D&D 3E/3.5 3.5 Druids - what to do about them?

werk · Jul 19, 2005

Prism said:
I would say that the majority of your equipment actually remains in place and working when in wildshape - assuming the new form has the limbs to wear it

This was posted in one of the previous threads discussing wildshape. It was originally posted on WotC.

Quadraped items slots:

One skull cap or helm
One pair of lenses or goggles
One collar
One saddle blanket or vest
One saddle or jacket
One belt or strap worn in front of or over the haunches
One pectoral or harness worn over the chest or shoulders
One pair foreleg bracers
One pair of foreleg shoes or mitts -- hoofed creatures wear shoes and creatures with paws wear mitts
Two rings -- creatures with toes wear rings on the toes and creatures with hooves wear "rings" just above fore hooves
One pair of hind leg shoes or mitts -- hoofed creatures wear shoes and creatures with paws wear mitts

Prism · Jul 19, 2005

werk said:
This was posted in one of the previous threads discussing wildshape. It was originally posted on WotC.

That seemed to more aimed at animal companions but I agree it applies to wildshape to. As many forms are of different size to the druids true size I would say that the ruling under magic items in the DMG also applies which allows certain items to resize magically or to be made to fit different sizes.

Lord Pendragon · Jul 19, 2005

Prism said:
That seemed to more aimed at animal companions but I agree it applies to wildshape to. As many forms are of different size to the druids true size I would say that the ruling under magic items in the DMG also applies which allows certain items to resize magically or to be made to fit different sizes.

Some magic items resize. They do not reshape. Allowing magical boots to reshape into magical horse mittens is a House Rule.

I allow druids to buy magical equipment made for an animal shape. I also allow druids to pay extra (a lot extra) to enchant a magical item to reshape. But it does not come automatically and for free. Druids are strong enough as it is without House Ruling magic items so they can use all their ordinary stuff in Dire Tiger form.

Felon · Jul 19, 2005

Jack,

If you really wanted to discuss ways to reign in the druid, and just that, then I hope you've learned your lesson.

Don't assume everyone's going to agree with your assertion as if it were prima facie. Now the entire thread has turned into folks going to ridiculous lengths to argue that the druid is fine, and you're just being a Chicken Little--why, if anything a druid weak I tell you!!! Preposterous, of course--it is very broken--but now that's all this thread can be about.

For all of the folks who whing about things being broken, there's no small contingent of know-it-alls who want to insist that the status quo is fine. This can be avoided the next time by clarifying that you are not interested in discussing whether or not the druid is overpowered, and that the topic specifically assumes that you agree the druid is OTT. If anyone tries to debate the issue, politely tell them they're off-topic and contact a moderator if necessary.

Prism · Jul 19, 2005

Lord Pendragon said:
Some magic items resize. They do not reshape. Allowing magical boots to reshape into magical horse mittens is a House Rule.

I allow druids to buy magical equipment made for an animal shape. I also allow druids to pay extra (a lot extra) to enchant a magical item to reshape. But it does not come automatically and for free. Druids are strong enough as it is without House Ruling magic items so they can use all their ordinary stuff in Dire Tiger form.

In our group we allow for most normal items to resize so any size of character can wear them. If making or buying items for my druid character I tend to go for loose fitting stuff that can fit a couple of different sizes mainly for in game reasons (since items resizie anyway). We don't have any precident for allowing reshaping

dagger · Jul 19, 2005

But they can still post if they want. Discussing ways to reign in the druid should be limited to the House Rules forum I think.

Felon said:
Jack,

If you really wanted to discuss ways to reign in the druid, and just that, then I hope you've learned your lesson. Don't assume everyone's going to agree with your assertion as if it were prima facie. Now the entire thread has turned into folks going to ridiculous lengths to argue that the druid is fine, and you're just being a Chicken Little--why, if anything a druid weak I tell you!!! Preposterous, of course--it is very broken--but now that's all this thread can be about.

For all of the folks who whing about things being broken, there's no small contingent of know-it-alls who want to insist that the status quo is fine. This can be avoided the next time by clarifying that you are not interested in discussing whether or not the druid is overpowered, and that the topic specifically assumes that you agree the druid is OTT. If anyone tries to debate the issue, politely tell them they're off-topic and contact a moderator if necessary.

mirivor · Jul 19, 2005

Now, now... we can be civil.

Yes, I have presented some house rules... but isn't that the purpose of this thread? Did it not receive the title of "...what to do about them"?

Thanee makes the point that I wished to make in a more concise manner. No, the Druid's spell list is not by any means awful, but it is not the equal of, say, the Cleric or especially the Sorcerer/Wizard.

Felon: I think that your post was unnecessary. In a way, those of us arguing for the Druid as presented in the core rules are trying to show him that he may not need to do anything about the druid. Young players, a flaw in DM style, unnofficial sources *SHUDDER* such as the various ultimate books... any number of things can lead to a horribly overpowered character or class.

I have shared what I thought was an excellent way to help with the Wildshaping issue, my thoughts on the spell lists in the hopes that maybe Jack will take another look, and some general advice on what to do about the Druid as presented. This is precisely what this post asked for, is it not? "3.5 Druids - What to do about them?"

If my advice is not wanted, then Jack may simply say so and I will not post said advice.

Patryn of Elvenshae · Jul 19, 2005

mirivor said:
Now, now... we can be civil.

Yes, I have presented some house rules... but isn't that the purpose of this thread?

This thread? Yes.

This forum? No.

Try here, instead: http://www.enworld.org/forumdisplay.php?f=45

mirivor · Jul 19, 2005

Well said, Patryn. But it is obviously not within my power to move this thread.

I have a question.... it will probably open up a can of something unpleasant.

Under the druid's Wildshape restriction, it clearly states that she retains her form, "usually humanoid". Doesn't that make her ineligible for Animal Growth?

Patryn of Elvenshae · Jul 20, 2005

mirivor said:
Under the druid's Wildshape restriction, it clearly states that she retains her form, "usually humanoid". Doesn't that make her ineligible for Animal Growth?

Where does it say that?

SRD said:
Wild Shape (Su): At 5th level, a druid gains the ability to turn herself into any Small or Medium animal and back again once per day. Her options for new forms include all creatures with the animal type. This ability functions like the polymorph spell, except as noted here. The effect lasts for 1 hour per druid level, or until she changes back. Changing form (to animal or back) is a standard action and doesn’t provoke an attack of opportunity.

The form chosen must be that of an animal the druid is familiar with.

A druid loses her ability to speak while in animal form because she is limited to the sounds that a normal, untrained animal can make, but she can communicate normally with other animals of the same general grouping as her new form. (The normal sound a wild parrot makes is a squawk, so changing to this form does not permit speech.)

A druid can use this ability more times per day at 6th, 7th, 10th, 14th, and 18th level, as noted on Table: The Druid. In addition, she gains the ability to take the shape of a Large animal at 8th level, a Tiny animal at 11th level, and a Huge animal at 15th level.

The new form’s Hit Dice can’t exceed the character’s druid level.

At 12th level, a druid becomes able to use wild shape to change into a plant creature with the same size restrictions as for animal forms. (A druid can’t use this ability to take the form of a plant that isn’t a creature.)

At 16th level, a druid becomes able to use wild shape to change into a Small, Medium, or Large elemental (air, earth, fire, or water) once per day. These elemental forms are in addition to her normal wild shape usage. In addition to the normal effects of wild shape, the druid gains all the elemental’s extraordinary, supernatural, and spell-like abilities. She also gains the elemental’s feats for as long as she maintains the wild shape, but she retains her own creature type.

At 18th level, a druid becomes able to assume elemental form twice per day, and at 20th level she can do so three times per day. At 20th level, a druid may use this wild shape ability to change into a Huge elemental.