Request for understanding about Star Wars concepts (Spoiler Caution)

Could the people here on ENWorld help me here? I'm lost on these subjects, and I was hoping the people in the know would have answers. Anyone?

What is Taoism?
What are the tenets of Taoism?
How did the Jedi abide by the tenets of Taoism?

Did Taoism cause the fall of the Jedi? Did it aid in their fall? Did it give the Sith an advantage over the Jedi?
Did Taoism play a part in the fall of Anakin? If yes, how? What could they have done differently?

How is Anakin's Chosen status related to Taoism? Did he bring Balance to the Force? If yes, how? If he failed, why?

I see that Obi-Wan and Yoda did not train Luke the way Obi-Wan and Yoda trained and taught Anakin.
What were the differences?
Why did they train Luke differently?
Did the difference in training make Luke stronger than Anakin?
What exactly where Obi-Wan and Yoda hoping to make out of Luke?

I guess I'm also asking how Obi-Wan and Yoda themselves evolved, between Episodes III and IV, if anyone would like to discuss this.

Thank you much.

Edena_of_Neith

I wrote the following in response to your question in another thread:

The Jedi code seems to be based much more on Buddhism than on Taoism, though the two are similar in many ways.

Taoism teaches a person to go with the flow, to accept and embrace change. Too much intellectual thought, too much striving, and too much stubbornness, force and desire make a person lose contact with the Tao. Two of Taoism's fundementals are intuition and flexibility. It uses water as a prominent symbol: Water flows around obstacles, rather than trying to force its way through them, yet it is the strongest element, able to erode anything given time. The Jedi "letting themselves go" and giving in to the force is very Taoist, as is their trusting in their feelings, rather than trying to intellectually work through everything.

There are also very strong elements of Buddhism in the Jedi. One of its core tenets is that desire and attachment inevitably bring pain, confusion, and conflict, and blind you to the world. Rise above desire and attachment, and center yourself to clear yourself of all your preconceptions and emotional blindspots, and think and feel clearly. The aim isn't to become a coldly logical vulcan, as some have suggested on ROTS threads, but to become a calm and peaceful person who acts according to his wisdom and clear perceptions, unlike people who struggle with their conflicting desires and respond in knee-jerk reactions according to their preconceptions.

These are gross simplifications, of course, and there are a lot of different forms of Taoism and Buddhism that differ, but these should be sufficient to understand the origins of the Jedi anyway. (They're oversimplifications, but Lucas based Jedi on oversimplifications, so they fits. )

How is Anakin's Chosen status related to Taoism? Did he bring Balance to the Force? If yes, how? If he failed, why?

Click to expand...

There isn't any "chosen one" symbology at all in Taoism that I know of.
Balance is a very important part of Taoism. Yin (passive, feminine, dark, water) and Yang (forceful, masculine, bright, fire) are in balance with each other, but just as the Jedi focus on the light, so do Taoists tend to focus on the importance of Yin.

Perhaps the sith push the dark side of the force to an extreme, imbalancing it, while perhaps the Jedi are becoming set in their ways and are gradually losing their humility and flexibility. The Jedi also are trying to keep the galaxy static and unchanging, by enforcing the status quo. By letting the galaxy move forward on its own course, making the Jedi retreat to into hiding to live in simple solitude, ultimakely bringing about the destruction of the Sith, perhaps Anakin did bring about balance.

I guess I'm also asking how Obi-Wan and Yoda themselves evolved, between Episodes III and IV, if anyone would like to discuss this.

Click to expand...

In the prequels, Qui Gon and Yoda are much better Taoists than Obi Wan. Qui Gon is resigned and warm, and trusts his fate to the force, whereas Obi Wan tends to be more crotchety and forceful. By EpIV he's gained a lot of wisdom, and has the peaceful detatchment that he lacked in the prequels. He accepts where the force takes him, rather than trying to push his way to where he wants to be.

Yoda did likewise, though he was much wiser in the prequels than Obi Wan. He did learn to appreciate simplicity though, which is another Taoist principle.

Edit: That's Yang, not Yand.

Edena_of_Neith said:

Could the people here on ENWorld help me here? I'm lost on these subjects, and I was hoping the people in the know would have answers. Anyone?

What is Taoism?
What are the tenets of Taoism?
How did the Jedi abide by the tenets of Taoism?

Click to expand...

Here's a snippet from www.religioustolerance.org
( http://www.religioustolerance.org/taoism.htm )

I think some of the similarities will be obvious, but I've highlighted a few points that struck me as being similar:

Taoist Beliefs and Practices:

• Taoism has provided an alternative to the Confucian tradition in China. The two traditions have coexisted in the country, region and generally within the same individual.
• Tao is the first-cause of the universe. It is a force that flows through all life.
• "The Tao surrounds everyone and therefore everyone must listen to find enlightenment."
• Each believer's goal is to become one with the Tao.
• The priesthood views the many gods as manifestations of the one Dao, "which could not be represented as an image or a particular thing." The concept of a personified deity is foreign to them, as is the concept of the creation of the universe. Thus, they do not pray as Christians do; there is no God to hear the prayers or to act upon them. They seek answers to life's problems through inner meditation and outer observation.
• In contrast with the beliefs and practices of the priesthood, most of the laity have "believed that spirits pervaded nature...The gods in heaven acted like and were treated like the officials in the world of men; worshipping the gods was a kind of rehearsal of attitudes toward secular authorities. On the other hand, the demons and ghosts of hell acted like and were treated like the bullies, outlaws, and threatening strangers in the real world; they were bribed by the people and were ritually arrested by the martial forces of the spirit officials." 3
• Time is cyclical, not linear as in Western thinking.
• Taoists generally have an interest in promoting health and vitality.
• Five main organs and orifices of the body correspond to the five parts of the sky: water, fire, wood, metal and earth.
• Each person must nurture the Ch'i (air, breath) that has been given to them.
• Development of virtue is one's chief task. The Three Jewels to be sought are compassion, moderation and humility.
• Taoists follow the art of "wu wei," which is to let nature take its course. For example, one should allow a river to flow towards the sea unimpeded; do not erect a dam which would interfere with its natural flow.
• One should plan in advance and consider carefully each action before making it.
• A Taoists is kind to other individuals, largely because such an action tends to be reciprocated.
• Taoists believe that "people are compassionate by nature...left to their own devices [they] will show this compassion without expecting a reward." 5

Taoism also embraces the idea that there are opposing forces in the universe, yin and yang, though their concepts of yin and yang aren't so overtly representative of good and evil as the light and dark side are in SW.

Thank you both for the long, thought out articles. I appreciate it.
I'd love to hear more, if anyone wishes to give their thinking on the matter.
Again, thanks much.

Edena_of_Neith

I'm reading a fringe theory book on ancient religions surviving into the modern day (Talisman, by Graham Hancock and Robert Bauval...mining for my SR4e game), and a bit in the beginning discussed the Cathars.

Aside from having every variety of supernatural in the first WoD obsessed with them, there are bits of Catharism that resemble Jedi very closely. Specifically, the perfecti, roaming the land with the apprentice. Of course, the parallel breaks down pretty quickly if you look at it hard (the perfecti were pacifists, not lightsaber-wielding stone cold killers), but it's amusing.

Brad

Keep in mind the Jedi aren't actually forbidden from feeling, i.e. they don't have to be like Vulcans, what they're really forbidden from is anything that leads to attachment. Anakin makes it painfully obvious why, his attachment to his mother and Padme and his inability to let go is what leads to his fall to the darkside and the oppresion of the galaxy. This is spell out in Ep2, when Anakin and Padme are enrout to Naboo, it's even mentioned that they're supposed to show compassion (in a 'for your fellow man' sort of way).

I would welcome more input on this, if anyone would like to talk about it.

I appreciate the responses above. I'm considering them. I don't have any replies yet. I'm just musing over what you have said.

Edena_of_Neith