Re: Avatars
Hi oliver mate!
oliverhenshaw said:
I hope you're not as right as you think about Avatars.
I'll make my final decision when I get D&Dg, but from what I know at the moment I don't like them and will (almost certainly) change Avatars in the IH.
I'll make my reasoning therein. Primarily its in three parts:
- Gods should not be able to create beings as powerful as themselves/or almost as powerful as themselves in and of their own power.
- Equally, creation should require a measure of the deities Divine Power.
- Avatars do not fulfill the roles as 'middle-men' in campaigns; interacting with mortals if they are virtually equal to the deities themselves. Under those circumstances Avatars become irrelevant.
oliverhenshaw said:
Everything i've seen suggetss to me that Divine Rank and what type of God the creature is counts for a lot.
I agree. But the bottom line is that if Odin creates an Avatar its still a 60HD DR9 Lesser God. For no cost!
oliverhenshaw said:
Avatars have half the original's DR and lose two off the powers that gods have - that we know from the D&DG thread.
The difference in power is apparent, but negligable.
I also don't like how they have ignored HD/Levels. HD/Levels should count for something!
oliverhenshaw said:
What I'd expect, based on the range of their Divine Aura and that it seems the most elegant solution, is the the third major difference is the way the effect of Divine (Salient? I forget) Abilities is caculated, and possibly the number owned.
Several of the Divine Abilites vary in 'magnitude' with DR, and also in 'scale' with Divine Status (ie Demigod, Lesser God etc.) and examples of this can be seen in the Dragon preview. I believe that the scale of the Avatar's DAs will not be the same as that of the 'parent' deity, instead either being calculted from the Status of a deity with the avatar's DR or the status of a demigod.
Those are the two simplest options that fit what the previewsof Avatars we've seen. Another option would be a new Divine Status of 'Avatar', parallel to Demigod perhaps but with slightly different features - but I think the framework is there without creating a new category.
And we also know from the D&DG thread that DivStatus also adds to the number of DA that can be bought with DR. So Avatars could be expected not to recieve all the bonus DRs that their parent Greater God gets.
And all these differences are more subtle, so assumed into the descriptions of individual Avatars.
Obviously Divine Ranks count, but ignorance of HD/Levels is a stupid move in many ways. Zeus is clearly more powerful than Odin even though they both have the same Divine Rank.
Levels I would prescribe to upon initially seeing most of D&Dgs stats:
Minimum/Average/Maximum*
*For the purpose of NPCs
Quasi/Hero-deity 20/30/40
Demigod 30/40/50
Lesser God 40/50/60
Intermediate God 50/60/70
Greater God 60/70/80
The fact that they have also omitted Challenge Ratings tells another story.
oliverhenshaw said:
All in all, it seems to me that DivStatus plays such a large role in a Deity's power and abilities that it must factor into the CR calculations as well as Divine Ranks.
Some of the above might also go some way to mitigating the apparent similairties between Iuz (demonic creature lets not forget, evein if 'just' a demigod) and Nerull (DR17? and a Greater God) who must have capabilities beyond Iuz's.
I agree that Nerull is more powerful than Iuz despite having the same HD/Levels. But Nerull should be vastly more powerful!
Iuz had 165hp in 1st ed. and Nerull 400!
Anyone who says hit points are irrelevant to such beings doesn't have a clue either!
Hi poilbrun mate!
I see your post - I'll reply a little later!
