What have i missed about Greenbound Summoning?

Mr_GrinReaper · Apr 23, 2005

This feat reminds me of our parties former rogue/fighter with manyshot. Gads- he did 88 damage in a round once at 4th level... No fun to play when he was around, and I imagine that its no fun to play with this feat as a PC feat, unless It had augment summoning as a prereq. and stated that it increased the casting time, and diddn't stack with augment summoning. Then I'd viably accept it.

Lonely Tylenol · Apr 24, 2005

The caster level for those spell-like abilities is equal to the character level of the creature summoned. Assuming that monster HD count for character level, can a summoned 3 HD animal (or whatever you summon) actually use Wall of Thorns as a spell-like ability, considering that normally the minimum caster level for the spell Wall of Thorns is 9th?

But yeah, this thing seems to have BBEG Druid written all over it, with a side order of "yes, your druid can learn this feat, but only after defeating the enemy druid and learning where he had unearthed this forgotten knowledge, then going there and making an adventure out of learning it yourself."

Ridley's Cohort · Apr 24, 2005

moritheil said:
Now I'm curious. Does this mean that you have to use a higher level SNA spell to summon a Greenbound, perhaps? That would make it slightly less broken.

Not as written. The SNA spell makes no explicit reference to CR. We just mention CR because it is approximately correct than SNA n summons a CR n critter. There are obvious variances but it is a decent starting point for discussions of relative power level of summoned creatures.

moritheil · Apr 25, 2005

Ridley's Cohort said:
Not as written. The SNA spell makes no explicit reference to CR. We just mention CR because it is approximately correct than SNA n summons a CR n critter. There are obvious variances but it is a decent starting point for discussions of relative power level of summoned creatures.

I was afraid of that. Still, that provides handy material for a houserule. Although the man issue seems to be the wall of thorns at low levels rather than any other aspect of it.

green slime · Apr 25, 2005

Taking the feat, The monster's should be added to the list of summonable monsters at the appropriate CR level. This then turns the overpowered feat to one that is underpowered, and mostly for favour. (IMNSHO).

To do otherwise is rather strange. As a flavour feat, it is more interesting for DM's to use, for a special villian or organisation.

edbonny · Apr 25, 2005

Omission?

The Greenbound Summoning was written by yours truly as a metamagic feat with the Summon Nature's Ally spell using a spell slot 2 levels higher. That fact appears to have been omitted from the print version.

- Ed Bonny

moritheil · Apr 25, 2005

edbonny said:
The Greenbound Summoning was written by yours truly as a metamagic feat with the Summon Nature's Ally spell using a spell slot 2 levels higher. That fact appears to have been omitted from the print version.

- Ed Bonny

Aha, a higher level SNA is needed after all. That was the interpretation I was hoping was correct. Neat, thanks!

Hypersmurf · Apr 25, 2005

Dr. Awkward said:
The caster level for those spell-like abilities is equal to the character level of the creature summoned. Assuming that monster HD count for character level, can a summoned 3 HD animal (or whatever you summon) actually use Wall of Thorns as a spell-like ability, considering that normally the minimum caster level for the spell Wall of Thorns is 9th?

Yes, it can.

From the Monster Manual:
For creatures with spell-like abilities, a designated caster level defines how difficult it is to dispel their spell-like effects and to define any level-dependent variables (such as range and duration) the abilities might have. The creature’s caster level never affects which spell-like abilities the creature has; sometimes the given caster level is lower than the level a spellcasting character would need to cast the spell of the same name. If no caster level is specified, the caster level is equal to the creature’s Hit Dice. The saving throw (if any) against a spell-like ability is 10 + the level of the spell the ability resembles or duplicates + the creature’s Cha modifier.

-Hyp.