multiple attacks and expertise

[purple knight]

I'm new to the board, so forgive me if this question has been asked and answered already.

If you have a character with multiple attacks, can you deduct the BAB (Say the max--5 points) from one of the attacks to add to your AC, or is the same number subtracted from all possible attacks?

For example say you have a +6/+1 (assume no additional bonuses for strength, feats, etc) and you want to use expertise. Can you subtract 5 from the first attack, going at +1/+1, or do you have to subtract 5 from both, making it +1/-4?

 

[Ravellion]

Both. Same as with power attack.

edit: as in, reduce 5 from both attacks...

Rav

 

[graydoom]

The amount you subtract form your attack bonus expertise is decided before the start of your first attack, and affects all attacks you make until your next turn.

Meaning you would subtract it from both attacks, and in your example you would attack at +1/-4.

 

[bret]

The adjustment applies until the start of your next turn.

So in the +6/+1 example where someone put 5 into Expertise, they would be at +1/-4 on a full attack. On an Attack of Opportunity, they would also only have +1 to attack.

For some craziness, if you had both Power Attack and Expertise you could put 5 into Expertise and 6 into Power Attack so your attacks would be at -5/-10 but +6 damage.

 

[Ravellion]

The adjustment applies until the start of your next turn.

So in the +6/+1 example where someone put 5 into Expertise, they would be at +1/-4 on a full attack. On an Attack of Opportunity, they would also only have +1 to attack.

For some craziness, if you had both Power Attack and Expertise you could put 5 into Expertise and 6 into Power Attack so your attacks would be at -5/-10 but +6 damage.

Yeah, you'd make very defensive and terribly powerful blows... try imagining the moves one had to make for that... is that person just twirling his sword around his body or what!?

Rav

 

[Darkness]

The same guidelines also apply for "fighting defensively," of course.

 

[Lord Vangarel]

For some craziness, if you had both Power Attack and Expertise you could put 5 into Expertise and 6 into Power Attack so your attacks would be at -5/-10 but +6 damage.

I always assumed that the modifiers were cumulative so to do this you'd need to have a +11 BAB and end up with a +0 BAB.

 

[Ravellion]

Hmmm. don't have the time to check right now, but I believe you don't reduce your BAB as such, but can only apply a penalty equal to your BAB (not actually altering your BAB)

Rav

 

[shilsen]

Hmmm. don't have the time to check right now, but I believe you don't reduce your BAB as such, but can only apply a penalty equal to your BAB (not actually altering your BAB)

Rav

You are correct. The difference may seem academic, but actually reducing the BAB would lead to less attacks, and that does not change whatever you put into power attack or expertise.

 

[Lord Vangarel]

Originally posted by Rav
Hmmm. don't have the time to check right now, but I believe you don't reduce your BAB as such, but can only apply a penalty equal to your BAB (not actually altering your BAB)

That's what I meant. The BAB isn't adjusted but you can only take Expertise and Power Attack to a total of your BAB and the total you take becomes a penalty to your roll.