Writing a spell in a spellbook

[poilbrun]

I have some problems with the cost to write a spell in a wizard's spellbook. Let's imagine a 5th-level wizard who wants to buy a fireball scroll and then write it in his spellbook.

So, if you want to create a 5th-level wizard NPC using the gp limit found in the DMG (9000 gp), you can only give him :
- All level 0 spells
- 8 1st-level spells (3 at 1st level, 3 for a 16 in INT, 2 that he gets for free at level 2)
- 4 2nd-level spells (4 that he gets for free at level 3 and 4)
- 2 3rd-level spells (2 that he gets for free at level 5)

And then you have to buy the other spells he has in his spellbooks as normal equipment.
A 1st level costs : 25 (scroll) + 200 (2 pages to write) = 225 gp.
A 2nd level costs : 150 (scroll) + 400 (4 pages to write) = 550 gp.
A 3rd level costs : 375 (scroll) + 600 (6 pages to write) = 975 gp.

For information, here are the costs for higher level spells :
A 4th level costs : 700 (scroll) + 800 ( 8 pages to write) = 1500 gp.
A 5th level costs : 1125 (scroll) + 1000 ( 10 pages to write) = 2125 gp.
A 6th level costs : 1650 (scroll) + 1200 ( 12 pages to write) = 2850 gp.
A 7th level costs : 2275 (scroll) + 1400 ( 14 pages to write) = 3675 gp.
A 8th level costs : 3000 (scroll) + 1600 ( 16 pages to write) = 4600 gp.
A 9th level costs : 3825 (scroll) + 1800 ( 18 pages to write) = 5625 gp.

I think it's a bit too much for a NPC, and for players, it is even more difficult to buy the scroll and write it in their spellbook. If you want to have a very high-level NPC, you have to be very careful. Even if he has a lot of gold available, he has to use a lot of it to buy the spells he has available in his spellbook(s).

I don't have any problem with the cost of the scroll, but I would lower the cost to write a spell in one's spellbook by half. Do you think it would be good or not?

 

[pontus]

Have you ever asked yourself why Boccob's Blessed Book is so popular? No scribing cost...

 

[Grayswandir]

Your example assumes that wizards must use scrolls to scribe their spells. However, wizards can easily share their spellbooks with each other, 'trading' spells as it were, and copying the spells from other spellbooks into their own. Doing so negates the cost of the scroll, requiring only the scribing cost (200 gp per spell level). This process makes spells much cheaper to buy, especially at higher levels when the cost of the scroll exceeds the cost of scribing.

[Edit: Note to self - proofread better.]

 

[Hatchling Dragon]

I'd go with 'or not'. I'm not allowing it for my Wizard player, and I am actualy pestering my own DM into charging me the 'full rate' when I collect new spells.

It's also why there are the 'convertion' rules in Tome & Blood that let you decypher someone else's Spellbook for your own use (ie: without using Read Magic about a bajillion times).

It's also why Wizards (well, mine anyway) nearly wet themselfs in joy whenever an enemy's book(s?) fall into my (er... our!) hands. Ok, this is theoretical as I've yet to capture anyone's books, but it's about what I figure he'll do

It's the trade-off for the Wizard's getting some very impressive powers at mid to high level. You want that huge repetoir of spell? Well you'll just have to pay for it. It could also help explain why trading or bartering services for spells is so much more popular than simply using cash.

And yes, I agree with the previous poster, it's exactally why there is such an item as Boccob's Blessed Book was created. I could also explain why Craft Wonderous Item is the first Creation feat I took

A character with 50,000gp of goods is either a well-equipped wizard, or one that has a hefty selection of spells.

Hatchling Dragon

 

[Grayswandir]

The rules you're thinking of, Hatchling, are in Magic of Faerun. A very nice system, and one of the best (IMO) sections of that book.

 

[Petrosian]

IMo reducing th4e costs are a bad idea...

the wizard class has a LOT of options... making items, creating large spellbooks etc... but these are LIMITED by time and money.

Look at the wotc provided NPC spellbooks and you will see only a couple of spells per spell level added beyond the 2 per level free.

In 3e the wizard is no longer assumed to be the guy with every spell known in his spell book. those costs (in time and gold) make this happen.

There are within the rules (depending on which rules) means to offset some of the cost (BBB if you can find a tenday free to make it or mastering a spellbook from MoF if you can find tenday plus level to try it and make a difficult spellcraft check but if the enemies run under the same rules these will be small spellbooks like yours are) but they add other problems. In my experience, time is every bit as much a limit as gold for these actions.

 

[bret]

The Web Enhancement for Tome & Blood has a section at the end of it with their expectations of additional spells a wizard will pick up.

I find those expectations rather low, but it points out that any he can copy from another book would only cost 200 gp / level.

When gaining spells in play, you can either buy a scroll, try to convince another to allow you access to their spell book, or capture a rival spell book. Still have to pay the scribing cost, but you might be able to avoid the cost of a scroll.

When creating characters of above 1st level and outfitting them per DMG equipment recommendation, you shouldn't have to pay the cost of a scroll. Since you don't actually have a scroll anymore, you shouldn't have to pay the cost of the scroll anymore.

If the GM balks, ask him how many of the fighters paid for armor they no longer use. How many of the Rogues had to pay for potions of Cat's Grace that were used earlier in their career.

You don't have the scroll anymore, just the spell in your spellbook. Since you've used the scroll, it shouldn't count against the cost of the equipment you are currently carrying.

 

[pontus]

You don't have the scroll anymore, just the spell in your spellbook. Since you've used the scroll, it shouldn't count against the cost of the equipment you are currently carrying.

Of course you don't have the scroll any more. It was consumed when you scribed the spell into your book, remember? The only time you shouldn't be required to pay for the scroll is when you create a PC/NPC at a higher level. But maybe that's what you meant.

 

[poilbrun]

I suppose you're right. My vision was the one from a guy who played a lot of wizards in 2nd edition but who hasn't ever played one in 3rd edition (as a matter of fact, I've never played 3rd edition, only DM)... and that's why I asked the opinion of others so that I didn't create a house rule that would have unbalanced the game...

Thanks for all your answers!

 

[bret]

Of course you don't have the scroll any more. It was consumed when you scribed the spell into your book, remember? The only time you shouldn't be required to pay for the scroll is when you create a PC/NPC at a higher level. But maybe that's what you meant.

You are correct, I was talking about creating a character with equipment of higher level.

Sorry I didn't make that clear. I'll edit the message to do so.