What characters are you thinking about running?

[Voda Vosa]

Well I have an oriental themed campaign going on, so I thought it would be rather repetitive to play a character from there.

[Brain]

I'm working on a Kobold rogue character.

For background, I wanted him to be from a Kobold tribe living underground near the dwarves at Mykonos' sanctuary. I'm just not sure if I'm interpreting the sparse information about the sanctuary correctly.

Here's what I have so far on his background.

Vixo hatched in a Kobold community under the hills the island where Mykonos Sanctuary is located. He enjoyed a privelidged upbringing among the brood of the primary matriarch of a prominent claw (tribe). Well fed and with plenty of free time, he developed into a strong, healthy adult who took advantage of those around him. His coming of age ceremony saw him named Vixonostrak Guenwing and he was proud, for one day he would join a strike team and raid the dwarves like so many before him. Before that would ever happen, his world would come crashing down.

The community warren was suddenly under attack from all around! Their dwarven enemy had come to wipe them out, with a fighting force like never seen before by these kobolds. The Matriarch desperately tried to escape while the third wave of metal-clad dwarves crashed through the cavern wall. Vixo fought carefully, moving from area to area, trying to fight where the kobolds had the advantage of numbers. Eventually he could no longer find such a fight, and was cornered. He offered his surrender to the invaders, and to his surprise, it was accepted. He learned later that his captor was a very practical dwarf by the name of Halrum Ironflow, who would keep Kobold prisoners as slaves.

Life as a servant in the Ironflow clan of dwarves was hard, and he did his best to keep out of sight when possible. Still, he was treated well enough and was able to scrounge leftovers from their meals, which he cleaned up after. He only learned a couple words of the dwarven tongue in his time with them. For yet again, trouble was imminent.

Now, the Dwarves were under attack!

I'm not sure who the Brotherhood of the Bright Eon are or what they did to the dwarves - any info on that?

[Graf]

It's interesting. A lot of people who are going OA flavor are doing stuff with githyanki.

I expect Kingdom characters at some point, but the 'dark' near-apocalyptic element may turn people off.

[Graf]

Brain,

The wiki in this area is... terrible. (It's my fault so I can say that...).

As written Mykonos' Sanctuary was a very peaceful mining community located near Daunton and protected by a powerful monastery.

Then the Cult infiltrated the Monastery leading to the Days of Darkness;
This would launch a series of attacks, most of which weren't identified as being coordinated attacks at the time (example:the headquarters of the Brotherhood of the Spun Staff would be destroyed (becoming the Shattered Spire))
the Five (link is just background, nothing about the brotherhood) ultimately perished stopping the eldrich thing that they unleashed.

During the time that this was going on the dwarves had a very difficult time (touched on briefly here).

The "story" as written about Mykonos' Sanctuary is about corruption in a peaceful community; having them be (another) area that was actually under attack from humanoids raises some issues.
1. Why weren't the kobolds dislodged by the powerful monks (or the five); the five made it a policy to keep the proximate isles reasonably clean; (the repeatedly cleaned up Bacarte for instance)
2. Why weren't they corrupted or dealt with by the brotherhood? (who are presented as being a potent enough force that a concerted attack by non-five Daunton adventurers couldn't dislodge them)
3. Mykonos' Sanctuary obviously isn't a peaceful community if it's under attack by kobolds. How does it change?
4. Broader effect on monstrous races. Daunton and the proximate isles accepts "monstrous" races partially because there is not a recent history of violence. The Rain of Steel was over a hundred years ago, and most threats come from cults, etc.

If we're going to have a vicious group of murderous humanoids that were so tough they couldn't be disloged by the five, or by the monks then that would probably adjust the attitudes of locals (they view Mykonos' Sanctuary very well, the dwarves were good neighbors for centuries and the metals and minerals they supplied are/were an essential part of the economy) to make them more hostile against kobolds.

Since that would adversely effect all kobold PCs I'm somewhat leary.

However if you just want to have kobe a kobold from Mykonos' Sanctuary that's another story.

It's possible that there was a tribe of kobolds who dwelled beneath the isle and were violent at one point, but were pacified (to a degree at least). They may have initially escaped notice of the brotherhood and then helped some dwarves.

Sorry this is so long. Just thinking out loud.

[Halford]

Well I am thinking that I would like my next character to be either a Shadar-Kai or a Drow. Mainly because I think there is a good opportunity to expand upon the flavor of both races.

I do not want to play the good Drow though, or Shadar-Kai for that matter. So I am thinking of creating a Princeling from a diposed ruling family, evil to the core, but resourceless amongst his own people. Which raises another issue.

Evil PCs are advised against in the PHB, are we allowing them? I assume we are since we already have at least one - who is approved.

[covaithe]

I remember looking at that evil PC's background/personality and thinking "this could be unaligned", but the PHB is kind of wishy-washy in its description of evil, as usual.

It all comes down to what "evil" means. If it means actively devoted to the cause of an evil deity, or evil for its own sake (e.g. torturing psychopath, politician, etc.), then I'd suggest we disallow evil characters. If it just means that you're out for number one and willing to do just about anything to get ahead... I see no reason not to allow that. We could save "evil" for the former and call the latter "unaligned", but there's so little in the RAW now that affects evil vs. unaligned characters differently that I'm not greatly inclined to care.

[Halford]

You have summed up my opinion rather nicely there to Covaithe.

[Dunamin]

Originally Posted by Halford

I do not want to play the good Drow though, or Shadar-Kai for that matter. So I am thinking of creating a Princeling from a diposed ruling family, evil to the core, but resourceless amongst his own people. Which raises another issue.

Evil PCs are advised against in the PHB, are we allowing them? I assume we are since we already have at least one - who is approved.

Originally Posted by covaithe

I remember looking at that evil PC's background/personality and thinking "this could be unaligned", but the PHB is kind of wishy-washy in its description of evil, as usual.

It all comes down to what "evil" means. If it means actively devoted to the cause of an evil deity, or evil for its own sake (e.g. torturing psychopath, politician, etc.), then I'd suggest we disallow evil characters. If it just means that you're out for number one and willing to do just about anything to get ahead... I see no reason not to allow that. We could save "evil" for the former and call the latter "unaligned", but there's so little in the RAW now that affects evil vs. unaligned characters differently that I'm not greatly inclined to care.

Consider me a very strong advocator for allowing evil PCs that are handled maturely. Now that effects which determine alignment are purged from 4E I think it’s perfectly viable, and I certainly think there’s room in the game for playing Evil alignment and provide an enjoyable play experience without being a psychotic loony.

The PC in question also seems pretty clearly evil to me. He murdered everyone who was aware of his presence in his past and every last member of his former crew. Being a doppelganger, he is more suited than most to play Evil since he has an easier time getting away with vile deeds.

[Brain]

Originally Posted by Graf

Brain,

The wiki in this area is... terrible. (It's my fault so I can say that...).

As written Mykonos' Sanctuary was a very peaceful mining community located near Daunton and protected by a powerful monastery.

Then the Cult infiltrated the Monastery leading to the Days of Darkness;
This would launch a series of attacks, most of which weren't identified as being coordinated attacks at the time (example:the headquarters of the Brotherhood of the Spun Staff would be destroyed (becoming the Shattered Spire))
the Five (link is just background, nothing about the brotherhood) ultimately perished stopping the eldrich thing that they unleashed.

During the time that this was going on the dwarves had a very difficult time (touched on briefly here).

The "story" as written about Mykonos' Sanctuary is about corruption in a peaceful community; having them be (another) area that was actually under attack from humanoids raises some issues.
1. Why weren't the kobolds dislodged by the powerful monks (or the five); the five made it a policy to keep the proximate isles reasonably clean; (the repeatedly cleaned up Bacarte for instance)
2. Why weren't they corrupted or dealt with by the brotherhood? (who are presented as being a potent enough force that a concerted attack by non-five Daunton adventurers couldn't dislodge them)
3. Mykonos' Sanctuary obviously isn't a peaceful community if it's under attack by kobolds. How does it change?
4. Broader effect on monstrous races. Daunton and the proximate isles accepts "monstrous" races partially because there is not a recent history of violence. The Rain of Steel was over a hundred years ago, and most threats come from cults, etc.

If we're going to have a vicious group of murderous humanoids that were so tough they couldn't be disloged by the five, or by the monks then that would probably adjust the attitudes of locals (they view Mykonos' Sanctuary very well, the dwarves were good neighbors for centuries and the metals and minerals they supplied are/were an essential part of the economy) to make them more hostile against kobolds.

Since that would adversely effect all kobold PCs I'm somewhat leary.

However if you just want to have kobe a kobold from Mykonos' Sanctuary that's another story.

It's possible that there was a tribe of kobolds who dwelled beneath the isle and were violent at one point, but were pacified (to a degree at least). They may have initially escaped notice of the brotherhood and then helped some dwarves.

Sorry this is so long. Just thinking out loud.

Thank you for the reply. I envisioned the dwarves being more removed/autonomous from the monastery, living underground. If they are surface-dwellers, then my idea makes a lot less sense.

Basically I want to have my character have been captured/enslaved from his kobold society. Then probably enslaved again in turn by a stronger force. Then eventually rescued by military or adventurers - one of them a fighter who saw the potential in and took pity on the kobold and hired him on as a squire/lackey. That person would then travel to daunton, where the kobold ends up on his own somehow.

It doesn't have to be rooted in Mykonos at all. I just saw that it had rapid changes in power from peaceful to brotherhood to imperium and figured I could work it in there.

Any suggestions on a different location that seems more appropriate? I kind of liked the idea of squiring to an imperium soldier, but can change to something else.

[covaithe]

The Kobolds entry in the character creation bit suggests the Empire of Hzaka and Bacarte as where civilized kobolds come from. As for uncivilized kobolds.... I think there could be bands of kobolds raiding as minor nuisances just about anywhere. MK's sanctuary is almost unique in having a backstory that makes this difficult. If you want to keep the Dwarf connection, you could use the Valley of Bone with its Dwarven kingdom. That would let you keep your background almost word for word. Allaria would also work, since it seems to be kind of war-torn and disorganized, and I'm sure there are kobolds around there somewhere. The slavery thing kind of points to Hzaka for me, since it seems like a sort of evil-empire feature rather than something common in Daunton and its immediate surroundings, though it could easily be there in the Valley of Bone, too.

I've been thinking a lot about the Valley of Bone region recently, brainstorming for a possible future adventure set there. I won't go into details, since it's going to be a while before I get the time free to take on another game, but I might well try to come up with some more detail at some point. It really needs fleshing out.

[Brain]

I had an inspiration - I think I'm going to scratch the dwarven thing. I could find almost no information on Hzaka (other than it seems to be big and full of humanoids). I think I'm going to forgo having a region at the start and just tie in being found/rescued by a dragonborn fighter adventurer and brought to Daunton.

[Valthosian]

I'm playing an evil drow rogue so the last couple pages are of course of great interest to me

My take on my character is not that he's the chaotic spread the evil everywhere and plunge the land into darkness type, simply because that's just not profitable. He's in it for himself, he's morally unbound, that doesn't mean if a kid is about to get run down by a cart in front of him, he won't help, though it is very likely he won't risk himself in the process.

It doesn't mean that he can't have loyalties, even loyalties not based on greed or advancement. The evil displayed by the drow of RA Salvatore or the fiends etc is to me very one dimensional. I'm far more interested in a character who would lie, torture, steal, murder, when it's in his interest, and yet fight to the death standing over the unconscious form of a companion who he values. Maybe you could argue that such a character is neutral, but to be neutral suggests to me that one is actively trying to maintain a balance in their actions.

As for my rogue, I tried to draw on the drow in Daunton angle with the temple of day and night, and left as much of his race's origins as vague as possible until it gets more meat added to it, if someone is working on that I'd be happy to provide some input as at this time I think Step is the only approved Drow in L4W.

[Brain]

Anybody got an idea of how old a young adult kobold would be?

[Atanatotatos]

An overzealous fanatic of the Supreme Pun-pun...

[garyh]

Originally Posted by Brain

Anybody got an idea of how old a young adult kobold would be?

I'd guess about the same as a human, maybe a little younger.