindsight it would have been soooo much easier with these extra rules. Still, the game was a fantastic success and sold my group on rules light games.
I wish you a fantastic summer of gaming!
--Steve
Just got finished reading it and it adds some nice stuff to the SotC experience. Some good GMing tips and tools, and lots of good examples. I agree it would be a perfect fit for a Firefly-ish game, or something similar to Slipstream (B-movie scifi).
I too have gotten the SotC bug. I am not a huge fan of straight pulp, but the rules are easy to use for fantasy as well.
I think that the biggest problem with the SotC/Fate rules is that they have begun to ruin me for other games. I can't play other games without wanting to houserule in aspects and chargen phases/novels. Those might be my favorite game mechanics of all time.
I am working on a homebrew that uses SotC as the major mechanical framework, while adding in some of the design goals of 4e and adding in the keys of Shadow of Yesterday. I get aspects and integrative chargen, rules light system, with a very inovative XP system, and a semi-class/level based and tactical system, with some narrative elements in a somewhat old school "rulings not rules" approach. Haven't played the hack, and I am still working on details, but it is coming together.
SotC is rules light enough that you can make it what you want, while retaining an interesting amount of tactical RPG elements. Best game ever.
Last edited by Nameless1; 11th June 2009 at 07:15 PM..
Reason: typo
I too have gotten the SotC bug. I am not a huge fan of straight pulp, but the rules are easy to use for fantasy as well.
My Advice? Use SotC with Eberron. It fits like peanut butter and chocolate.
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I think that the biggest problem with the SotC/Fate rules is that they have begun to ruin me for other games. I can't play other games without wanting to houserule in aspects and chargen phases/novels. Those might be my favorite game mechanics of all time.
Don't feel bad. I'm trying to figure out how to implement Aspects effectively into 4e. With Rel's Power Stunts fueled by Action Points, I may just have a method.
It's become one of my go-to games, along with Spycraft 2.0. Great, wide-eyed, quick, empowering.
I definitely recommend the faster conflict rules linked earlier. Sometimes characters seem too empowered and invulnerable; it helps keep the players on their toes.
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Originally Posted by Lackhand
The rules-light nature can sometimes get on my nerves a little ("Whaddya mean I don't get a bonus for attacking from above without expending a resource?!")
That sounds like a maneuver for the aspect "superior position" or somesuch.
Anyways, the rules light crowd tend to rip on SotC for having feat-like stunts. Just can't win, eh?
That said, I do think that it's not very simulationist, though Starblazer Adventures has some rules that are more simulationist and makes gear a bit more important.
__________________ "This game requires no gameboard because the action takes place in your imagination..." - Cover of Dungeons & Dragons Basic Rules Set 1.
Could you provide a link to Rel's Power Stunts? I would like to check them out.
Spoiler:
There's not a whole lot to it, but here's Rel's houserules. The basic premise is this: You want to do something that your character SHOULD be able to do, given their power set, but there aren't rules for it. Such as a cleric of Moradin calling down the might of the Mountain god to collapse a cave, preventing Drow from retreating. Or a fighter picking up a boulder off a pinned kid. Or a ranger shooting the rope supports on a rope bridge to drop the orcs charging across it into the ravine below. To something like this, you need a power stunt.
To execute a power stunt, you spend an Action Point + A Healing Surge. This grants an Encounter-equivalent power. In Rel's game, PCs have charged through a portcullis, used Nature to coax a dead enemy's griffon mount to let them ride it for the encounter, and modify their existing powers on the fly.
I honestly don't know if the power stunts require rolls (Skill check or Attack), but I assume they do. Rel hasn't really posted hard and fast rules for them aside from the AP + Healing Surge = Power Stunt formula.
Anyhow, the way I figure Aspects play into this, is provoking Compels from PCs in order to give them Action Points. With the Action Points, they can do Power Stunts. So far, I haven't figured out a method of PCs tapping their own aspects, as to what that would do mechanically. I'm thinking maybe they get to re-roll on an roll that suits their Aspect, similar to the reroll SotC allows. But the +2 to a roll (which is large in SotC's system), I think I might avoid; it migh tbe too broken, considering all the other options for 4e PCs.
All of you should really check out Starblazer Adventures. It adds so much to the FATE system. It's very easy to use all the guidelines for crtitters, powers, organisations, vehicles etc. for SotC pulp. Just reskin.
On another note. There's a fantasy supplement on its way by the Starblazer guys. It sounds absolutely amazing, letting you play everything from the farmboy that knows the Queen's true name to Exalted, with Conan and LotR in between.
I've applied to be a playtester and am holding my breath!
I'm not too keen on some parts of the game - I like it when most dice roll modifiers are based on the tactical situation rather than the narrative - but I think the Aspect-related parts of character creation is brilliant. It gets you in the right mood before the game starts - and it gives you a reason why the PCs know each other and are able to work as a team...
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Does anyone know how well it works in Play-by-Post games? It would seem with Aspects this is a system that requires rulings right in the middle of the action, which would slow PbP down.
Does anyone know how well it works in Play-by-Post games? It would seem with Aspects this is a system that requires rulings right in the middle of the action, which would slow PbP down.
I've never tried it, but you'd have to be pretty draconian in terms of when you allow aspect tags/invoke. I think you'd lose a lot of the fun.
Consider the following play snippet (it really happened in my game):
DM : The gobelin leader howls to his minions to "attack" and hits you with his axe. 6 minions... he got an 8.
Meg : I dodge. Uh, 6. I tag his "Mighty Big Axe" -- it's too slow to hit me -- so we tie.
DM (having not hit anyone recently ) : Hrm. His muscles bulge. "Mighty Thews". He's up +2. In fact, he's also going to tag the pyre behind you ("on fire") -- his reach is longer and faster than you think and it drives you into the embers, he's up +4.
Meg : Ew. Uh, I'm going to tag "quick brawler" -- he's up +2, and I'll take that as stress.
That's a lot of posts.
Similarly, every exchange in combat involves a lot of back and forth -- you can't even resolve a successful hit without input from all parties.
You could try it, but I wouldn't recommend it.
But it's _awesome_ face to face!
Consider the following play snippet (it really happened in my game):
BTW, thanks for the concrete example of a fight scene. Some questions:
Do you flat-out tell players what Aspects the NPC's and environment have at the start of a scene?
Do you choose all the environmental/NPC Aspects beforehand or stick to text descriptions, assigning Aspects on the spot (bit of both, I'm guessing)?
edit: now I find myself wanting to convert my soon-to-be-off-hiatus 13th level 3.5e campaign to SotC. The current plan is to convert it to M&M2e/W&W (an easier system for me to run than high-level 3.5e). But SotC seems like such a terrific way to describe the PC's. Running jokes would become their actual character abilities (specifically, 'Not in the Face', 'In His Hands Cowardice is a Deadly Weapon', 'He's Covered in Blood Again', 'I Bottle It!').
I wonder if I could sell my guys on this...
__________________ "We're pimps and killers, but in a philanthropic way." -- Boyd, Dollhouse.
) : Hrm. His muscles bulge. "Mighty Thews". He's up +2. In fact, he's also going to tag the pyre behind you ("on fire") -- his reach is longer and faster than you think and it drives you into the embers, he's up +4.
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