Challenging my high-lvl group (NPCs and monsters; my players shouldn't read this!)

[Tangent Loki]

Just because he isn't their king doesn't mean that royal injections in his country do no apply to them.

If he is mentally savvy he would use the laws of his land to his advantage.

Its not like they are above the law are they?

Which is another threat with killing Ioun even possessed Ioun.

Because with his blood they could dissolve that very charter.

How will they prove it if he is unwilling to co-operate, unwilling to risk his 'royal honor'.

I had made the assumption that he couldn't necissarily order around the Pc's with impunity.

But he can effect them with the orders.

Or order them out of the Empire.

it is after all his is it not?

[WizarDru]

Originally Posted by Tangent Loki

JIts not like they are above the law are they?

Which is another threat with killing Ioun even possessed Ioun.

Because with his blood they could dissolve that very charter.

How will they prove it if he is unwilling to co-operate, unwilling to risk his 'royal honor'.

Well, yeah...they kind of are. We're talking about a bunch of heroes who have slain several demi-gods at this point, played Kingmaker for another god and have disrupted or overthrown more than one evil government. At least one of them is practically a saint of his religion (willing or not) and several of the defenders answer to a higher power than a mortal, earthly ruler. While they wouldn't overthrow a lawful ruler just for kicks, if they walked in the door and some him going "chik-chik-screee" they're only one divination spell away from a smack-down.

And, uh...I have some bad news about Nolin.

[Tangent Loki]

They may be able to trounce the legal representatives... but think of the PR!

as well as the enmity of an entire nation.

it would be a 'brb blood feud' moment. Just because the emperor isn't in his right mind does not make them the law. Besides, how would these higher powers feel about EPH?

It could be fulfilling a natural purpose or destiny (though I take it not). Or they could be unaware of EPH.

plus the divination spell doesn't tell the whole room does it? Even commune will only give one person the answers and questions.

but who is to say that their now martyred Ioun wasn't innocent and the Defenders are just covering their tails?

If he has made any kind of political machinations previous to his 'assassination' such as a declaration of war that lacked only a signature, or a treaty that was almost agreed to his blood could effectively force it into play (via a chancellor's nod that he was 'working on a mutual alliance with BIG NASTY X, one that would let this kingdom be at true peace, but would dissolve X that the defenders have done and so they have here slain him. (Now you have a speech off with the chancellor who also might be brain bugged or in allied to EPH or EPH in a disguised shape) )

Besides the gods are generally loners (if you do not count their believers) Kings and magistrates have the body politic behind them (if not oppressive) and death normally serves to elevate them even further beyond their station, especially violent death.

Killing Ioun could be a grave mistake.

Even if he is brain bugged.

The question would not be can they kill him, but what fallout has been arranged when and if they do?

The bug can probably tell this is weak flesh.

what is the price of one life to it that many will live?

Or maybe ioun is merely supposed to delay the defenders while EPH completes task x.

He could even get desperate to keep them around as the tip off.

Play checkers? Go to the Ball? Fight me?

anything.

[Pelwrath]

Nasty monster! here are a couple of suggestions.

A) A half-ogre mage/ half dragon but use a gem dragon. Give the pgre-mage levels in Soulknife.

B)A half-Satyr/Half green dragon. Satyr ha slevels as a Druid/Blighter.

[Asha'man]

Hope this isn't too far beyond the pale...

I was just wondering, for my own neophyte RBDM purposes, what stratagems or tactics Piratecat used to threaten 13-14th level characters with simple ghouls. Even when there are hundreds of them, on paper that just adds up to a long, annoying slog with the fighters on point. Is the mere threat of natural 1s and paralysis enough to create tension?