Take that Vance!

widderslainte · May 14, 2002

I have vague memories of numerous cartoons or films where wizards fling about bursts of energy (fire, electricity, whatever) as part of combat, with the frequncy of an archer. That wasn't possible in D&D, unless you were of high level or had very few combat scenes. It's not quite my style of campaign anymore, but I always though it was neat.

In 2E I implemented the idea as a 2nd level spell, "Rey's Radical Ray", which popped up in various low level varities. It was a blast of energy (mechanically not unlike magic missile) that did a particular type of damage. It was a stylistic invention that also filled a gap in the 2nd level combat spell repetoire at the time.

In re-examining the concept in 3E, I thought of another approach. Why not let wizards do this (almost) every round as a feat? "Balance!", they cry out. Well, in my old games, when the wizard didn't have any combat spells left, he pulled out his sling. Cheap, not terribly effective (in damage or by virture of his THAC0), and reasonably unlimted in ammo.

I'm looking more for style then real combat prowess. All things being equal I'd rather (as a DM) have a Wizard hurls small bolts of energy that slingstones.

So the Wizard takes this "energy ray" as a feat. It requires a ranged touch attack roll. Range? 10' per level - is that too much? Damage: 1d4 to start. Perhaps "improved energy ray" exists as a feat, doing 1d6 damage. Not real "magical effects" in terms of harming supernatural creatures. So far, not much better than a sling. A per/day limit in it's use? Is this necessary? How's this sound so far?

Jasperak · May 14, 2002

Sounds like a good idea, so long as it does not take the place of the caster's normal spells. Meaning that if a caster were to take more utilitarian spells thinking that his feat would handle any attacks he would need to make, the feat is too powerful. Remember that Ray of Frost is 0-level and does 1d3 damage, so finding a balance will be difficult.

I like the idea to add style and hope that an acceptable game mechanic can be formed.

bwgwl · May 14, 2002

it doesn't sound terribly unbalancing, and it is definitely "flavorful."

you've already stated it doesn't overcome damage reduction, so its utility at even mid-levels is not really a problem.

it's effectively equivalent to picking up an exotic weapon proficiency.

widderslainte · May 14, 2002

You're right about the possibility of it taking away from normal combat spells. But I would almost it rather. Much like 1E & 2E clerics stocking up on healing, I've seen (in nearly 20 years of gaming) wizards stocking up fireballs, magic missile, etc, to that they have some roll in combat. Now that they can grab swords, the place of the lower power combat spells is even further diminished. I'd rather see them take Obscuring Mist or Spider Climb, or something.

In reference to Ray of Frost, how many 0-level spells (a day) do you think a feat is worth (especially for something who effeciency diminishes at higher levels) ?

bwgwl · May 14, 2002

widderslainte said:
In reference to Ray of Frost, how many 0-level spells (a day) do you think a feat is worth (especially for something who effeciency diminishes at higher levels) ?

well, here's a benchmark:

Resistance is a zero-level spell that grants you a +1 bonus to all saves for 1 minute.

Iron Will, Great Fortitude, and Lightning Reflexes are feats that grant you a +2 bonus to one type of save all the time.

i'd say a feat that replicates the effects of a zero-level spell might even be balanced if it could be used at will -- i.e., no limits on how many times per day.

kolvar · May 14, 2002

for me, it sounds to (slightly) powerfull:
You can disarm someone using a weapon and even sling-shots can run out (and the sling be taken away).
There should be a possibility to disarm the mage or the number of uses should have a limit (e.g. one point of subdual damage taken per use).
I like the flavor very much, though.
How about other feats influencing your instant rays? Metamagic? Eldritch?
What about sorcerers or bards (while sorcerers feel right for this, bards somehow do not)?

widderslainte · May 14, 2002

Thanks everyone for your comments.

Bwgwl, those benchmarks are very helpful.

kolvar, the disarming point is valid, but if I was taking this feat as a Wizard, I'd expect a little more than what I could do with any simple missile weapon. As to the "ammunition" advantage, I've pondered that. I was think about something tied to constitution (channelling energy through the body and all), whether once per point of constitution per day or what, I'm not sure.

I'll post a write up sometime this evening.

Valicor · May 14, 2002

just an idea out of the blue, since its magical energy, why not tie it directly into your spell pool per day.

Make is so you can set it to any spell level you choose. You then can due it that number ot times per/day x2. You can prepare multpile uses aswell at the costs of additonal spell slots.

An example: I have a level 5 sorceror and choose to use an level 2 spell slot, I can delivier the attack level x2 per day. So 2x2=4,

essentially if you really wanted you could eventually tie like 5 spell slots of 9th level if you really wanted to.

DreamChaser · May 14, 2002

here's my version that I made a while back

MAGE BOLT (General Feat, Exclusive)

You gain the ability to make a magical energy attack.

Prerequisites: Cast arcane spells, Intelligence or Charisma 13+, the ability to use Evocation magic

Benefits: You can make a magical attack as a normal attack action. This attack uses the wizards normal attack modifier, with a range increment of 10 feet, and causes 1d4 points of damage (Critical Range/Effect: 20/x2) on a successful hit. This bolt functions as though it were a weapon for purposes of multiple attacks. Any spell resistance that affects Evocation magic (including general spell resistance) offers complete protection from this attack. The mage bolt is considered a spell-like ability and requires enough concentration that it can be disrupted by a successful attack (DC 10+damage). This ability has no somatic component beyond "throwing" the bolt and therefore is not limited by armor.

Throwing mage bolts requires a quartz crystal focus. This can be placed in a wand, ring, or amulet. A crystal can focus a number of Bolts equal to its gold piece value before being burnt out. A burnt out quartz cannot be used to focus mage bolts.

Special: The Weapon Finesse and Weapon Focus feats can be taken to improve the magic-users skill with the Bolts.

I created it this way for a number of reasons:
1) it is a standard attack so in theory it could be made a number of times in a round and does not gain the benefit of ranged touch attacks so they don't directly compete with rays.

2) Spell resistance renders them useless, thus forcing the magic user to resort to spells against more powerful foes. But it is also subject to damage reduction.

3) the quartz crystal requirement (or other similar focus depending on flavor) take care of the disarm and ammo problem.

Those are my thoughts.

Tony Vargas · May 15, 2002

Re: here's my version that I made a while back

DreamChaser said:
here's my version that I made a while back
MAGE BOLT (General Feat, Exclusive)

I remember that. Too bad you didn't keep the special about drawing on ambient magical energy to power the bolt. I thought the image of a mage tossing bolts of flame out of a nearby wall of fire was kinda cute...

BTW, I used DreamChaser's feat as a pre-req for another one:

Eldritch Bolt [Metamagic Feat]
&nbsp&nbsp&nbsp&nbsp You can release stored magical energy in a deadly blast, regardless of the sort of spell stored.
&nbsp&nbsp&nbsp&nbsp Prerequisites: Mage Bolt, Ability to /Prepare/ Arcane Spells.
&nbsp&nbsp&nbsp&nbsp Benefits: You can release a prepared spell, but, instead of completing it normally, simply channel the power into a blast of magical force. The Bolt has a range of 10' + 5' per level, requires a Ranged Touch Attack to hit, and inflicts 1d4 damage +1d4 per level of the spell 'burned' to produce it. Releasing an Eldritch Bolt is a Standard, spellcasting, action - regardless of the casting time of the spell being 'burned' - and requires Somatic Components, only.
&nbsp&nbsp&nbsp&nbsp The nature of the Bolt can vary based on the personality/style of the caster. Any characteristics of the spell used (School, Good/Evil, Force, Fire, Lightning, etc), are shared by the bolt produced.
&nbsp&nbsp&nbsp&nbsp Special: Other Metamagic Feats can be combined with the Eldritch Bolt, decreasing it's level for damage purposes. For instance a 3rd level spell used to produce a Stilled Eldritch Bolt, would simply inflict 3d4, instead of the usual 4d4.

This one allows a mage to prep a variety of non-combat spells while retaining some potential to use magic in combat if the need unexpectedly arises...