General RPG DiscussionDiscussion of all RPGs and non-system-specific topics. DM/GM/player issues, settings, etc. Rules discussion belongs in one the forums below.
Ha ha. Nothing personal. I've read your entries from earlier tournies, and they're great. If you changed your name to some derivative of "wik", I'd be cheering for you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by phoamslinger
since Veritas hasn't acknowledged, I'll push the start back to 6pm tonight.
ALTERNATELY
would Wik or Pour like to jump the queue and start now against Brent?
Yeah, I don't mind doing it at all.
__________________ Current Campaign:The Shattered Isles Homebrew - Hammer (Minotaur Fighter 8), Kirra (Drow Rogue 8), Shedin (Dragonborn Paladin 8), Zahar (Half-Eladrin/Half Drow Bard 8), and Seahorse (Halfling Rogue 8). Currently the group is in the Feywild, trying to discover who is poisoning the drow.
OK then, Brent_Nall and Wik starting in just a few minutes from now, going to 6pm Sunday. I will be judging...
(Pour and InVinoVeritas, your match will start at Noon on Sunday.)
***
a short introduction for those who don’t know me.
I won the first Nutkinland Iron DM tourney and I’ve run a couple of them since (including the Iron Tapestry, which if Nemm ever gets it up on his site is a full 20+ level campaign setting as well as a blast to read). I like thinking outside the box and creative usage of the various ingredients. So if you spin me a tale of a group of women who hire the group to rob a bank, escaping through a swamp where they have to fight a hydra using a magic potion, I know which one I WON’T be picking for the win. in other words, a generic plot device hires the PCs to rob a generic target in a generic setting, fighting a generic monster with a generic magic item is not the way to go. stretch your creativity a bit here guys and girls.
another thing I look hard at is why the ingredient is there. if I can replace the hydra with an ogre or a group of troglodytes and it would make no major difference to the plot, I’m not as impressed. (the best example of this I ever saw btw, the ingredient was Brass Buttons: the secret villain was recognizable by the buttons on his clothes, but when he made his escape through a crevice, the buttons popped off his vest providing the clue who had committed the crime! that item could not have been replaced with anything else without changing how the scenario ended, therefore it was integral to the overall story.)
I also look for links between the ingredients; how does the first relate to each of the others, how does the second relate to the rest, etc.
so be creative and tell a good, fun story and you’ll do well.
and your ingredients are there!
Last edited by phoamslinger; 10th October 2009 at 12:05 AM..
Just to check, I work typically from 8am-7pm EST Mon-Fri... I don't think I would have had the opportunity to see that the round would exist at any time today.
It was a lot harder than I thought it'd be! My ingredients were tough to gel together cohesively, for sure.
__________________ Current Campaign:The Shattered Isles Homebrew - Hammer (Minotaur Fighter 8), Kirra (Drow Rogue 8), Shedin (Dragonborn Paladin 8), Zahar (Half-Eladrin/Half Drow Bard 8), and Seahorse (Halfling Rogue 8). Currently the group is in the Feywild, trying to discover who is poisoning the drow.
I have nothing but respect for everyone who does this. I would love to participate, but there is no way I have enough time to do so (I barely have enough time to keep up on the forums)
Perhaps next time I'll have more time and will be able to participate, we'll see. For this time, good luck all, and I look forward to all the entries!
the Iron Tapestry, which if Nemm ever gets it up on his site is a full 20+ level campaign setting as well as a blast to read
Agreed! That's an incredible piece of imagination and worldbuilding, and I sincerely hope to see it accessible some time soon. It's in fact the reason I'm doing this in the first place, I found it so inspirational.
For what it's worth, I'm utterly terrified of my turn coming around, and simultaneously can't wait. This could be rough, but dammit, I'm going to submit SOMETHING no matter how tricky the ingredients!
For what it's worth, I'm utterly terrified of my turn coming around, and simultaneously can't wait. This could be rough, but dammit, I'm going to submit SOMETHING no matter how tricky the ingredients!
Wow...another early submission! If I have any time left over after writing my adventure, I think I would be tempted to continue polishing and adding to it right up to the buzzer. I hope it doesn't count against me if I use every single minute of the time available to me...
I saw on the previous page that Iron DM is 'edition-neutral'. But is it 'game-neutral' too, or just aimed at D&D? I didn't see that anywhere...
Thanks!
It is game-neutral, but... use discretion.
Usability is a criteria for judgment. If your entry is only usable in some custom homebrew game system, it's not gonna win. Likewise, a less-used game (like SW Saga or d20 Modern) has a usability gap that must be compensated for with that much more awesomeness in all other areas.
Also, many ingredients are drawn from D&D's iconic landscape. If you get the ingredient "Grell", for example, you'd better do a damn good job convincing me that at least one "Grell" belongs in whatever game and/or setting you choose.
Grell in d20 Modern? Plausible.
Grell in Exalted? Hoo boy.
That said, you may be inspired to create such a work of overwhelming awesomeness, that it more than compensates for your game and/or setting handicap.
So basically: use discretion.
"You Do Your Best, We'll Do Our Worst!", -- N
__________________
Brevity is the soul of wit, so trim your sig or look dumb.
Now that I have posted my judgement, I'll hang around here for the ritual of abuse and second-guessing . . . . lord knows I've been doing it to myself long enough over this match. There was a whole lot to like about both entries, it was a far tougher choice that I expected.
holy crap! I came here first, before the judgment... let me take a look and come back for the mutual backslappin'...
Ok. Everything sblocked in case judges or others don't want to see it:
Spoiler:
This is key for me:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Judge Radiating Gnome
Holy Avenger - This one should have been just about as easy to work in as the Slaad -- obvious handles to bring this into the story. But in KMD, the appearance of the holy avenger seems to be an out-of-place afterthought. The setup for the whole adventure -- that this is meant to serve as an object lesson in the "lawful" part of "lawful good" creates some serious expectations for me. I'm expecting that there will be some clear standoff between the two -- with the inevitables creating the situation where the law must be honored before the good. In that setting, the Holy Avenger almost seems like it would be the tool of the opposition. Instead, it's part of a matched set -- the holy and righteous avengers -- and we're told that the paladin PC is given "one of them" but not even which one. It's also possible to read the adventure with the Paladin serving the role of "holy avenger" -- he is called upon directly to avenge the dead guardsmen -- but I found that also very problematic in an adventure that is meant to be putting law and justice ahead of all other concerns. Revenge is not lawful, it is not judicious; it's personal and emotional and chaotic, and my sense is that the command to bring ur-Valos to justice was replaced with a commandment to avenge the slain people to create this second reading of holy avenger . . . . but I find that out of place. It's possible that with some broader explanation the role of Horatio as the voice of the people and the "good" could serve as a counterpoint to the voice of the inevitables, the law -- but I don't see that developed in this particular writeup. I think that in KMD there is ambition to reach beyond the obvious use for Holy avenger that don't pan out, while the usage in BoC is predictable but it works. Advantage BoC.
I think this is a very apt observation. I was very aware that the Holy Avenger was probably among my weakest ingredients.
First, let me see that I tried to work the ingredients into multiple places-- the Reticent Constable is certainly Claudius, but also perhaps the Kolyarut; the holy avenger is a sword but also perhaps the paladin himself, etc.
No question it was weak.
It's a really hard ingredient to get in-- there's no call for a holy avenger against (the obvious antagonists) the slaad: They ain't evil.
Barring that ingredient, I am confident that the seeds of a really good investigative, instructional adventure are here. Free from the shackles of the competition, this is an entry I can see myself blowing out later.
So... Immediately after saying that I don't pander to the proclivities of the judges, I'm left with the obvious fact that I sneaked through this round by the skin of my teeth by... getting lucky on the proclivities of the judge.
(FYI: There was no other literary "visitation of three ghosts" analogue intended.)
Despite the fact that I'm happy with the basic premise and setup of my entry, I don't have the same confidence in my use of the ingredients, and given a different judge-- particularly Phoamslinger, and his exhortation to make sure that all the ingredients are used in a unique and non-interchangeable way-- I would certainly have lost this round.
So I feel that my entry-- in addition to this mea culpa-- has really done nothing other than raise the bar on myself for the next round.
I'll do my best to carry the "Former Champion" banner high on Wicht's behalf and give these newbies wot's wot.
Last edited by Wulf Ratbane; 11th October 2009 at 03:37 AM..
They were both great adventures, too. And a very hard list of ingredients - particularly the Wind Skerries and Constitutional Monarchy.
__________________ Current Campaign:The Shattered Isles Homebrew - Hammer (Minotaur Fighter 8), Kirra (Drow Rogue 8), Shedin (Dragonborn Paladin 8), Zahar (Half-Eladrin/Half Drow Bard 8), and Seahorse (Halfling Rogue 8). Currently the group is in the Feywild, trying to discover who is poisoning the drow.
In my life I have entered all sorts of competitions, both physical and mental, rational and creative.
I have found that Iron DM is almost unique in its ability to engender both an intense desire to win as well as the inescapable conclusion that losing is a mercy.
(I should run for public office. I bet it feels the same.)
I just hope, Wicht, that in 7+ years . . . oh, nevermind.
It was a real challenge to judge the two of you in my first outing as a Iron DM judge -- me, just some big-nosed git and you two such long-standing luminaries around here. I had to make it a point to refer to the name of the adventure, and not the authors, to try to keep myself steady.
Looking back at this thread, I can see that the other two judges have had a much more active hand in here than I have, and since my proclivities ended up being the deciding factor in this match, maybe a little background about me is appropriate . . .
There are a few of the early Iron DM competitions that I took part in back in the bad old days -- if you look back in the archives, you'll find that I've never won . . . you'll see me grow up a lot in the course of a few rounds of play, too. Iron DM is one of those trials by fire that really can help us grow.
I'm going to be interested in much the same things (and using the same core system to evaluate entries) as Nifft and Phoamsinger -- they're both way smarter than me, anyway. When we get down to personal tastes and leanings, I'm going to be drawn to good story, good writing, and adventures that scratch the sort of itches that I'm frequently trying to scratch in my own games -- how do we make our games about more than just beating the snot out of scaly monsters? How do we take advantage of RPGs to be more than just a complex wargame? If you can do even a little of that, in the crucible of Iron DM . . . limited time, ingredient lists on loan from Torquemada, and a supply of opponents who apparently have no need to work, sleep, eat or attend to other responsibilities . . . well, then I think you're going to go far in this thing.
I just hope, Wicht, that in 7+ years . . . oh, nevermind.
No worries. I'm more mature than I was then.
I used to think that if I liked it, everybody must like it. But one grows to recognize that taste and opinions fluctuate wildly and while there is no accounting for some opinions, everybody has one. Which is why I stated above that one should never assume one has this particular contest in the bag before the judgement comes down. I made that mistake my first time up but I try not to anymore.
And, as Wulf said, defeat has its own rewards. I'll have more free time now for other things.
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