How deep is the Division? Roll Player & Role Player
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  1. #1
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    How deep is the Division? Roll Player & Role Player

    All to often it happens that you have your roll players & your Role players clash in a group. This is not a rant, it is a general census to figure out what side people walk. Often, what I have seen is that the two sides clash. In my experience when you have an equal amount of both types, the group has a hard time coming together, often working together only because they are in the same game. I feel that when you have an extreme of both, the players simply don't work.
    Here is a general opinion for both sides of the coin:

    Your Role Players will complain about a lack of politics, and alternative ways out of a situation. When combined with Roll Players they will sometimes, take to extreme's against combat ("Wait there's gotta be a better way"). these people can easily feel frustrated when combat occurs to often. Simply because they have not focussed themselves in becoming Combat engines. They feel that fighting though needed, is a tool like, diplomacy that should be used only when needed. The Role Player may even feel that the Roll Player is immature & only wants a fight, remaining incapable to intelligent thought.

    Now, for the other side of the coin. You have your Roll Players, who love the idea of combat, and will often design their characters out, along a set path, sometimes, a path of sheer destructive forces, that makes them lethal combat machines. Often Roll players will become impatient when a game slows down, and get annoyed with Role Players. These players have focussed their characters for the fight, to them this is The purpose of the game is the fight. Roll Players can get very bored when the good old fight is lacking, and they have to "wait around and listen to the local baron, speak about is right to raise taxes". The Roll Player may feel that the Role Player is a idiot or fool for always wanting to roleplay & shunning combat, simply because it is the opposite of combat.

    I try to keep an opened mind about both sides, but there are times when it just gets frustrating. Currently, my train of thought is that both sides need to come to a mutual understanding and expectance of the others style. because combining the two, can only lead to greater unity. This unity, would make for a stronger group. (Hey don't get me wrong there are plenty of times I am just itching for raw combat, but there are also times when I want to hear the development of the story.) My concern is that unless an entire gaming group can get over there miss-conception of the other side, the rift will always remain. I think that age, social maturity & good old fashioned respect for the other side is what makes a game successful. Also I feel the only way this will work is if everyone is open to the idea, it simply does not work in my opinion if 1 or more players don't view the issue on a equal basis.

    Any opinions, comments, or thoughts on the subject of Roll players & role players?

  2. #2
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    I think extreme examples are rare, and situations where they literally can't game together because their expectations of the game are so different are also extremely rare (they may not enjoy gaming together for a number of other reasons, but not because they are divided along the role/roll player split.)

    Me? I'd call myself a roleplayer in that I hate taking the time to min/max or do things along a tightly proscripted path regardless of what happens in-game. I prefer character-driven games and interesting stories that feature tough choices by believable characters and complex manuevering. But I certainly don't avoid combat studiously or even think of it as only a tool. The kinds of stories I'd like to roleplay are usually fairly action-oriented stories, so I like it to come fairly frequently.

    IMO, you're talking about extreme White Wolf poseurs vs. extreme dungeon-crawling grognards. I can't think that I've ever actually gamed with anyone that I thought was anywhere near either extreme.
    Last edited by Desdichado; Monday, 6th May, 2002 at 06:54 PM.

  3. #3
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    Originally posted by Joshua Dyal
    IMO, you're talking about extreme White Wolf poseurs vs. extreme dungeon-crawling grognards. I can't think that I've ever actually gamed with anyone that I thought was anywhere near either extreme.
    It's true alot of people take a middle stance on the two sides. But those in the middle are the kind of people who have learned to except and work with both sides. maybe I should have wrote a 3rd example, by which the middle ground is found.

    Do you feel that age, and social skil scan be a big factor in determining the extreme's though?

  4. #4
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    I don't think so, no. I think it's just personal taste.

  5. #5
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    A good point indeed.

  6. #6
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    As a DM I try to balance things out. When I plan an adventure I try to make sure there is something for everyone. THe session might be more combat oriented one week, then more role playing the next. Give the PCs what they want to an extent.

  7. #7
    The logical conclusion of what you characterize as 'roll player' is that Might Makes Right.

    Whoever is the biggest, baddest combat monster wins the arguement.

    People don't tend to like to be bullied. Sooner or later, either a lot of people will work together or they will find someone with an edge who can take care of a bully. Such a person put forward as head of state is often called a tyrant.


    Rather than thinking about it as combat oriented, why not think of it as character development oriented. Why does the character make certain choices as they develope?

  8. #8
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    We had once a problem with a roll player. He would interrupt any roleplaying activity and try to start a fray as soon as possible. This would trigger some other players to join him in this kind of behavior. We expelled him and since then, all is going smooth.

    BTW, roll player isn't a good term. Most Diablo players would not have an idea of what they are.

  9. #9
    yep balance

    I always have at least 2 (aim for 3) ways to resolve a situation one of which is of course combat.

    However Combat is OFTEN the least desirable option because the PCs are going to be beaten - if not killed then possibly maimed or at least arrested (I don't have raise/ressurection imc and use the healing turns damage into subdual idea (so the recovery still has to occur).

    eg If a Level 8 PC is silly enough to attack the Baron whilst he is making is speech he will find that the baron is a Fighter 5/Cleric 7 and his ten bodyguards are Barbarian 5/Ranger 5.

    Also give extra XP for roleplaying - using diplomacy to get the Baron to lower taxes will get the same XP as killing him PLUS bonus XP for Roleplaying (after all in both cases you've overcome the challenge posed by the Baron)

  10. #10
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    I'm both. I like both sides of play. Either alone is BORING.

    I do have a beef with ROLE-players who refuse to understand the rules..... THATS annoying.

    How much experience do you award for peaceful resolution? I don't seem to get as much when I play so the closer to leveling I get the less likely I am to negotiate.

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