General RPG DiscussionDiscussion of all RPGs and non-system-specific topics. DM/GM/player issues, settings, etc. Rules discussion belongs in one the forums below.
Piracy is boarding ships violently, and taking cargo and/or captives (potentially for ransom or resale). Piracy is an activity where lives are lost.
Infringement of Intellectual Property is not piracy.
I'm not really keen on getting into another semantic slapfight with you, RC, but simply put, illegal copying has been called "piracy" for a very long time now, and loaded or not, it's in the common lexicon and a mutually-understood term suitable for communication. You're a few decades late for this argument.
I'm not really keen on getting into another semantic slapfight with you, RC, but simply put, illegal copying has been called "piracy" for a very long time now, and loaded or not, it's in the common lexicon and a mutually-understood term suitable for communication. You're a few decades late for this argument.
-O
Centuries, actually. The first use of the term piracy related to this sense was, what, 1602? 1603? Somewhere around that time, anyway.....as was the first criticism of "piracy" being used in that context.
However, one can only be "late for this argument" when it is done. And it will not be done until we stop using the term in this way.
(But you are free to refrain from slapfighting, of course.)
RC
__________________ [A]ny good dungeon will have undiscovered treasures in areas that have been explored by the players, simply because it is impossible to expect that they will find every one of them.
RCFG - My free mostly-OGC OGL game! RCFG is intended to be a fusion between OS & NS playstyles, giving the advantages of SRD-based gaming coupled with quick character and adventure generation and an Old School feel.
Actually, this should be a discussion of usage in context, not strict definition - the term "piracy" in these cases is usually used in phrases like "digital piracy", "software piracy" etc.
It's also about connotation. "Digital Piracy" vs. "Digital Emancipation", for example.
And none of these usages in context or connotation have any legal meaning, so it's all moot anyway.
Actually, this should be a discussion of usage in context, not strict definition - the term "piracy" in these cases is usually used in phrases like "digital piracy", "software piracy" etc.
It's also about connotation. "Digital Piracy" vs. "Digital Emancipation", for example.
And none of these usages in context or connotation have any legal meaning, so it's all moot anyway.
And I don't really care.
Durn. I just XPed you for deh funny, and now I can't XP you for deh smarts.
RC
__________________ [A]ny good dungeon will have undiscovered treasures in areas that have been explored by the players, simply because it is impossible to expect that they will find every one of them.
RCFG - My free mostly-OGC OGL game! RCFG is intended to be a fusion between OS & NS playstyles, giving the advantages of SRD-based gaming coupled with quick character and adventure generation and an Old School feel.
Wizards realy need to take another look at releasing pdfs. With the tech thats coming out or already has, they are missing out. The fact that I can carry a kindle dx with 4th ed pdfs(which I purchased before being pulled), pathfinder core book pdf, and other third party pdfs is a great advantage. It stead of carring dozens of books all I need is the Kindle dx. I even have characters sheets on it. I can have any game system on it if it is in pdf format. This makes going to cons alot more fun. In the near future I can see gamers sitting around multitouch tables playing rpg games.
Lets say we are playing 4th ed. I could tap the players hand book on the table. Bringing it up, Look at what I need and send it back to the background.
__________________ something wicked this way comes
The fact that I can carry a kindle dx with 4th ed pdfs(which I purchased before being pulled), pathfinder core book pdf, and other third party pdfs is a great advantage.
Last time I checked, the regular Kindle/Kindle 2 had an experimental PDF reader, while the larger (and more expensive) Kindle DX has a fully supported PDF reader.
The Kindle Dx has native pdf. I have had a few problems with some pdfs, but I found a way to fix them. I picked up a peice of software called pdf creator. By running any problem pdfs throuth it solves the problem. For instance, if you use the character builder to create a character all you can do is print it out. with this software it gives you the option to print it in a pdf file. then it loads perfectly on the Kindle Dx. I use Hero lab to create my character sheets. With this software you can create 3.5, 4th, and pathfinder character sheets as well as some other game systems, if you get the upgrades. This lets you create pdfs and print characters.
__________________ something wicked this way comes
No, the argument isn't about what anyone is. It's that the act of downloading RPG PDFs from torrents/limewire/etc. is piracy.
-O
Fine. Then I shall simply point out that if one person has downloaded one RPG PDF from Torrent at any time to which they were legally entitled, you are wrong.
Last time I checked, the regular Kindle/Kindle 2 had an experimental PDF reader, while the larger (and more expensive) Kindle DX has a fully supported PDF reader.
I like that the Kindle DX has a larger screen compared to older models, but at that price, it really should do color. Does anyone know how much actual memory storage there is for storing PDFs only - Amazon says 3,500 books, but that isn't really helpful since most books are mostly text.
After seeing this, I'm definitely interested in Kindle again, but I think I may wait until I can do full color and be able to read things like digital comic books.
The means by which some companies go about preventing infringment of intellectual property borders on (and in some cases, crosses far over) privacy rights of individuals. Should we begin to call this corporate activity "Piracy" as well?
Tradtionally, unethical financial gain has been termed "corporate raiding," so that would seem to be a reasonable extension. Obryn, it is never too late to reframe a debate using terms that are less loaded and more accurate. Or more, as the case may be. It is an interesting sleight of hand to compare the illegal downloading of Beegees songs to a crime that once upon a time was a hanging offense.
The Kindle Dx has native pdf. I have had a few problems with some pdfs, but I found a way to fix them. I picked up a peice of software called pdf creator. By running any problem pdfs throuth it solves the problem. For instance, if you use the character builder to create a character all you can do is print it out. with this software it gives you the option to print it in a pdf file. then it loads perfectly on the Kindle Dx. I use Hero lab to create my character sheets. With this software you can create 3.5, 4th, and pathfinder character sheets as well as some other game systems, if you get the upgrades. This lets you create pdfs and print characters.
I like that the Kindle DX has a larger screen compared to older models, but at that price, it really should do color.
Color e-Ink displays are still experimental, I think. And LCD's aren't great for e-Book readers. Whether a Zune HD-style LED display would be, I don't know.
right now I have 41 pdfs and about 5 pictures on my knidle dx. I still have 2408 mb free on the system. One of the nice things is the battery life. I can leave it on for days before the battery runs out.
I also have a whole album of music on it.
__________________ something wicked this way comes
Last edited by falcarrion; 5th October 2009 at 06:49 PM..
Fine. Then I shall simply point out that if one person has downloaded one RPG PDF from Torrent at any time to which they were legally entitled, you are wrong.
Sigh. OK, if you're going to set up strawmen, and intentionally misconstrue what I'm saying, I can see where this is going and we're done. Or do you really, actually think I was claiming that getting legitimately free & legal stuff from torrents is piracy?
Quote:
Originally Posted by pawsplay
Obryn, it is never too late to reframe a debate using terms that are less loaded and more accurate. Or more, as the case may be. It is an interesting sleight of hand to compare the illegal downloading of Beegees songs to a crime that once upon a time was a hanging offense.
You and RC can play semantic games all you like, but I'm not going to play along. The term, "PDF piracy" is easily understandable to whoever's reading this thread. It's a common - even dictionary-based - definition, and I won't play the redefinition game where a few folks are abducting common, easily understood words and phrases for their own purposes.
Nobody's going to get confused if we talk about RPG book piracy. Nobody is going to think I'm taking about hijacking a container ship and stealing physical books. Nobody is going to think it's a hangable offense.
right now I have 41 pdfs and about 5 pictures on my knidle dx. I still have 2408 mb free on the system. One of the nice things is the battery life. I can leave it on for days before the battery runs out.
I also have a whole album of music on it.
Thanks again, falcarrion!
Dang - this thing just might end up on my Christmas list...
Also, just so we're perfectly clear here, I'm 100% in favor of reducing the penalties for copyright infringement, massively shortening the duration of copyright, and making the existing laws either more sensible or completely absent. I'm appalled at the RIAA's and MPAA's piracy witch-hunts. I also think it's undeniable that piracy helps products achieve greater popularity, but remain agnostic on whether or not it helps sales - when competition is based on price, it's tough to compete with "free". I'm not of the opinion that copyright laws line up directly with morality, and I'm not of the opinion that enforcing copyright is always the path to greatest profitability.
All of this is besides the point, though. The laws are the laws, and I'd rather work on getting the laws changed and elect congresspeople who want them changed, than pretending they somehow work differently than how they actually work. Any legal argument you're making in this thread is one that would have to fly in front of a judge or jury, and precedent is not - so far - in your favor.
Just because I think a law is ridiculous does not make me exempt from it, though. It's one of the concessions I need to make for the privilege of living in this society.
In 4E you don't really need PDFs. Ever. You don't need any rulebooks present, you just need your character sheet. I regularly DM with no books at the table (unheard of when I played 3.0/3.5). DM might find some use in the Compendium..which is a live web application.
So what use would that Kindle even be? A netbook that can reach iplay4e.com or DNDInsider.com is of much more use. When I write my own adventures I post them on a live document site (I use writer.zoho.com, but it could just as easily be Google Wave or Google Docs or something similar).
__________________ The Fearless DM(standard; at will; recharge )
You and RC can play semantic games all you like, but I'm not going to play along. The term, "PDF piracy" is easily understandable to whoever's reading this thread. It's a common - even dictionary-based - definition, and I won't play the redefinition game where a few folks are abducting common, easily understood words and phrases for their own purposes.
Um.....We are suggesting that referring to downloading (illegal or not) as "piracy" is a nasty semantics game, intended to introduce moral ambiguity, that we do not feel like playing along with. There are many common definitions and beliefs that fall under the same rubric.
Dictionary definitions are based on useage. A definition is included in the dictionary because a word or phrase is used that way -- admittedly, this can become circular. There are many, many terms included in the dictionary, some of which are always offensive, and some of which (such as this one) are only mildly offensive.....The offensiveness arising in this case from the attempt to influence public thinking using a nasty semantics game.
RC
__________________ [A]ny good dungeon will have undiscovered treasures in areas that have been explored by the players, simply because it is impossible to expect that they will find every one of them.
RCFG - My free mostly-OGC OGL game! RCFG is intended to be a fusion between OS & NS playstyles, giving the advantages of SRD-based gaming coupled with quick character and adventure generation and an Old School feel.
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