Greyhawk experts -- what is the current year?

caudor · Aug 22, 2005

Greyhawk experts---please help!

I'm getting ready to start a Shackled City Campaign in Greyhawk (which I know occurs before Age of Worms). I suspect this happens sometime after the Greyhawk wars. For the life of me...searching the internet and browsing my old Greyhawk materials, I can't determine a current year (595 CY?) for this campaign.

What is the official (or as official as you can get) current year for Greyhawk now days? Basically, I'm just looking for a proper year to start my Shackled City Campaign? Thanks in advance.

AdmundfortGeographer · Aug 22, 2005

You can't go wrong with starting in 591 cy. That's the year the Living Greyhawk Gazetteer covers. The last AD&D resource for Greyhawk that you could get that tried to be comprehensive (called The Adventure Begins) also dealt with 591 cy, but that was pretty sparse in detail if you wanted to run a campaign elsewhere other than the Domain of Greyhawk. The LGG covers the whole continent.

I believe the Greyhawk Wars boxed set dealt with the 585 cy era, for what it is worth, so if you want to run The Shackled City while the major upheavals, wars, invasions, and rebellions were going on get yourself a copy of the From the Ashes boxed set. If you don't already own it... it'll probably cost you a minor fortune to get it.

Meanwhile, the RPGA's Living Greyhawk campaign is working through 595 cy right now with 596 beginning in January 2006. The problem with running the Shackled City in 595 based on what has been developed by the Living Greyhawk campaign volunteers is that... well... good luck finding anything comprehensive on what has happened to the whole continent. You may find enough for small random areas if you yourself go dig and scour for them. By the time you find the comprehensive updates to 595 cy for everything presented in the Living Greyhawk Gazetteer you more than likely could have already finished the campaign if you just based your Shackled City campaign in 591 cy using the Living Greyhawk Gazetteer as is to begin with...

caudor · Aug 22, 2005

Thanks Eric

I think 591 CY, as you suggest, will work out OK. Wow, I have an Out of the Ashes boxed set; I had no idea it was worth something now days.

Thanks again!

Romnipotent · Aug 22, 2005

Living Greyhawk is 595CY and next year.... 596

but the RPGA is evil! and evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil evil .... get the idea?... evil evil organisation that has you play for years, meanwhile after edition updates, crackdowns and removals of "privledges" you're left with a character whose entire premise no longer exists because he cant be a Royal Explorer, nor can he map all of Oerth on griffons! Im not jaded... nope

AdmundfortGeographer · Aug 22, 2005

Romnipotent said:
... Im not jaded... nope

How about "bitter"?

radferth · Aug 22, 2005

How do you get the griffons to sit still while you draw the maps on them?

Romnipotent · Aug 23, 2005

exotic saddle with drawing table on it, tethered pen, and a set of clamps... and the maps aren't drawn on griffons themselves silly.

haakon1 · Aug 23, 2005

Eric Anondson said:
You can't go wrong with starting in 591 cy. That's the year the Living Greyhawk Gazetteer covers.

That would be the easiest way to go, and it wouldn't be "wrong" in interacting with any officially published stuff from WOTC.

Eric Anondson said:
I believe the Greyhawk Wars boxed set dealt with the 585 cy era, for what it is worth, so if you want to run The Shackled City while the major upheavals, wars, invasions, and rebellions were going on get yourself a copy of the From the Ashes boxed set. If you don't already own it... it'll probably cost you a minor fortune to get it.

Here's the "secret" history: In the mid-1980s, Gary Gygax, creator of D&D and Greyhawk, was ousted by Lorraine Williams in a corporate coup for control of TSR. She decided to publish 2nd Edition and focus it on Forgotten Realms, and some other minor settings. During this period, there was slim to none on the respect-o-meter for Greyhawk and its players. There are many contenders for what the worst offender was -- 2nd Edition's version of Castle Greyhawk, the module "Puppets", etc. IMHO, the worst offender is "Greyhawk Wars", a boxed set war game that's like Risk, with its only connection to Greyhawk or D&D being the names of the countries, the map, and a vague sense of which countries were good versus evil. TSR published "From the Ashes" as a mix-things-up follow on. That product ended the publication of Greyhawk materials for several years, as fans turned up their noses, until Roger Moore, Erik Mona, and others got the setting re-established in 1998, on a basis that was less insulting to the setting and its fans.

Bottomline: Don't buy anything Greyhawk published between 1985 and 1997. I think they stop publishing anything from about 1992-1998, though.

Eric Anondson said:
Meanwhile, the RPGA's Living Greyhawk campaign is working through 595 cy right now with 596 beginning in January 2006.

Does even WOTC care about their stuff enough to make it "official"? I thought all WOTC stuff was always 591 cy from now on?

AdmundfortGeographer · Aug 23, 2005

haakon1 said:
Does even WOTC care about their stuff enough to make it "official"? I thought all WOTC stuff was always 591 cy from now on?

The Living Greyhawk campaign is run, writen by, and published by unpaid volunteers. Not by WotC. Everything that has been published under the RPGA for LG, after the LGG was published, had not one single eyeball from WotC look at it or approve it. I know this because I have written a handful of adventures for the Shield Lands while I was Triad for the Shield Lands for a brief period.

For the view of WotC-backed "officialness" (whatever that is), the Living Greyhawk Journal is sort of a more semi-official resource as it had the hand of Erik Mona guiding it while he was a paid employee of the RPGA/WotC.

Would it be cool for whatever the RPGA develops to be blessed by WotC as "canon"? Yeah, but like that matters to most Greyhawk fans. Heck, the latest four-poster-map of the Flanaess had located an important town [Torkeep] that was never sited on pre-LGG map somewhere different that where the Shield Lands Triad sited it. Couple hundred miles difference. No one asked us where we put it while that map was being drawn...

But the point I'm getting at is that there was no humanly way for WotC to be able to coordinate with the dozens and dozens of volunteers of the 29 specific regions, about every piece of minutia, who were tasked by the RPGA to develop the LG campaign.

In WotC's mind, the Greyhawk setting is perpetually in 591. In the RPGA's mind, Greyhawk is moving forward with unpaid volunteers developing things. In the general fan's mind? They can choose whenever they wish, but unless they are tapped in with the RPGA campaign's writings, they're best served ignoring the RPGA timeline... maybe grabbing from some of the Living Greyhawk Journal stuff that was once published in Dragon or Dungeon magazine...