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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Today, 02:19 PM
    The definition of literary rebuts the OP all by itself. You can't just redefine things to suit your whims. You can't derail something that is already off the rails and has been since the OP. ;)
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Today, 02:13 PM
    Ioun Stone 21 Medallion of Thoughts 20 Necklace of Adaptation 20 Necklace of Fireballs 18 Necklace of Prayer Beads 20 Pearl of Power 20 Periapt of Health 20 Periapt of Proof Against Poison 20 Periapt of Wound Closure 20 Scarab of Protection 20
    3 replies | 38 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Today, 01:51 PM
    You'd better have Kryptonite in that sock!
    147 replies | 3614 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Today, 01:43 PM
    Daniel Horne -- 16 Keith Parkinson -- 19 Jeff Easley -- 19 Larry Elmore -- 6 Clyde Caldwell -- 19 David Trampier -- 21 House El will never die out!
    147 replies | 3614 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Today, 01:36 PM
    You can play the game without being cinematic, but unless you bare bones descriptions to "You see a guy wearing plate mail and holding a sword," you are being literary with your descriptions. As soon as you tell us that he has sandy blond hair, you are being literary. If he has battered plate mail, or gleaming plate mail and you let the players know that, you are being literary. You basically...
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
    2 XP
  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Today, 01:29 PM
    Another thread that has fallen victim to the PRP(Pemerton Redefinition Program). When you try to redefine something in order to fit your narrow usage, you naturally and correctly get a lot of push back by people who understand the actual definition. What you have done is the following. Pemerton: Does D&D have money? I'm going to define money as pieces of paper with no inherent value, but...
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Today, 05:31 AM
    If you think you can tell anything about me based on how I look at pretend, you're deluding yourself. If you really can't tell the difference between reality and pretend...
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Today, 05:28 AM
    Nah. It was better than Dexter, How I Met Your Mother, and Lost. Not sure about Seinfeld. Not good, but better than those.
    32 replies | 604 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Today, 01:50 AM
    It was my second choice. My first choice was the Gem of Seeing. I'm just glad that the booooooring Brooch of Shielding didn't win.
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Yesterday, 10:40 PM
    Descriptions are what make the situation interesting. I can give you a situation of 10 gargoyles on a hill. One DM will make it bland and dull, the other through descriptions will make it interesting and exciting. Yep. I've been in RPGs that were dull and played like a board game. Bored game?
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Yesterday, 10:33 PM
    Now we're back to both being equal. The bolded above is true. However... If the descriptions are non-existent or dull, the players are going to cease getting together as their characters to engage with situations presented in the game, making those situations subordinate to the good descriptions. Both are necessary to engage the players and keep them coming back.
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
    1 XP
  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Yesterday, 10:08 PM
    Because people are often wrong. She has never committed mass murder. She has pretended to on T.V., though. The answer is simple, and it has nothing whatsover to do with real life. The answer is because T.V. is pretend and it's fun.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
    1 XP
  • OB1's Avatar
    Yesterday, 02:11 PM
    Amulet of the Planes 10+1=11 Brooch of Shielding 2-2=0 Gem of Seeing 1
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • OB1's Avatar
    Yesterday, 12:19 AM
    Amulet of the Planes 5+1=6 Bracers of Defense 5-2=3 Brooch of Shielding 4 Gem of Seeing 4
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • OB1's Avatar
    Friday, 17th May, 2019, 06:23 PM
    Amulet of Health 1 Amulet of the Planes 7+1=8 Bracers of Archery 5 Bracers of Defense 6-2=4 Brooch of Shielding 7 Gem of Seeing 7
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Friday, 17th May, 2019, 03:11 PM
    I'm in between you and Lanefan I don't mind taking time to discuss old times with other PCs, but I'm also going to want to talk to the captain about what we can expect on the voyage and at the port we are heading to. Perhaps climb up the crows nest and watch for ships in the distance with the crew member, while talking to him about the captain and other officers, in order to get a better gauge...
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Friday, 17th May, 2019, 02:58 PM
    None of those were real. True story. Cheering fiction in no way reflects any true value of society. Cheering fictional crucifixions doesn't in any way indicate that someone would cheer a real one. You are comparing apples and oranges, and it just doesn't work.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Friday, 17th May, 2019, 01:26 PM
    Amulet of Health 6 Amulet of the Planes 6 Bracers of Archery 5 Bracers of Defense 8 Brooch of Shielding 7 Gem of Seeing 8
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Friday, 17th May, 2019, 01:15 PM
    Description isn't automatically performance. If you describe something in third person, you aren't performing the act of being cautious or careful, and you aren't performing by stepping into character(first person). Look at it like this. When the director tells the actor playing Hunter Maximus that Hunter is stalking his prey quietly through the jungle, he is not performing anything. When...
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
    1 XP
  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Friday, 17th May, 2019, 07:47 AM
    If the player is talking in character, it is performative, though. Stepping into the character first person is you performing what the character is saying. Talking about what the character says in third person would not be. Third person is not talking in character. It's just descriptive.
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 16th May, 2019, 07:42 PM
    Strange. When I watch Jaws, I root for 007. To each his own I suppose.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
    1 XP
  • OB1's Avatar
    Thursday, 16th May, 2019, 03:59 PM
    Amulet of Health 7 Amulet of the Planes 7+1=8 26 sessions into Tier IV this item has proved to be the most interesting and fun magic item the party has Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 5 Bracers of Archery 9 Bracers of Defense 9-2=7 talk about a boring item of statboost Brooch of Shielding 9 Gem of Seeing 6
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 16th May, 2019, 01:20 PM
    Nobody cheered mass murder(at least not pertaining to Game of Thrones). It's a show. It's all pretend. And nobody should be condemned for cheering something pretend on TV.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 16th May, 2019, 01:03 PM
    And survival! :D I would argue that increased survivability, especially prolonged consciousness, also impacts the choices and actions that your character can actually make. You can now make more of them, and for those who use hit points to gauge what you can get away with, they will make certain choices over other choices that would have been made had they had fewer hit points. In fact,...
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 16th May, 2019, 12:56 PM
    Amulet of Health 6 Amulet of the Planes 7 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 5 Bracers of Archery 9 Bracers of Defense 9 Brooch of Shielding 9 Gem of Seeing 12
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 16th May, 2019, 12:54 PM
    Except not. I know for a fact that all I'm doing is having some fun, and not even all of it has to do with you at all, and what does is just ribbing. No insults at all. If you are feeling insulted, then you are seeing insult where there isn't any. Satyrn is one of the nicest people here, so I'm certain that she is also just having some fun with a bit of ribbing. lowkey13 I'm not as certain...
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
    1 XP
  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 16th May, 2019, 02:34 AM
    The humor is just that, humor. It's not ridicule lobbed your way or any other way. Some of it is a bit of ribbing.
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 16th May, 2019, 02:31 AM
    Name is Boris! Max is disguise. It is good disguise, no?
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 16th May, 2019, 02:29 AM
    No, but you do need to understand it to have a relevant conversation about the topic on a forum. It isn't about thinking about these things during game play. It's about understanding the various points of people discussing the topic in this thread. You're taking something and trying to apply it in a way other than what is intended, and then calling it flawed. Here are some...
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • OB1's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 05:05 PM
    Amulet of Health 8 Amulet of the Planes 8+1=9 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 8 Bead of Force 4 Bracers of Archery 9 Bracers of Defense 11-2=9 Brooch of Shielding 11 Gem of Seeing 11
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 02:22 PM
    That was just a joke. What I said in my last post is not, though. I don't think there is any sort of agenda going on here. People just disagree with blanket statement X, and when people disagree, they tend to do so from their favorite aspect of the game that disputes the overgeneralized term being used. That doesn't make it an agenda, though.
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 01:51 PM
    Categories are what they are, broad or not. Content is very different than presentation, but the only way to get content across to someone else is to present it to them somehow. That makes it useful to know that presentation is the other category. If presentation is so broad that you are having difficulty with it when it comes to presenting an idea to us, rather than complain about how broad...
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
    3 XP
  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 01:28 PM
    I agree that one is not really more important than the other. I've seen a great DM take poor content and make it interesting and fun. I've also seen a poor DM take fantastic content and ruin it. However, I've also seen that the good content makes it easier for the typical DM to make the game fun, while bad content will often stymie the typical DM, so content is equally important in my opinion.
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 01:22 PM
    Maybe, but those posts with lots of words that you say you don't read are often the ones that best explain the position. It seems counter productive to complain about not understanding a position, while not reading the posts best able to help you learn what the position is.
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 01:16 PM
    Moose is also after Squirrel, right Natasha'?
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 01:14 PM
    It happens. For truth! Just the other day I was jumped in a dark alley by a playstyle and told that if I didn't use its talking points, I would sleep with the dragon turtles.
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 01:09 PM
    Amulet of Health 6 Amulet of the Planes 8 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 7 Bead of Force 6 Bracers of Archery 11 Bracers of Defense 11 Brooch of Shielding 11 Gem of Seeing 14
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 01:06 PM
    I don't remember the people cheering at immoral behavior. I do remember them cheering at the punishment of immoral behavior, though. They cheered when the traitor Ned Stark was beheaded. It wasn't their fault they were lied to about what he did. They believed he was immoral and cheered appropriately. They also cheered when the immoral Queen Cersei walked the walk of shame, also punishment of...
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 01:04 PM
    It doesn't need that long of a leash, and if you have to go into video game mode to watch a T.V. show, that show has failed. It's not a video game.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 12:56 PM
    Nah. It was pretty clear that it was a joke.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 04:00 AM
    That's not even relevant. When you have a fantasy show, the additional fantasy elements like dragons and magic are accepted as making sense for the genre. The same cannot be said for mundane items that correspond to the real world. Just because a show has dragons, does not mean that someone is going to just accept that a normal arrow fired from a normal bow can make several right turns in the...
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
    1 XP
  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 03:39 AM
    I've already talked about how it kinds sorta exists for NPCs/monsters. I can take a mint baseball card into a store and have the same thing happen to me. Getting more than 40-50% of the value when you sell to a store is business. If said sword is worthless, then it would have been worthless in a fight BEFORE going to sell it. If it has 100% usefulness in a fight, then a store has...
    2689 replies | 84819 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 03:20 AM
    Not really. This is from a gem cutting site. As you can see, the wizard and normal gem cutters can do multiple stones a day. I guess the wizard can edge out the normal guy and get one extra stone in, but it's not going to be a business ruiner. As for jewelry, the spell only allows one item to be fabricated, so you can do a silver necklace, a gold necklace, a platinum ring, etc. You...
    118 replies | 4373 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 03:05 AM
    About 1200 yards. It wasn't accurate to that range, though. Next to impossible. It's "next to impossible," because they might somehow win the lottery and sling a one in a million shot. 4 of them? Not a chance. Both history and GoT where we see slow moving ships.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
    1 XP
  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Wednesday, 15th May, 2019, 02:40 AM
    The angles were irrelevant. The problems are that you simply cannot turn those things fast enough to hit fast moving targets, while bobbing up and down in an ocean, and at a distance that is too far away to reach the dragons. Also, slow moving ships cannot get out and into position before being seen by flyers looking at the island.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • OB1's Avatar
    Tuesday, 14th May, 2019, 02:07 PM
    Amulet of Health 9 Amulet of the Planes 10+1=11 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 10 Bead of Force 8 Bracers of Archery 11 Bracers of Defense 11-2=9 Brooch of Shielding 11 Gem of Brightness 5 Gem of Seeing 13
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Tuesday, 14th May, 2019, 01:04 PM
    Amulet of Health 7 Amulet of the Planes 12 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 10 Bead of Force 8 Bracers of Archery 11 Bracers of Defense 11 Brooch of Shielding 11 Gem of Brightness 5 Gem of Seeing 15
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Tuesday, 14th May, 2019, 01:02 PM
    Makes a killing or gets killed anyway. PC actions don't generally happen in a vacuum. What the wizard is doing will be negatively impacting many craftsmen and their families, which means revenge from some of them. And hopefully he has spells left to fight the assassins with. He'd best be checking that chair for traps. I think people are seriously underestimating how dangerous it...
    118 replies | 4373 view(s)
    3 XP
  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Tuesday, 14th May, 2019, 04:52 AM
    That would mean that you agree with me that it was a stupid, stupid scene with things that made no sense at all, but are just saying it a bit differently. I can accept that. :)
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Tuesday, 14th May, 2019, 04:42 AM
    Sure. Many tables create their own issues, and for many other tables those aren't issues at all.
    118 replies | 4373 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Tuesday, 14th May, 2019, 04:40 AM
    No they didn't. If you watch the scene, they came out from behind the rocks and shot at them. There were no ships, then *poof* ships with speed boat engines were suddenly well out in front of that cliff face and then attacked with ballistae that can shoot farther than is possible, with pinpoint accuracy at fast moving targets(impossible by the way) while moving up and down on waves. It was a...
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Tuesday, 14th May, 2019, 03:43 AM
    And we learned that the Red Keep and city walls should have been built out that rock Jon was hiding behind in episode 3.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Tuesday, 14th May, 2019, 03:41 AM
    Ships can't do that, though. It takes a loooooong time for ships to come out from behind a cliff and then aim at flying dragons and a queen that are all looking at the island the ships are crawling out from behind. That ambush was some of the poorest writing of the season. Only the Charge of the Night Brigade was worse.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Tuesday, 14th May, 2019, 03:37 AM
    Hey! We had occasional flashes to Jon running around all confused and upset, with the odd stabby stabby here and there.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Tuesday, 14th May, 2019, 02:54 AM
    I read an article today that the actor who played Ser Baristan Selmy said that Martin was finished with both book 6 and 7, but had a deal with HBO not to release them until after the series was over. I have no idea if that's true or not, but it's a very interesting thing for him to say.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Tuesday, 14th May, 2019, 02:48 AM
    I usually carried one extra weapon on me just in case. It kinda does and doesn't. Monsters have poor quality gear sometimes, but it just kinda poofs in at that quality and hasn't degraded to that point over time. However, the monster equipment is sometimes poor quality, implying that the monsters have rules that the players don't and sometimes have stuff degrade. PC equipment...
    2689 replies | 84819 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Tuesday, 14th May, 2019, 02:37 AM
    I think this is really a mountain(20th level) out of a molehill(goblin). This is a rulings over rules game and if someone is importing a single goblin every day for his morning goblin murder, and it's not even remotely close to rising to the level of an easy challenge, I'm not giving experience for it. If this person is going out seeking goblins to kill, then he's engaging in dangerous...
    118 replies | 4373 view(s)
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  • OB1's Avatar
    Monday, 13th May, 2019, 02:59 PM
    Amulet of Health 10 Amulet of the Planes 14+1=15 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 1 Bead of Force 8 Bracers of Archery 12 Bracers of Defense 13-2=11 Brooch of Shielding 10 Gem of Brightness 8 Gem of Seeing 14
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Monday, 13th May, 2019, 01:44 PM
    A few assassins would have been appropriate at that point. I mean, if I were the collective blacksmiths of the realm and one 7th level wizard tried to put us all out of business, I'd do something about it.
    118 replies | 4373 view(s)
    2 XP
  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Monday, 13th May, 2019, 01:39 PM
    I've never had a problem with that, because it seems to me that it takes a special kind of crazy to go on what amounts to multiple suicide missions. Fighting dangerous creatures is deadly, and the vast majority of people just don't want to do that. Exp from non-combat situations should be very slow going, so most elves and dwarves that even have class levels at all wouldn't be mega high level.
    118 replies | 4373 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Monday, 13th May, 2019, 01:35 PM
    Amulet of Health 9 - Right back achoo. Amulet of the Planes 14 - The plane! The plane! Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 12 Bead of Force 10 Bracers of Archery 12 Bracers of Defense 13 Brooch of Shielding 10 Gem of Brightness 8 Gem of Seeing 16
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Monday, 13th May, 2019, 01:24 PM
    Especially since there wouldn't have even been the ballistae to worry about. Except for the rock Jon was hiding behind in episode 3. If they had just quarried that kind of rock for the walls and the keep, she would have been in trouble. ;)
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Monday, 13th May, 2019, 01:18 PM
    Oh, right. Let's just toss the whole prophecy out the window with that one. The least they could have done would have been to have him tenderly holding her neck while kissing her when they died, so at least she could have died with the younger brother's hands around her neck like the prophecy said.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Monday, 13th May, 2019, 01:15 PM
    Yeah. That scene and Dany just deciding to burn all of the innocents like that just blew chunks. I mean, going all "Mad Queen" and hitting innocents while burning the enemy near the keep would be one thing. Just targeting the innocents with no enemy soldiers around was stupid.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Monday, 13th May, 2019, 01:11 PM
    The issue isn't with the terms. It's with the application of those terms. There are portions of the game that are literary, and there are portions of the game that are performance. People are running afoul of things in trying to apply those terms too broadly. Performance is a type of delivery and presentation, but not all delivery and presentation is performance. Literary is written...
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Monday, 13th May, 2019, 05:29 AM
    Not even close. The ends of Dexter and How I Met Your Mother were much worse.
    172 replies | 3758 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Monday, 13th May, 2019, 05:26 AM
    I don't know. If a group of Japanese men in armor can be a Crack Suicide Squad...
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Monday, 13th May, 2019, 02:43 AM
    I don't agree with this. Druids are about the natural order and farms go against that. They constrain nature and keep portions out in order to force the land to produce in an unnatural fashion. Druids tend forests, not orchards. Such an act would also go against survival of the fittest, making things too easy on the peasants and country, allowing more people to survive than nature intends, so...
    118 replies | 4373 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Monday, 13th May, 2019, 02:12 AM
    A squad of rapier-wielding Gnome Paladins made lowkey13 do it.
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • OB1's Avatar
    Sunday, 12th May, 2019, 06:29 PM
    Amulet of Health 14 Amulet of the Planes 15+1=16 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 12 Bead of Force 10 Bracers of Archery 13 Bracers of Defense 15-2=13 Brooch of Shielding 12 Gem of Brightness 14 Gem of Seeing 15
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Sunday, 12th May, 2019, 03:07 PM
    Amulet of Health 12 Amulet of the Planes 15 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 14 Bead of Force 10 Bracers of Archery 14 Bracers of Defense 15 Brooch of Shielding 12 Gem of Brightness 15 Gem of Seeing 17
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Sunday, 12th May, 2019, 02:12 PM
    I don't agree with this. Performance can exist within D&D, but not all that is said is performance. Talking is how you communicate the content to the players. Performance would be if you add in voices, alter tones to try to convey different feelings, etc. If you're just reading a text box in a normal voice, even if there is descriptive language, it's not performance. The DM and players are...
    374 replies | 8077 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Saturday, 11th May, 2019, 05:40 PM
    Amulet of Health 13 Amulet of the Planes 16 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 13 Bead of Force 12 Bracers of Archery 14 Bracers of Defense 14 Brooch of Shielding 14 Gem of Brightness 15 Gem of Seeing 17
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • OB1's Avatar
    Saturday, 11th May, 2019, 02:48 PM
    Amulet of Health 15 Amulet of the Planes 14+1=15 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 13 Bead of Force 12 Bracers of Archery 12 Bracers of Defense 16-2=14 Brooch of Shielding 18 Gem of Brightness 17 Gem of Seeing 16
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Friday, 10th May, 2019, 11:43 PM
    With a single stone I think holding it is okay. Using a stone is a different matter.
    176 replies | 4700 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Friday, 10th May, 2019, 11:10 PM
    And he probably loaded the battleship with paladins and gnomes before it went down.
    2689 replies | 84819 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Friday, 10th May, 2019, 11:09 PM
    It doesn't look like a corner case. Dragging around carts full of weapons IS a corner case. I've played in games where you had to keep up weapons and that wasn't even on the radar. You said, unless I completely misunderstood you, that including a weapon degradation system would limit playstyles. So yes, I took 2.5 seconds to exclude it with a simple sentence to prove that statement...
    2689 replies | 84819 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Friday, 10th May, 2019, 11:02 PM
    Sure. If you add it in for your game, it will be there. Absent you making it an issue, though, it's just not. That brand spanking new sword the bard bought is going to be in the same condition the fighter's 5 year old, well used sword is in, despite the fighter not caring for it. 5e does not have weapon degradation for PCs, whetstone or not. I agree. I would allow that as well,...
    2689 replies | 84819 view(s)
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  • OB1's Avatar
    Friday, 10th May, 2019, 03:30 PM
    Amulet of Health 19 Amulet of the Planes 15+1=16 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 13 Bead of Force 12 Bracers of Archery 16 Bracers of Defense 17-2=15 Brooch of Shielding 18 Gem of Brightness 17 Gem of Seeing 18
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Friday, 10th May, 2019, 01:15 PM
    Amulet of Health 17 Amulet of the Planes 14 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 14 Bead of Force 14 Bracers of Archery 16 Bracers of Defense 17 Brooch of Shielding 20 Gem of Brightness 17 Gem of Seeing 20
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Friday, 10th May, 2019, 07:39 AM
    In some corner case games, sure. This is wrong. It takes literally 2 seconds to say, "Guys, we're not using the degradation rules." And poof, you don't have to worry about it any longer. Inclusion of such mechanics does no limit playstyles in any way. No it doesn't, as weapon maintenance does not exist. The players can buy a whetstone and have their PCs pretend to fix their...
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Friday, 10th May, 2019, 07:30 AM
    Fixed that for you. ;)
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  • OB1's Avatar
    Thursday, 9th May, 2019, 03:43 PM
    Amulet of Health 20 Amulet of the Planes 17+1=18 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 16 Bead of Force 14 Bracers of Archery 15 Bracers of Defense 20-2=18 Brooch of Shielding 22 Gem of Brightness 18 Gem of Seeing 18
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 9th May, 2019, 01:37 PM
    Yep. I feel like after the exchange between Tyrion and Varys, that Tyrion may be the one to kill Varys. Varys will likely try to kill Daenerys and Tyrion definitely wants to keep her alive.
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 9th May, 2019, 01:18 PM
    Amulet of Health 20 Amulet of the Planes 17 Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location 16 Bead of Force 16 Bracers of Archery 15 Bracers of Defense 22 Brooch of Shielding 21 Gem of Brightness 18 Gem of Seeing 20
    307 replies | 6217 view(s)
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 9th May, 2019, 11:43 AM
    That works for many things, but not for this. If I'm immersed in my role and I have this beat up sword, but the other fighter in the party has a gleaming new sword, and both weapons are functioning identically, that's going to be jarring for me. The role of a beat up sword is to function less well than a brand new one, and if you try to model that role, it's either going to be modeled though a...
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 9th May, 2019, 11:36 AM
    I don't see how he could be interested in making the game relatable to real life via realism, and be interested in making things in D&D true to life to some degree via realism, and be uninterested in realism. I can see how he might be uninterested in excessive realism, though.
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 9th May, 2019, 04:44 AM
    But it does have a good amount of realism, which he was deeply into based on the rules and statements he makes all throughout the editions he wrote.
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 9th May, 2019, 02:55 AM
    That's where realism starts, yes. Those are attempts attempts to model real life happenings. I didn't say that. What I said is that you should have mechanics for them. Otherwise they lack sufficient realism(in my opinion) to even bother with. There's no point in telling someone his weapon is dinged up, bent, dull or whatever, if there's no mechanical difference between that weapon and...
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  • Maxperson's Avatar
    Thursday, 9th May, 2019, 02:36 AM
    I've played Rolemaster, GURPS(a very small amount) and HERO, but not in a very long time.
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Monday, 20th May, 2019

  • 03:35 AM - CleverNickName mentioned Maxperson in post Survivor Magic Jewelry (PART I)- AMULET OF THE PLANES WINS!
    What Maxperson said, except my first choice was the Amulet of Proof Against Detection and Location.
  • 02:22 AM - Imaro mentioned Maxperson in post Is RPGing a *literary* endeavour?
    I’m not sure what you mean by “well enough”. I’m claiming that as long as the situation is clearly understood by the players, which is an issue with communication, not with quality of form/literary merit, and it fails to interest them nevertheless, that focusing on the artistry of its presentation is unlikely to generate the desired interest in the situation and is more likely to resemble some other form of entertainment that relies on such artistry, like a novel or a movie. If you're not sure what I mean refer to the last post by @Maxperson for a pretty succinct explanation. If what you are claiming above is true then if given the same quality content that is communicated clearly there should never be deviation in how players respond to it (either being interested or not interested)... which begs the question if it's purely a question of quality of content and clarity then why can numerous DM's try to hook their players to interact with the same content and get totally different responses from their players insofar as interest is concerned? Are you saying any and every DM who can't get his players interested in quality content must not be clearly communicating with their players? If not what are you saying is the cause? My bad. I was using “flowery language” as a euphemism for formal quality in narration, which I thought was fairly obvious. Sorry if that has caused any confusion in the discussion. Oh I was just making sure you understood that one did not equate to the other but it appears you already knew that an...

Thursday, 9th May, 2019

  • 12:36 AM - pemerton mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    I can't understand pemerton 's reference to playing rolemaster since 1990Because Rolemaster players feel that being lectured by a D&D player about what realism in RPGing means is like an Australian lecturing a Canadian about what cold and snow are all about. Or to put it another way: I've done 100s and 100s of hours of process sim RPGing - far more than Maxperson has. Maxperson has, as far as I know, never played RM, never played RQ, never played C&S, and maybe has played some GURPS or HERO (I can't remember on these last two). I've been part of a play culture that has a very robust sense of what realism in RPGing means, and that is very conscious of the difference between and relationships between mechanical process and fictional content. And I can't make sense of what Maxperson is saying.

Tuesday, 7th May, 2019

  • 09:39 AM - Aldarc mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    1. Notice how you're continuing to compare different TTRPGs? There's a reason for that (see also, 2). Despite what I've written repeatedly that this is about comparisons within a single thing, not between things (is the flight simulation more or less realistic with or without wind, not is the flight simulator more realistic with wind than the space simulation). But the thrust of this is you keep discussing, and retreating to, "established fiction," which is completely orthogonal to what we are discussing, which is why the issue is described in terms of realism/simulation. There is nothing wrong, or right, with fiction that is great, or bad, or in-between; only that it has little to do with simulating or modeling reality (realism).You are presenting a strawman here (if not multiple ones), and I'm sure you will get some XP kudos from Maxperson for it. ;) The reason for comparing different TTRPGs is that a singular TTRPGs generally do not have multiple subsystems for whether they "model wind" or not. They usually either do or do not because systems generally come as pre-packaged systems. We can look at singular systems such as D&D, but then when we speak of adding models or not, we are typically dealing with house rules. Likewise, I do not "retreat" to establishing fiction; I use it because it provides one way to compare claims about the realism added of "modeled realism" versus "no model." Even if we look within a singular system that added a model of wind, the same point would largely hold true. The addition of a model intending to model realism does not inherently provide a net positive of realism to a system. 2. Which brings me to my second point, which I have both alluded to and outright stated. This "debate" really has nothing to do with what we are discussing, but rather has to do with other debates you ha...

Monday, 6th May, 2019

  • 10:44 AM - pemerton mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    Maxperson, as far as I know there are no rules in 5e for clothes becoming dirty or sweaty. Does that mean you think a GM who narrates a failed physical manoeuvre in a swamp as "You fall into the mud, making your clothes filthy" is breaking the rules? Or a GM who narrates a failed CHA check to influence a NPC, in circumstances where the PC has been in the wilds for a long time without bathing, as the NPC walking away making a comment about These reeking travellers? There are many ways that humans can degrade their clothes, their weapons, their pets, their companions (where are D&D's rules for putting a frog in someone's bed?) that D&D's rules don't model. That doesn't mean those things aren't part of the gameworld. It doesn't stop both players and GM's invoking them when the mood strikes, either as mere colour (like hawkeyefan's player who has a cold and so plays his/her PC as having a cold) or as part of the narration of failure (as per my examples above, or as per the suggestion that Abdul...

Tuesday, 30th April, 2019

  • 09:10 AM - Aldarc mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    If I'm reading Aldarc correctly, that system doesn't have any means of completely avoiding damage ("endurance drain") - though it seems you can try in the fiction to avoid being hit, you'll be hit anyway. Put another way, every attack hits at least to some extent with the only variable being how much damage is inflicted. That said, a question for Aldarc : Maxperson may have a valid point, I think, in questioning how long it takes to recover endurance loss suffered through avoided attacks (i.e. simple combat exertion) vs non-avoided attacks. I say "may have" above in that the answer will largely depend on the answer to a bigger question: whether endurance drain is seen as fatigue (easy to recover) or "meat" damage (not so easy to recover) or a combination of both, or whether the game system bothers with such distinctions. In the realism-authenticity debate this matters because 99% of the time fatigue "damage" is easier to recover from than "meat" damage - after hard exertion you can recover for a few minutes and be good to go again (e.g. a hockey player does a shift on the ice, recovers for a few minutes on the bench, and is good to go for another shift) but if your finger gets mashed that's gonna hurt for days.I don't necessarily think that it matters. From what I recall, and maybe Maxperson can clarify his views, but he plays (per RAW) i...

Monday, 29th April, 2019

  • 07:47 PM - Lanefan mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    How does hit point recovery work? Because if you dodge 3 "hits"(rounds) before killing the goblin and your hit points are not fully restored 60 seconds later, it does not at all reflect physical drain as it happens in real life. It doesn't take more than a few seconds to recover from a few dodges and swings. 18 seconds of exertion won't tire your for long.If I'm reading Aldarc correctly, that system doesn't have any means of completely avoiding damage ("endurance drain") - though it seems you can try in the fiction to avoid being hit, you'll be hit anyway. Put another way, every attack hits at least to some extent with the only variable being how much damage is inflicted. That said, a question for Aldarc : Maxperson may have a valid point, I think, in questioning how long it takes to recover endurance loss suffered through avoided attacks (i.e. simple combat exertion) vs non-avoided attacks. I say "may have" above in that the answer will largely depend on the answer to a bigger question: whether endurance drain is seen as fatigue (easy to recover) or "meat" damage (not so easy to recover) or a combination of both, or whether the game system bothers with such distinctions. In the realism-authenticity debate this matters because 99% of the time fatigue "damage" is easier to recover from than "meat" damage - after hard exertion you can recover for a few minutes and be good to go again (e.g. a hockey player does a shift on the ice, recovers for a few minutes on the bench, and is good to go for another shift) but if your finger gets mashed that's gonna hurt for days.

Sunday, 28th April, 2019

  • 02:11 AM - pemerton mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    When pemerton writes that adding a table for weapon deterioration does nothing to increase his sense of realism, I am inclined to take him at his word. Generally I agree with the thrust of your posts, but just wanted to come in on this given I was mentioned: I accept the proposition that weapons can deteriorate through use. I think there are a range of ways of introducing this into the fiction: mere background colour, as hawkeyefan suggested; as narrated consequence of failure in a system that permits that (Prince Valiant would be an example; so would Burning Wheel; so, I believe though not from experience but from posts in this thread, would be BitD); via a GM-side complication mechanic (which is how Cortex+ Heroic handles it); and via a randomisation mechanic annexed to the attack roll resolution process, which is what Maxperson seems to have in mind. Any of these might contribute to a sense of realism, depending on details of implementation. I think the lattermost is also often liable to detract from it, if (i) it generates implausible frequencies (too many to be taken seriously; or so convoluted an unlikely that it never comes up, thus not engendering the realistic/authentic experience that was looked for in the first place), or (ii) it creates an implausible contrast with other salient features of play (eg why do our weapons always break but our pitons and armour never do?).

Saturday, 27th April, 2019

  • 03:37 PM - Sepulchrave II mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    Maxperson – my apologies. My previous posts were rather acidic. Ironically, I suspect my actual play style hews closer to yours than, say, pemerton’s. But I think it's important to realize that every individual experience is unique; I cannot assert that “I experience [Y] more authentically than you because of [X].” This seems especially germane to any imaginative endeavour. I am fascinated by the idea of a “sub-reality” to the game – for want of a better term. Mechanical assumptions upon which the game world is built; it is what draws me to games such as Crusader Kings – a desire to crack the algorithms which underpin the universe. System mastery and resource management scratches an itch for me. And I find playing with those systems a source of genuine creative inspiration. For me, the mechanical "sub-reality" acts as a springboard for my imagination, often by way of a challenge - i.e. how can I make the game world comport with what the numbers tell me. But this is not true for all. I k...

Friday, 26th April, 2019

  • 11:43 AM - Sadras mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    ...he follows the line of preferences which I understand, but probably no surprise to him, I disagree with the BitD example he used - it is TOTALLY gamist and we probably won't agree. In this specific instance I would probably side with Max. @AbdulAlhazred returns to the semantic debate and prefers the term more authentic giving his reasons for the use of either term as he views it. I may not agree entirely, but my interest does not lie in the semantic debate. I'm ok with the term more authentic as I've said many times, I was using the more realism term as a shorthand for a great many things. @pemerton reiterates everyone else's point in his first two replies (which is where I am). Where I feel I need to point out, the mechanics giving rise to more realism were always acknowledged as very abstract in design and overly simplistic. i.e. If we fall from a distance in RL we take damage, similarly in the gaming fiction. Are they same or even close in design or outcome, of course not. @Maxperson has made this point numerous times, but posters still feel the need to mention how poorly mechanics imitate RL.

Thursday, 25th April, 2019

  • 04:27 AM - pemerton mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    Blades in the Dark, fir example, has no AC mechanic at all, much less any specific mechanics for combat that are in any way different from sneaking past a guard. Yet, you can have broken or damaged weapons, sucking chest wounds, minor scratches, and many other interesting and "realistic" outcomes of a fight with deadly weapons. 5e, for example, has detailed, combat specific rules, yet generates none of these things. Which is the more "realistic"? You seem to be focused on game processes being the way to introduce "realism". I disagree this is appropriate. There's a dufference between process and resultant fictions. "Realism," to me, can only be judged at the fiction, not the process. However, all of your arguments so far about adding "realism" have been about adding additional processes. I'm pointing out that process is not required for "realism." Sadras, Ovinomancer here is saying to you much the same things as I said to Maxperson upthread. I didn't mention BitD, as I don't play that game - I mentioned Prince Valiant, Cortex+ Heroic and BW as games that permit these various things through a mixture of processes (especially important in BW) and GM narration of consequences - which is my guess as to how it is handled in BitD. (If that guess is wrong then hawkeyefan or Ovinomancer can correct me.) Isn't the shorthand for this realism. Will you be happy with more authentic? more immersive? more RL illusionary? more dramatic? I mean looking for a better description/buzz-word is just playing silly buggers...It's not just playing silly buggers - the fact that you think it is means that maybe you've missed AbdulAlhazred's point. That point was the following: one effect of the AD&D DMG disease system may be that a PC, on some occasion of play, suffers a disease which debilitates him/her for a little while. And that may increase the player's sense of the authenticity of the fiction, the setting, the play e...

Wednesday, 24th April, 2019

  • 04:30 PM - lowkey13 mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    ...on the Earth, which is moving, and in the solar system, which is moving, and in the Galaxy, which is moving, and there is no such thing as ever being still AND I WILL NOT ABSOLVE YOU OF USING AN INAPPROPRIATE WORD. Yeah, don't ever be that guy. On this realism thing, it's not like this is a new debate, it's just the same old tired discussion with new language; no one is re-inventing the wheel, here. I mean, c'mon- the 1e DMG, in the very opening, discusses "realism-simulation school" v. "game school" (and D&D falls in the latter camp). To quote EGG: "For fun, excitement, and captivating fantasy, AD&D is unsurpassed. As a realistic simulation of things from the realm of make-believe, or even as a reflection of medieval or ancient warfare or culture or society, it can be deemed only a dismal failure." DM's Guide, p. 9. That said, the amount of effort and energy spent fighting over generally-recognized terms is beyond bizarre; there are few, if any, people who can misunderstand what @Maxperson and @Sadras are discussing, unless they only wish to argue about arguing and are fighting definitions that are commonly understood (YOU CAN NEVER STAND STILL!). Sure, we can go all Gusdorf or Wittgenstein on this, but why? I mean, I think I know why; because somehow, the idea of "realism" is one that people naturally fight against; it is not enough to simply say, as was written forty (40!) years ago- yeah, I know what realism is, and I'm just not doing it. Now people have to turn themselves into pretzels by arguing against commonly-understood words. "Yes, I know you said that the fire engine is 'red,' but communication is imperfect. My mental image of red and your can never be exactly the same, and red itself is a concept that covers all sorts of colors, from mahogany to crimson, and since language is imprecise, you cannot possibly call the fire engine red." But yes, most people understand the following when someone says, within the context of a typical TTRPG, that something is "mor...
  • 08:49 AM - Sadras mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    So you think the claim 'My game is more realistic than yours' is the same as 'My game is more immersive than yours'. The latter is clearly the self-righteous claim of a pompous tool. The former is as well, but pretends to be a claim of objective fact. Pompous tools aside, your stance comes from semantics, when I'm only using the shorthand version of attempting to describe something, which I believe we all understand which term is even used by designers. I do not believe designers are attempting to be pompous tools with claims of objective facts when they use the term to market a mechanic that your game does not possess. @Maxperson, you have said that no mechanic yields 100% unrealistic, whereas some mechanic yields a step towards realism however minute the step. I believe you also mentioned the mechanic needs to be designed with some competency and honesty (integrity). Out of interest how do you view the fumble on a 1? Is this a step towards realism?
  • 02:20 AM - AbdulAlhazred mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    ...wn and a balance needs to be struck. The idea that these additional elements are fixed within the mechanics (daily weather, weapon/armour depreciation...etc) might have some proclaim that their game is 'more realistic' than others whose game does not have such mechanics. Do these systems emulate everything within RL, of course not. EDIT: I think the argument that everything needs to be as in real life or otherwise nothing is, is a fairly weak one. It does not further conversation or understanding between parties to only speak in absolutes. The use of the word more in "more realism" is indicative that the conversation is not about absolutes. I've never hinted that there cannot be a scale, I don't think it would make sense to say that a scale isn't possible, in some sense. However it is very difficult, past a very very general point to really state that one is achieving 'greater realism', and to do so must require some fairly tight description of exactly what is being discussed. When Maxperson simply makes some general statement about weapon breakage making a game 'more realistic', this is simply not automatically true, at all. This is also pemerton's point, at least to an extent. I can pass some level of judgement on a specific implementation of weapon breakage, or disease, for a specific game, but even then chances are its going to be highly subjective, at best. For example: is the 1e DMG disease system going to 'increase realism' if you use it? I am not at all certain it will. I don't really know how to approach quantifying the realism it is claimed it will add. Is a highly unrealistic model of disease 'more realistic' than no model at all? Is a model of disease which undermines and distorts a number of already established concepts related to injury and death making the game, overall, more realistic or not? Anyone who claims it does and then insists this is self-evident is pretty much off the reservation IMHO. I can't even really critique that, it is like trying to grade...

Tuesday, 23rd April, 2019

  • 02:52 PM - 5ekyu mentioned Maxperson in post Deconstructing 5e: Typical Wealth by Level
    ... they do not compensate for the loss of an entire playing style. If you can find use of them, all the power to you. But don't claim my need is filled, and don't offer these other suggestions as if they can compare. "Just extrapolate" - a slap in the face. Making a proper upgrade to the 3.x DMG system is hard and time-consuming and something I want to give money to WotC for doing for me."None of your arguments even address that the game used to have rules and guidelines for utility-based magic item pricing, for those of us with no other desire for our loot than trade it for meaningful monster killing upgrades so we can get back to the published adventure at hand." Actually, I know it might not fit your agenda but I am pretty sure there have been comments mentioning and recognizing previous attempts and that experience with such in this game's editions and others proved the idea to not work. Its not a net positive and we dont want to go down that many times failed path again. Edit Maxperson beat me to it.

Sunday, 21st April, 2019

  • 04:15 AM - pemerton mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    So, you are asserting that literally any implementation of this in some form, unspecified, is 'more realistic' than ignoring it? This is an absolute statement, eh? I won't even bother to address the absurdity of all this, its readily apparent to all. Max, your positions simply make no sense at this point. There isn't even a point in discussing it, as there is nothing here to discuss.This is where I think Maxperson has some assumption in mind as to what an implementation would look like, but isn't articulating it because it hasn't occurred to him that there are other implementations possible in different modes of RPGing. I'm assuming he's thinking of some form of "critical failure" which imposes a penalty to hit and/or damage. How it would work in a non-D&D system I assume simply hasn't been thought about. That it could be introduced into the fiction without any mechancial change (as hawkeyefan suggested; and as you and I have both suggested by narrating a "miss" as the result of a dulled edge) seems not to have been thought about either. That there is a difference between introducing a new mechancial subsystem and making something a part of the fiction also doesn't seem to have been thought about. I attribute this to the making of assumptions about how RPG systems must be.

Wednesday, 17th April, 2019

  • 04:30 AM - Hussar mentioned Maxperson in post Deconstructing 5e: Typical Wealth by Level
    Yeah I have to agree with Maxperson here. Utility is extremely campaign dependent. I mean I just played the Storm Kings Thunder modules. At the tail end, my cleric got a mace of disruption. Frankly I didn’t care. We had met zero undead in 11 levels. Why would I attune to this? OTOH, in our Ravenloft campaign, I would have given rather a lot for that item. Now, what is the “utility” value of a mace of disruption?

Monday, 8th April, 2019

  • 02:44 PM - pemerton mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    Maxperson, I don't really know what your point is. I quoted the 13th Age rules to provide an example (as I understand them) of what AbdulAlhazred had in mind (as I understood him) in referring to a "terrible price". AbdulAlahzred agreed that I was providing such an example. The fact that you interpret those passages differently from everyone else posting in this thread, including AbdulAlhazred who was a 13th Age playtester, is of no significance to my reason for posting them to explain to Sadras what AbdulAlhazred had in mind. You might consider, as a reason speaking against your interpretation, that (1) it makes the rule silly rather than sensible, and (2) produces a contradiction with the suggestion that "[t]he campaign-loss rule is key to making combat meaningful." And you might consider, as the basis for revising your interpretation, the following description of a "campaign loss": something that the party was trying to do fails in a way that going back and finishing off those enemies l...

Thursday, 4th April, 2019

  • 02:46 PM - Numidius mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    Maxperson, why do you think the weekly long rests won't be enough to solve the adv day problem?
  • 11:11 AM - Hussar mentioned Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    Shhh!! Don't clue him in. He's busy mocking me with his superior knowledge. ;) Sorry to burst your bubble Maxperson, but, this is in response to earlier questions from Numidius. And, heck, my 4e and 5e games aren't all that different. Maybe other folks are. Mine? Not so much. I find 5e to be mostly an update of 4e, particularly from the Essentials stuff. Certainly closer to 4e than 2e with which it shares virtually no mechanics. I mean, there's almost no 2e dna in 5e - the spell system is completely different, whether it's daily casters using Sorcerer mechanics or short rest casters like the Warlock which have no equivalent at all in 2e. The skill system is 4e's skill system without the level adjustments. The combat system is straight up d20. Me, I look at it pretty simply. Could a 4e player, with no experience in 5e, read a 5e character sheet? Pretty much. A 2e player? Wouldn't even recognize the character sheet as being a D&d character. The only thing that 5e shares with earlier editions is some milksop advice on letting the DM be in charge (which is really easy to ignore) and a ...


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Monday, 20th May, 2019

  • 03:32 PM - Bedrockgames quoted Maxperson in post Is RPGing a *literary* endeavour?
    You can play the game without being cinematic, but unless you bare bones descriptions to "You see a guy wearing plate mail and holding a sword," you are being literary with your descriptions. As soon as you tell us that he has sandy blond hair, you are being literary. If he has battered plate mail, or gleaming plate mail and you let the players know that, you are being literary. You basically have to completely ignore adjectives to avoid being literary with your descriptions, and I've never played in a game like that. Nor would I ever want play in a game like that. No, that isn’t literary. Hack novels use descriptions. Doesn’t make them literary novels. And further when the focus isn’t on higher quality narration, a higher purpose or using a plethora or literary techniques to make it feel ‘literary’, it is not literary. That was the point made in the OP and it comes closest to any meaningful use of ‘literary’ that isn’t absurdly broad for the purposes of this discussion. Again like so man...
  • 02:56 PM - hawkeyefan quoted Maxperson in post Is RPGing a *literary* endeavour?
    The definition of literary rebuts the OP all by itself. You can't just redefine things to suit your whims. You can't derail something that is already off the rails and has been since the OP. ;) It’s been clarified again and again. He’s talking about the quality of the presentation. The literary quality of a GM’s narration isn’t as important as the content of the narration. That’s pemerton’s claim. He’s clarified it again and again, and done so specifically in reply to you. If you think the thread is off the rails, then why not help get it back on track? Why continue to rail on about his choice of word rather than the meaning of what he’s saying, which has been made clear? I don’t think that RPGs are without literary merit. I don’t think they cannot contain literary quality. But the insistence that they must contain a certain level of quality in that regard is absurd.
  • 02:15 PM - pemerton quoted Maxperson in post Is RPGing a *literary* endeavour?
    Another thread that has fallen victim to the PRP(Pemerton Redefinition Program). I started the thread. Hussar is free to say what he likes about the dependence of much RPGing on the logic of genres (it's something I myself have been posting about for maybe 10+ years on these boards). But those things don't rebut the claim in the OP, which is pretty clear: RPGing requires narration: GMs describe situations, and players declare actions for their PCs that respond to those situations. But I don't think the literary quality of that narration is important. What matters to me is that the players feel the significance of the situations the GM describes I don't think Hussar has inadvertantely taken that for a claim that genre plays no role in RPGing. And your claim that I'm derailing is itself derailing. Asking whether activity A answers to aesthetic criteria X of activity B is standard stuff. Eg is movie-making a theatric endeavour? or is house-painting an artistic endeavour? The only pe...
  • 01:47 PM - jasper quoted Maxperson in post Survivor: D&D cover artists
    Daniel Horne -- 16 Keith Parkinson -- 19 Jeff Easley -- 19 Larry Elmore -- 6 Clyde Caldwell -- 19 David Trampier -- 21 House El will never die out! watch it Buddy. Or I will sock you in the face.
  • 10:58 AM - Zardnaar quoted Maxperson in post GAME OF THRONES SEASON 8--Final Run-- Part 6---THE END
    Nah. It was better than Dexter, How I Met Your Mother, and Lost. Not sure about Seinfeld. Not good, but better than those. Yeah it ended a bit better than I thought. Elective monarchy makes a lot of sense, Jon got a happy ending of sorts. Sansa as Queen of the North makes sense. Overall execution of the season though. Bran is the Prince that was promised? Drogon also survived. I also liked Jon's ending. F this Ima off with Tormond and mah doggie.
  • 02:31 AM - Kramodlog quoted Maxperson in post GAME OF THRONES SEASON 8--Final Run-- Part 5
    She has never committed mass murder.You've never watched Games of Thrones it seems. It explains a lot. I don't know where you've been, but it has already gone wrong and it had nothing to do with cheering pretend killing.So you''d be ok with people cheering the pretend rape of Sansa? That tells me a lot about who you are. That is pretend doesn't matter. It is just moving the goal post. People are shocked by immoral behavior, when they cheered for the same immoral behavior a few seasons ago. It is a reflection of their moral values. MArtin tried to show that, but it is going over your head. No lesson is learn what so ever.

Friday, 17th May, 2019

  • 06:09 PM - Kramodlog quoted Maxperson in post GAME OF THRONES SEASON 8--Final Run-- Part 5
    None of those were real. True story.So why do people are calling Dany's killing of the fake people of King's Landing immoral? When she committed mass murder before? She has been a murderous despot for quite some time now. With audiences cheering. The answer is simple. In real life, like in fiction, people are ok with killing people who aren't of their perceived "tribes". Now audiences are shocked that a mass murderer killed people of the "right tribe". Thing is, despots kill people of the "right tribe" more than people of the "naughty tribes". But clearly the lesson isn't learn. All disatisfaction is put on bad writting instead of people doing some soul searching and asking themselves if they do not favor immoral behavior and authoritarianism. My only consolation is that I'll get to say "I told you so". If all goes wrong of course.
  • 02:30 PM - Kramodlog quoted Maxperson in post GAME OF THRONES SEASON 8--Final Run-- Part 5
    Nobody cheered mass murder(at least not pertaining to Game of Thrones).People cheered at Dany's mass crucifixions. True story. It's a show. It's all pretend. And nobody should be condemned for cheering something pretend on TV. It’s a reflection of people's values and the values of our societies. Nobody cheered the rape of Sansa. Some people cheered Dany's mass crucifixions, murders by fire or by starvation. It means that in our societies it is not morally acceptable to publically condomn rape (even if some guys do praise it in some dark corner of the internet), but that praising murder is ok. And it is the case because people are ok with murder, as Sadras said so himself in this thread. Well, this what being ok with murder by a politician really means. I like that the show gives a realistic (sort-ish) portrait of a murderous despot and how it confronts the audience with it bloodlust and morality. It is heavy handed cause the writing sucks for the TV show but it does seem to be Martin...
  • 08:31 AM - Hussar quoted Maxperson in post Is RPGing a *literary* endeavour?
    If the player is talking in character, it is performative, though. Stepping into the character first person is you performing what the character is saying. Talking about what the character says in third person would not be. Third person is not talking in character. It's just descriptive. But, even in third person, it can still be performative. "Grgur walks cautiously down the hallway, looking carefully to see if there is anything out of place" is perfomative - you have desciptors like "cautiously" and "carefully". Compared to "Grgur strides down the hall." Both are third person, but, both are using language specifically chosen to evoke a particular scene. A non-descriptive would simply be, "Grgur moves down the hall". That's content without performance. Henry, I SO am stealing that line for my next D&D session. :D A perfect example of a dungeon that is pure content without any literary elements would be the dungeon I attached to this post. Would anyone say that this is what a...

Thursday, 16th May, 2019

  • 07:45 PM - Satyrn quoted Maxperson in post Is RPGing a *literary* endeavour?
    Except not. I know for a fact that all I'm doing is having some fun, and not even all of it has to do with you at all, and what does is just ribbing. No insults at all. If you are feeling insulted, then you are seeing insult where there isn't any. Satyrn is one of the nicest people here, so I'm certain that she is also just having some fun with a bit of ribbing. lowkey13 I'm not as certain about, but he has a similar humor to mine, so I think he is probably doing the same as Satyrn and I. I had . . . :.-( . . . a cat, a very beautiful cat with flowing white fur and the most gorgeous silver-blue eyes. And though he was a charming buffoon, he carried himself with a natural elegance, like the whole world was his catwalk. I also had a neighbour . . . insisted on calling him by a flowery name she christened him with and referring to him as her. The cat was so beautiful, my neighbour just could not she him as masculine. This went on for years, I just stopped correcting my neighbour. Ulti...
  • 02:40 PM - lowkey13 quoted Maxperson in post GAME OF THRONES SEASON 8--Final Run-- Part 5
    Nobody cheered mass murder(at least not pertaining to Game of Thrones). It's a show. It's all pretend. And nobody should be condemned for cheering something pretend on TV. When I watch Jaws, I root for the shark. COME AT ME!
  • 01:03 PM - Bedrockgames quoted Maxperson in post Is RPGing a *literary* endeavour?
    Except not. I know for a fact that all I'm doing is having some fun, and not even all of it has to do with you at all, and what does is just ribbing. No insults at all. If n[/MENTION] and I. The posts are not coming across this way at all. But whatever I wasn’t particularly focused on your posts. Look when people do things like mock a person for not reading a thread using language that belittles their reading comprehension: that is insulting.
  • 12:56 PM - Bedrockgames quoted Maxperson in post Is RPGing a *literary* endeavour?
    Except not. I know for a fact that all I'm doing is having some fun, and not even all of it has to do with you at all, and what does is just ribbing. No insults at all. If you are feeling insulted, then you are seeing insult where there isn't any. Satyrn is one of the nicest people here, so I'm certain that she is also just having some fun with a bit of ribbing. lowkey13 I'm not as certain about, but he has a similar humor to mine, so I think he is probably doing the same as Satyrn and I. I don’t know how you can read lowkeys or the other posters responses and not take it as being insulting. Sorry but none of this is coming across as humor to me.
  • 12:34 PM - Bedrockgames quoted Maxperson in post Is RPGing a *literary* endeavour?
    The humor is just that, humor. It's not ridicule lobbed your way or any other way. Some of it is a bit of ribbing. I come from the land of busting chops. This isn’t busting chops. This is the territory of being insulting. And most people don’t take bring insulted sitting down.
  • 10:27 AM - Bedrockgames quoted Maxperson in post Is RPGing a *literary* endeavour?
    Here are some facts for you. 1. I can perform during an RPG, therefore an RPG is performance. 2. I can narrate during an RPG, therefore an RPG is narration. 3. I can write during an RPG, therefore an RPG is literary. . Just because something can be done a particular way, it doesn't make it that thing itself. And just because writing is involved, that doesn't make it literature.
  • 03:17 AM - Hussar quoted Maxperson in post Is RPGing a *literary* endeavour?
    Honestly I'd rather have a player at my table who speaks with bad accents, than a player who has this attitude (and I am not particularly fond of accents or funny voices). Seriously? You have no problem with players who play non-humans exactly the same as human characters to the point where no one at the table knows the race of the character? That it comes as a surprise when it is revealed (you're an elf? Really? Since when?)? Well, takes all kinds I suppose. To me, it's no different than any other aspect of your character. A successful portrayal of a character means that everyone at the table has a pretty decent mental image of your character, even if some of the details might be different. This stuff is all fine if you like it. But these are very much the considerations that someone makes when they are acting. Not everyone is going to play a dwarf this way. I think on the spectrum of performance most people are not as far on the performative end as you, and many people are on the...

Wednesday, 15th May, 2019

  • 06:11 PM - Satyrn quoted Maxperson in post Is RPGing a *literary* endeavour?
    Moose is also after Squirrel, right Natasha'? No, Max. Moose is a KAOS agent. He's working with Squirrel.
  • 05:57 PM - Hriston quoted Maxperson in post A GMing telling the players about the gameworld is not like real life
    I usually carried one extra weapon on me just in case. Well, that seems pretty much normal for any game in which I've ever played, and yet we never bothered with weapon maintenance. It kinda does and doesn't. Monsters have poor quality gear sometimes, but it just kinda poofs in at that quality and hasn't degraded to that point over time. However, the monster equipment is sometimes poor quality, implying that the monsters have rules that the players don't and sometimes have stuff degrade. PC equipment never degrades unless the DM adds that system into the game. That's an easily provable fact, which I have proven multiple times in this thread. This all seems to confuse fictional processes with the way fiction is established at the table, which seems to be a recurring theme in this thread. My conditions have never changed. I've been referring to PC equipment from the beginning, and talking about combat mechanics for degradation. I did initially say that degradation was n...
  • 05:46 PM - Bedrockgames quoted Maxperson in post Is RPGing a *literary* endeavour?
    The game isn't performance. It's also not content, communication, literary or anything else. It's all of the above, depending on what aspect you are talking about. Trying to label an RPG as one thing is an exercise in futility, and will result in push-back by people who realize that RPGs are comprised of many different things. People will also tend to push back hardest about their favorite aspect of the game. This is not "advancing an agenda." Rather, it's just human nature. I am not going to accept it is 'all of the above' simply because you assert that it is. But I do think there are numerous approaches to play and numerous play styles. However I have no interest in getting other people to adopt mine through argumentation. Posters here were doing that and they were drawing on the proposed model in order to advocate for a way of playing the game. I am not saying they are doing it with nefarious intent. But it is definitely something happening in the discussion and that the model is con...
  • 05:42 PM - Bedrockgames quoted Maxperson in post Is RPGing a *literary* endeavour?
    Categories are what they are, broad or not. Content is very different than presentation, but the only way to get content across to someone else is to present it to them somehow. That makes it useful to know that presentation is the other category. If presentation is so broad that you are having difficulty with it when it comes to presenting an idea to us, rather than complain about how broad presentation is, there are these things called sub-categories that you can use to help you out. Simply identify the type of presentation you are talking about and then continue on. I am not seeing how this ads value to play. I absolutely do not need to understand this distinction in order to run or play in a game. And I am not sure the distinction is the best way to categorize key elements of the hobby. I mean I could also divide the game into "rolling dice parts" and "not rolling dice parts". If any of the material being filed under 'presentation' comes up or matters during play, it is done intui...


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