Picking up a weapon from the ground . . . how fast? Draws AoO?

[Forrester]

Just wanted to see how people play the following situation:

Ugluk the Orc is caught in a Sleep spell. Ugluk go to sleep, but is kicked awake by a buddy the same round. Unfortunately, Ugluk is standing 5' away from a melee opponent.

Which is correct? (Perhaps) alternatively, which way do you play it?

1) Ugluk stands, grabs his (likely dropped) weapon as he stands, and can attack the same round. The stand/grabbed dropped weapon are combined as a MEA that does not draw an AoO, as grabbing the weapon is kind of like drawing it.

--This is almost certainly way too generous to Ugluk


2) Ugluk stands, grabs his (likely dropped) weapon as he stands, and can attack the same round. Grabbing the dropped weapon provokes an AoO because it's like "retrieving a stored item". If Ugluk had Quick Draw, it wouldn't do him any good.

--This is definitely worse for Ugluk, but take a look at the next one!

3) Ugluk stands (taking a Move-Equiv to do so) and grabs his dropped weapon (taking his SECOND Move-Equiv action). He can't attack this round. Plus, he may well have just drawn an AoO, depending on whether grabbing the weapon from the ground was more like "drawing a weapon" or "retriving a stored item".


So the two main questions are:

A) Can you combine grabbing the weapon with standing from prone? Technically, according to the rules, you cannot, as you can draw a weapon for free as part of a normal move, and not as part of a move-equivalent.

B) Is grabbing the weapon going to draw an AoO?

I think "by the rules" Ugluk is incredibly screwed, but that very well may be that's the way it's supposed to be. Just curious as to how others interpret it/play it.

Thanks much!

 

['o Skoteinos]

PHB, page 128, MEA: "Pick up an item" AOO: "Yes", so picking up his weapon is a MEA that draws an AOO.

I'd rule that standing up and picking up a weapon are seperate actions and cannot be combined, so all Ugluk can do is stand up and pick up his weapon...

 

[Hypersmurf]

What about in the case of a Disarm?

Ugluk finally gets into the fight, and on Grishnahk's action, he attempts to disarm Ugluk. Depending on feats, Ugluk may or may not get an AoO, but in this case, Grishnahk succeeds in using a Standard Action to disarm Ugluk. Ugluk's sword is (once again) at his feet.

Grishnahk now wishes to use an MEA to pick up Ugluk's sword.

Can he do this from his own square, or does he need to enter Ugluk's square to do it? Picking up an item draws an AoO, but if Ugluk took one when Grishnahk attempted to disarm, he's all AoOed out - is there anything he can do to stop Grishnahk picking up his sword?

-Hyp.

 

[Mal Malenkirk]

Picking up an item on the floor is a ME that provokes an AoO.

But in your example I think the orc just takes a ME to get up and can be considered to have his weapon in hand.

A stun effect makes you drop your weapon while you stand there counting birds and bells. But a sleep only drops you.

I don't see a sleeping creature throwing his weapon away. Nothing in the rules support that and even common sense tells me he probably still has it loosely in hand or it is so close that it doesn't matter.

Beside, by the rules you can make a movement and draw your weapon as part of that movement. I think it's safe to say that you can get up and have your weapon in hand as part of the same ME.

 

[Forrester]

Actually, Malenkirk, standing up is not a "regular move", it is a move-equivalent. If you can't draw a weapon when taking a 5-foot step, it's not a given that you should be able to do so while standing up.

And common sense doesn't suggest that someone who falls asleep drops what they're holding when they fall to the ground? Huh??

I'm leaning towards the "Ugluk is screwed" interpretation now, I'm afraid.

Additional question: What initiative would Ugluk go on? Would he be able to act the moment he was woken up, or would he still go on his old initiative roll?

 

[Rashak Mani]

Standing up = Move Equivalent
Pick up Weapon = Move Equivalent and AOO.

Thats why when your in this kind of situation you draw a backup weapon...

I would rule that he is right after the Guy who kicked him awake... makes more sense.

Question of mine now:

When you stand up can you move 5 foot too ? Like standing up 5 feet away from where you feel. When arent you basically allowed 5 foot ?

 

[Mal Malenkirk]

By the rules

The sleep spell doesn't state that you drop your weapon.

By the rule Ugluk is still armed.

common sense
2-Common sense tells you that he dropped his weapon.

Common sense tells me the weapon will be right beside him.

He should be able to grab it as a free action while he stand up.

He shouldn't stand up and then bend over to pick up his weapon.

Now you can mix common sense and rules as much as you want.

Personnaly I'd go by the rule: He gets up as a ME and is armed.

 

[Quickbeam]

1) I agree with the "Ugluk is screwed" interpretation.
2) After disarming Ugluk, I'd rule that Grishnahk would draw an AoO unless the weapon fell in a square Ugluk didn't threaten. However, Grishnahk isn't likely to be overly concerned since Ugluk is unarmed at the moment...and under no circumstances would I allow Ugluk to draw a secondary weapon (if he had one) an make his AoO.
3) Ugluk's new place in the initiative order is after the fellow who awakens him.
4) Since standing up is only a MEA, I would certainly grant a 5' move thereafter.

Those would be my rulings anyhow .

*Spelling edit*

 

[Hypersmurf]

After disarming Ugluk, I'd rule that Grishnahk would draw an AoO unless the weapon fell in a square Ugluk didn't threaten. However, Grishnahk isn't likely to be overly concerned since Ugluk is unarmed at the moment...and under no circumstances would I allow Ugluk to draw a secondary weapon (if he had one) an make his AoO.

Disarm drops the weapon at Ugluk's feet, so he'll always threaten the square. He may have used his AoO when Grishnahk made his disarm attempt, and even if he hadn't, making an unarmed attack against an armed opponent draws an AoO in turn anyway

But aside from all that...

My question, I guess, was too complicated - I was really asking "Can he reach into Ugluk's square to pick up the weapon, or does he have to enter Ugluk's square to pick up the weapon?"

-Hyp.

 

[Magus Coeruleus]

Initiative after waking up from Sleep

IMC you keep your old initiative number when you recover from a sleep spell. The biggest reason is to prevent the reawakened character from the possibility of getting two actions in one round (or in quick succession anyway). Otherwise, if he for instance acted on 10, was put to sleep on 9, was woken up on 8, and then got to act, he'd get two actions for the round. Heck, the sleep spell may well have done him a favor! Rerolling initiative allows this possibility as well, though it doesn't guarantee it. Keeping the same initiative prevents this, and if more than a round goes by before he's awakened, it's as good as being random at that point.