Resource Management in RPGs

[Alex319]

Here's an interesting observation I made about resource management in some RPGs (and there are lots of RPGs that do this.)

In real life military operations, wilderness expeditions, survival scenarios etc., there are a lot of mundane resources that have to be managed - things like rations, light sources, medical supplies, etc., as well as intangible "resources" like military intelligence, troop morale, navigation, and logistics that are essential for peak performance. (In fact, the majority of a modern army consists of support troops rather than front line fighters.)

In RPGs, however, most of these considerations are downplayed or ignored, either by avoiding having rules for them or by introducing easy ways to bypass them (e.g. magic items or spells that can generate food and water, and relatively easy healing). This is done because it's "not fun" or "tedious" to have to worry so much about all tht mundane stuff.

Now, to the extent that RPGs are supposed to emulate heroic fantasy, this makes perfect sense. In the Star Wars movies, you didn't see Luke Skywalker counting out how many medpacs he had left or calculating how much fuel it would take to make it to the next star system.

However, many RPGs introduce their own, new resources that have to be managed - e.g. hit points, healing surges, magic item charges, spell uses, "hero point" type things in systems that have them, etc. And these aren't generally considered tedious. And of course in terms of emulating heroic fantasy, including these doesn't make sense - after all, you didn't see Luke Skywalker calculating how many "force points" he had left either.

---

So, now that I've made this observation I'll introduce a few questions for discussion:

1. Why is it that the "mundane" resource management (rations, fatigue) is generally seen as tedious, while the "fantastic" resource management (power uses, item charges) isn't?

2. Would it be possible to design a game system where "mundane" resource management takes center stage, and is as important to the game as the "fantastic" resource management is in games like D+D? (Do such systems already exist? How well do they work?)

I don't know the answers to these questions, I just thought this was an interesting observation.

[Herremann the Wise]

While some might even consider discussion about such things tedious, I think you raise some interesting points. In the end, I think it comes down to what the RPG is all about. D&D at its core is adventuring, killing monsters and taking their stuff. Rations, light sources and medical aid are not as important as hit points etc.

However, I think the deeper issue here is that they are not as complex. You either have sufficient rations for nutrition or not. You either have light or you don't. You can either be healed or you can't (although this last one is a little more complex). In terms of detail, there's not much to them. I think this is why they are just as easily ignored by some. Perhaps the other reason why they are not as exciting is that they only deal with penalties rather than bonuses. If there was a little more carrot in the rations, they might just be a little more interesting to focus on.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise

[Cadfan]

Originally Posted by Alex319

1. Why is it that the "mundane" resource management (rations, fatigue) is generally seen as tedious, while the "fantastic" resource management (power uses, item charges) isn't?

Because checking off something like rations or arrows is repetitive, time consuming, and has little effect on your overall chance of success in the typical game, because rations and arrows are trivially cheap in the overall design scheme of the game and can be carried in amounts that make counting them a formality. Power uses, on the other hand, have an immediate effect on the course of the game each time they're used, both through their use and their absence afterwards.

If you ran a game where firing an arrow was as much of an expended resource as, say, using one of your only three diamonds as an indispensable component in raising an ally from the dead, people would care about counting arrows. But if you play a relatively generic D&D game where a player can stuff a few hundred arrows into some magical bag every time he goes to town, no one will care about the arrows.

2. Would it be possible to design a game system where "mundane" resource management takes center stage, and is as important to the game as the "fantastic" resource management is in games like D+D?

I'm sure it would be possible.

Do such systems already exist? How well do they work

I've played Battletech recently, and while I think the game has certain fundamental flaws due its age that are not relevant in this conversation, it provides an example of what you're looking for. You don't track rations in it per se, but in a campaign you do track things like salvaged lasers and smashed heat sinks. Tracking these things, while occasionally tending towards the tedious, can be a lot of fun because you're at a constant risk of losing important weapons and components you need to succeed, yet you've got a constant chance to salvage and gain even better gear.

The key, I think, is that the resources tracked have to matter. Tracking rations in a game where you can easily afford as many rations as you need isn't that exciting. Same with arrows. And you can create them with magic. And you can hunt for food and make your own arrows. It just doesn't DO much to track them.

But put the party in a situation where tracking these items actually matters to their success or failure, and they'll probably start having fun tracking them.

[Bumbles]

Encumbrance and rationing only serve a limiting role to the players, not to the DM. That's why.

[howandwhy99]

Originally Posted by Alex319

So, now that I've made this observation I'll introduce a few questions for discussion:

1. Why is it that the "mundane" resource management (rations, fatigue) is generally seen as tedious, while the "fantastic" resource management (power uses, item charges) isn't?

2. Would it be possible to design a game system where "mundane" resource management takes center stage, and is as important to the game as the "fantastic" resource management is in games like D+D? (Do such systems already exist? How well do they work?)

I don't know the answers to these questions, I just thought this was an interesting observation.

1. It just isn't as fun to keep track of only mundane items. Mundane stuff, by which I take you to mean things from the real world, are pretty well known. There is little to no exploration left for a lot of this stuff. No surprises. No, "Is it really a magical item in disguise?" like questions. The answer is always no. It's always just a normal hammer, earring, garden pruner, drapery, wooden shuffleboard set. Which means it's probably more fun to play with this stuff in the real world, live action, than in an imagination-based, table top game.

2. Every single non-hobby RPG uses mundane resources for the players to maintain.

EDIT: See the sig.

[nightwyrm]

The nature of D&D where characters tend to wear on their bodies more wealth than some nation's GDP makes tracking cheap, mundane stuff like arrows and food meaningless.

[Victim]

Game resources are contained within the game and fully described there. So relevant knowledge can obtained just by looking at game rule books. Also, while you can forget to use a useful game resource, you generally can't forget to have it entirely.

OTOH, planning a wilderness expedition is far more about information not explicitly covered by the game text. That can lead to more significant disagreement, or rather nebulous GM dependent consequences. Also, a lot is set by your initial supply decisions, which can have significant delayed impact.

It can also lead to the people who like camping (or whatever) basically taking over the game.

[BraveSirKevin]

Rations and water and stuff like that can generally be overlooked in most D&D situations... Unless of course they're taking a 5 week trip through barren land with nary a tavern in site. Ammunition on the other hand seems a little more important. If you only have 20 arrows at the outset you kinda need to make them last. Ditto with healing potions. I somehow doubt your average quiver holds more than 30 arrows, and even that sounds like a lot to me. Of course you can always retrieve your arrows once the monsters are dead (assuming they didn't break)

This is exactly why I made my Counters. Makes it a lot easier to keep track of those things for both the player and the DM.

[EP]

I can't think of anything where tracking mundane items was essential to the game, but it's very possible given the system is designed as a realistic combat system. Modern settings would probably get more use out of this than others.

How many magazines are you carrying for your assault rifle? That determines how many shots you fire per round and how often you need to reload. Your choice of weapon then determines how many fresh mags you can find lying around which still fit in your own weapon. But once you break out supernatural powers, uses/day, mechanoids and their ammo, then it does become tedious (save for those who thrive on that stuff). Until computerized character sheets become the standard and not the bonus, tracking one aspect seems the most comfortable way to go.

[Ariosto]

Actually, old-style D&D has plenty of "mundane" resources to manage -- and not as much of the other sort as many newer games (including some by the same name) -- and not because people think, "Hey, let's make a really tedious game!" Tastes vary.

Sometimes there's a question of how much record keeping really adds. In many scenarios, the absolute supply of small arms ammunition is not really significant except perhaps for automatic weapons. One could simply assume reloading -- until a dice-roll indicates that someone has lost track in the heat of battle and needs to take action requiring more attention.

Likewise, precise accounting of funds is not always regarded as worthwhile. A character might simply have a "resource level". Noting the expenditure for each bus fare, telephone call, newspaper, or sandwich and cup of coffee might be extreme for Average Joe -- and Tony Millionaire might buy a new car or hop aboard a private aircraft without a second thought.

When resources are scarce and important, then it's time to get more specific. Running out of torches in the depths of a dungeon could be trouble!

[FireLance]

Originally Posted by Alex319

1. Why is it that the "mundane" resource management (rations, fatigue) is generally seen as tedious, while the "fantastic" resource management (power uses, item charges) isn't?

I think the key issues are consequence and replaceability. Mundane items tend to either have minimal consequences if a PC does not have them (e.g. many game systems have few or no consequences for skipping a meal) or be easily replaceable (so that even if the PCs run out, it is usually trivially easy to obtain them), or both. Thus, I believe that many players don't spend more effort on management of mundane items beyond thinking "How much of mundane item X do I need before I can replace them?" and then writing that number down on their character sheets.

On the other hand, fantastic resources often have significant effects when used, or are less easy to replace, or both, so players find that it is worth the effort to track them and to carefully consider when to use them.

However, I believe that the difference is one of scale rather than any inherent quality of mundane or fantastic resources. At low levels, many PCs find it worthwhile to track mundane resources because they can only be replaced at (relatively) significant cost. And at higher levels, should fantastic resources have minimal consequences relative to the PCs' abilities, and be easily replaceable, I believe the players will also spend less effort to track them, e.g. wands of low-level healing spells in 3e.

2. Would it be possible to design a game system where "mundane" resource management takes center stage, and is as important to the game as the "fantastic" resource management is in games like D+D? (Do such systems already exist? How well do they work?)

As mentioned, low-level games are likely to involve the tracking of mundane resources because they tend to more significant relative to the power level of the PCs, and replacing them is not trivial relative to the PCs' resources. In order for mundane items to remain relevant at higher levels, this must continue to be true as the PCs grow in levels. This usually does not happen in games like D&D because fantastic resources often replace mundane resources, e.g. spells and magic items replace mundane food and drink, and magical ammunition replace mundane arrows and bolts. Hence, one way to ensure that mundane items remain relevant is to ensure that there are no magical substitutes for whatever mundane resources you want the players to continue managing.

[Mallus]

Originally Posted by Alex319

1. Why is it that the "mundane" resource management (rations, fatigue) is generally seen as tedious, while the "fantastic" resource management (power uses, item charges) isn't?

Two reasons:

1) RPG characters typically has fewer "fantastic" resources to manage. A few booming spells and a hit point total, as opposed to quite a few rations, torches, arrows/bolts/sling stones, dry socks, etc.

2) Certain resources/tools are sexier. Spells that cause foes to explode or do more varied reality-defying things are simply more interesting than torches or bricks of rations.

Note that there are more magazines devoted to guns and fast cars than there are to dry socks and butter knives (even though the latter are quite nice in their own way).

Would it be possible to design a game system where "mundane" resource management takes center stage, and is as important to the game as the "fantastic" resource management is in games like D+D? (Do such systems already exist? How well do they work?)

What would the point be?

[Stalker0]

Fantastic resources are resources of "awesomeness". Having more spells makes me more awesome, having more hero points makes me more awesome. Having more food doesn't really do that. That's why those resources are worth tracking and more mundane ones are not.

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Another reason for the preference for "heroic"/"fantastic" resources over mundane resources might be that it's easier to create rules for made-up stuff than for things that exist.

How could you determine whether a travel adventure with mundane resource management is fair? How often do you need to place food sources and water sources, and how do you ensure the players have to be smart to find them, but not too smart? ANd how do you all that without it seeming "unrealistic"?

That a monster can use its Breath weapon in 1d4+1 rounds or that your daily attack power returns only after a 6 hour rest period doesn't hurt the believability of the situation much, since that daily attack power and the breath weapon don't map to something easily identifiable in our average lives - in fact, most oft the time not even in non-average lives (like that of soldiers or firefighters or survivalists).

[MichaelK]

We do use mundane resources.

We've had in game discussions before about what our group of adventurers would make for dinner and looked at the listing of spices and cooking ingredients on our equipment list.

We like our games to 'feel real' and part of that is thinking about the non-adventuring parts of life. Our equipment list includes pots and pans, exotic food items, shaving kits, sleeping bags and entertainment items.

We'd go on adventures if the reward was a fine cigar or nice clothing. I've turned down magic items before because they clashed with what my character was wearing and I doubt I'm alone in our group.

Not surprisingly our group usually has a wagon and several pack animals.

We don't find it tedious. We also appreciate that other people may have different ideas about what's fun. YMMV but we find mundane resources far from tedious.

[Mallus]

Originally Posted by MichaelK

We like our games to 'feel real' and part of that is thinking about the non-adventuring parts of life. Our equipment list includes pots and pans, exotic food items, shaving kits, sleeping bags and entertainment items.

We'd go on adventures if the reward was a fine cigar or nice clothing. I've turned down magic items before because they clashed with what my character was wearing and I doubt I'm alone in our group.

Our group is similar, but we don't keep track of mundane-yet-colorful items.

For example, my paladin is just assumed to have on his person several journals half-full of his verse, a bottle of Pernod, and fireworks. Periodically he removes some gold from his total to represent expenditure on his signature stuff.

And several members of our group would probably commit murder for a good cigar or rare bottle of brandy... they're like that.

[Doug McCrae]

Originally Posted by Alex319

1. Why is it that the "mundane" resource management (rations, fatigue) is generally seen as tedious, while the "fantastic" resource management (power uses, item charges) isn't?

Because arrows are a lot more plentiful than fireballs.

[Doug McCrae]

Originally Posted by Ariosto

Actually, old-style D&D has plenty of "mundane" resources to manage

New style D&D has a lot too, in fact I think it may have almost as much as old school. By RAW, 4e for example keeps track of encumbrance, money, arrows etc, rations and light sources (though there are everburning torches and light is an at-will wizard spell). I think there's a suggestion in the DMG that the DM might consider waiving ammo-counting.

Personally I find keeping track of all that stuff tedious. I'd like to see a more abstract wealth mechanic in D&D though that would be a big departure from 3e and 4e where money is a very important resource. Imo the numbers are too big for money, which is what makes it fiddly. That and keeping track of silver and copper pieces. In more than one 3e game I played in, it felt like half the session was spent calculating how much treasure everyone got.

EDIT: And another thing I don't like in D&D - experience points. Again the numbers are way too big, they're very unwieldy. And then you're expected to add 5% or 10% or whatever? I much prefer systems such as Mutants & Masterminds where I can give out small values of xp - 1-3 points. For me it really is 20 minutes of fun packed into 4 hours a lot of the time.

[Ariosto]

Doug, it is pretty easy to drop decimal places -- and the ratios (which are the really important thing) remain the same! It need be no more complicated to dispense with accounts than to wave one's hand, especially if players are not interested in becoming capitalists.

Thrud the Shield-Maiden might simply be assumed to have on hand whatever her usual kit is, especially if by custom she travels light. Perhaps an occasional ability or skill check might be tossed to see whether some needful thing has been acquired or brought along.

[Barcode]

Available supply makes a big difference. Cheap, plentiful resources are not interesting, and the party is always assumed to have enough. However, if you are going on an expedition to uncertain lands (deep in the desert, into the swamp, the Underdark, the Forbidden Jungle), I like to have the party specify what they are bringing with them as part of their planning. That way when they are deep in the giant tree in the middle of the swamp and the cultists just won't. stop. coming. then the number of arrows/spell components they packed suddenly can be an interesting statistic.

Picture the movie Aliens, especially if you have seen the deleted scenes. Did the Marines think much about how much ammo they were packing when they were all gung ho and dropping in to kick ass? Hell no, until it started running out, then it was one of the most interesting elements of suspense in the movie.