That was an alright episode - unfortunately tremendously marred by the lazy retcon.
Ben took Rousseau's baby? Meh. If that were the case, she would have popped him one when she first caught him as "Henry Gale" in her net. (And suggesting otherwise would simply be reaching and making things up, AFAIC.)
Rousseau's primary secondary* motivation was to get her kid back, and killing Ben wouldn't have done that. In addition, it had been years since Ben took Alex; if that was their only meeting, she might not have recognized him as being the guy (Rousseau was a little bit crazy, after all).
*Rousseau's primary motivation would have to have been survival, to have managed to avoid death by Smoke Monster, time-displaced fellows, off-island interlopers (cf. Desmond, Clancy Brown, Nigerian heroin smugglers, etc), Others, polar bears, dead friends, and so forth, for 15+ years, while all alone.
Heck, given that she did somehow survive all that, she may have had a tete-a-tete with Jacob, Richard, the Monster, or some other entity in the meantime that somehow ameliorated her rage against Ben.
__________________ - Bob Huss
[H]e's dead and poisoned and possibly insane on another plane. It's a very stylish death, but a definitive one. - Piratecat
Ben took Rousseau's baby? Meh. If that were the case, she would have popped him one when she first caught him as "Henry Gale" in her net. (And suggesting otherwise would simply be reaching and making things up, AFAIC.)
Alternatively, she thought that killing Ben would be sure to end in Alex's death, as he threatened when he took her. In which case, she did the next best thing - turn him over to the "good guys." Hardly "reaching and making things up."
Alternatively, she thought that killing Ben would be sure to end in Alex's death, as he threatened when he took her. In which case, she did the next best thing - turn him over to the "good guys." Hardly "reaching and making things up."
Yet, from what I remember, she gave absolutely zero indication that this was the guy who took her baby, not even mentioning "oh guys - btw, he was the one who nabbed Alex. Just sayin', as you go on and on debating as to if he is even a member of the Others in the first place". Not even facial expressions, tone, nothing. (Can anyone go back and definitively see if she expressed any form of recognition?)
I'm going to have to go with "reaching". Sorry.
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Originally Posted by coyote6
Rousseau's primary secondary* motivation was to get her kid back, and killing Ben wouldn't have done that.
See above.
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In addition, it had been years since Ben took Alex; if that was their only meeting, she might not have recognized him as being the guy (Rousseau was a little bit crazy, after all).
Not recognize the guy that stole her baby? Highly unlikely. And note that any time one must explain away logical inconsistencies, flaws, and retcons with "she's crazy" is a significant blemish on the show.
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Heck, given that she did somehow survive all that, she may have had a tete-a-tete with Jacob, Richard, the Monster, or some other entity in the meantime that somehow ameliorated her rage against Ben.
That would be the "making things up" I alluded to with my previous post.
*shrug* It was a retcon. While it made for a good, tight episode, it hurt it as a (already scattershot) series. If we're lucky they'll come up with something to make it fit (as Lost is in the enviable position of being able to re-insert what scenes they need when they need it).
Last edited by Arnwyn; 14th April 2009 at 05:24 PM..
Reason: might as well respond to 2 related posts in one
It was almost certainly a retcon, but I don't have a problem with it; if that was the only time she saw him, then it was a guy she saw once (for what? 90 seconds?), 15+ years before, right after she just woke up, and then she lost her kid. Stress does can really futz with memories, and she certainly seems to be a person that's high-strung. I don't find it unbelievable that she wouldn't immediately recognize Ben as the guy.
__________________ - Bob Huss
[H]e's dead and poisoned and possibly insane on another plane. It's a very stylish death, but a definitive one. - Piratecat
great episode. Nice backstory on Miles, and the Star Wars tie in was great.
__________________ "And once again, tithing is 10% off the top. That's gross income, not net. Please people, don't force us to audit. Now I'm going to pass this around a second time. Brother Ned, you'll do the honors." - Reverend T. Lovejoy
I'm going to go graffiti Wikipedia and say that Hugo Reyes wrote Empire Strikes Back.
edit: Empire needs no fixing. What we need is a fixed Return of the Jedi.
__________________ Ryan "RangerWickett" Nock
Author of the War of the Burning Sky serialized novel, free at EN World. Part Two, The Irons Have Tolled, now available.
edit: Empire needs no fixing. What we need is a fixed Return of the Jedi.
All too true. Empire was the greatest of the whole series. Return was one of the weakest in many ways.
I'm wondering though if Hugo is not really merely a device for the writers to rewrite Star Wars in their own image as Star Trek is being re-written, and as Battlestar Galactica was. And I find that a really interesting idea.
I too was extremely glad to see the storyline involving Miles, as I had awhile back figured out who his Old Man was, as the good Doc is one of the resurrecting Old Men of the show, and because Miles is one of the most interesting unexplored characters on the entire show. And I'm really interested to see what experiment that Miles was exposed to, accidentally or not, that triggered his "powers," which are very Heroes like. Though I already think that last night's "filling episode" was a clue.
I'm also glad to see Faraday back who always seems to know exactly what is happening in the background, though he thinks he is powerless to influence events, no matter what timeline he appears in.
I also have some idea, a general one at least, of "what lies in the shadow..." and so I'm looking forwards to the next couple of weeks. And to seeing more of the "Van Boys." The detective in me has alreayd noticed something odd about them, especially the spokesman, and his mouth.
I wanna see if it plays out like I suspect.
All in all I found this one to be an excellent episode.
Don't know about anybody else but I've enjoyed the past few episodes. Looking forward to the season finale next week.
I pretty much figure the whole purpose of the Losties going back to the past is to create the thing that causes the button to be pushed which we eventually crash their plane.
__________________ Certainty of death, small chance of success. What are we waiting for!
I pretty much figure the whole purpose of the Losties going back to the past is to create the thing that causes the button to be pushed which we eventually crash their plane.
Stable Time Loops for the win.
The two eps have all been winners. I like man of action Locke, Faraday is always good, and calm Juliet is vying to remove Hurley as my fave.
__________________ stonegod -- LEB judge and spawn of Khyber since 2005 (Blog)
I honestly think Lost is absolutely as good as it's ever been. While I might not argue that any particular episode is better than some of the earlier ones, the overall plot and pacing are top notch and make the show a complete must-watch for us.
Great stuff - the best at time travel I think I've ever seen. Lots of reveals in every episode, with new mysteries quickly replacing them.
I officially forgive the producers for season 3.
__________________ "And once again, tithing is 10% off the top. That's gross income, not net. Please people, don't force us to audit. Now I'm going to pass this around a second time. Brother Ned, you'll do the honors." - Reverend T. Lovejoy
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