The future of Juxtaposition - PreVote Discussion

Yes, but Juxta had a number of quirks that made it an unusual setting. In creating a new homebrew, we can limit the amount of 'additional' knowledge needed to play in the setting. That was part of the problem. A lot of people didn't want to take the time to have to learn something more just to have to roleplay a character.

My point is that we're looking for an open-ended setting where anytype of character can be played. I don't know Forgotten Realms well enough to know if it'll provide what we need. A new homebrew would. Plus, it'd give us a chance to set what guidelines we as the community wants it to have. Juxta had guidelines that were stipulated by its creator. Not everyone liked those guidelines. This is our chance to do something about it.

Finally, as much as I like the idea of a new homebrew, my main vote is for Forgotten Realms because I'm not sure I have the time to help in its creation and I won't vote for something that I won't be able to help complete.

Because they won't be bothered to learn about Forgotten Realms either, which is why you make the setting generic enough and easily malable that it doesn't matter if they knew it or not.

Well, I only realised things were going on cos ISRP was down yesterday and talked to friends while it was....and wow, new format for the boards too (Yup, I am soooo in the loop these days!)

Ahem..where was I.....oh, medication...yummm...oh yes, replacement for Juxta...well.....

I was never a great fan of Juxta, but it served us well enough....for a replacement I think there are a couple of viable options, namely Somewhere in Faerun (and I do mean Faerun not the wider FR setting) or Sigil. I know next to nothing of Ebberon, but from what little has been said about it, it sounds like a VERY bad fit for ISRP, in a similar way to other more unique worlds in the past (Darksun, Ravenloft (which I liked, but as a come and go ISRP setting would have lost it's proper feeling) and so on)

My case for FR has mostly been already made by others, but compared to ANY other setting, more of us intematly know it and can RP it TRUE to itself better than any other option. A lot of us run FR set characters. Finding a good suitable FR 'spot' to have as the new setting is not hard (though agreeing on the best one may not be). A more ordered place then the CRT, but not too hidebound....Arabel, Westgate..if you want to be horribly warm and tingly, Silverymoon...I would council against both Waterdeep (just too damn cliche) and Raven's Bluff (cos of hangovers from the Living City, though I was never involved in that and really like the city on the other hand, so wouldn't mind it on a personal level, it may have too much baggage). It also gives a wide range of conflicts that won't automatically be violent, such as religious disputes between the faithful of a pantheon many of us know inside out, groups that are well document etc.

Sigil would be a very good 'close' replacement for Juxta, the portals needed for us all are inbuild...unlike even a major FR city. No religion gives it a unique feel without being over the top. All those odd critters enlarge the possibilities and make some of the oddballs we already have work better. Sigil also offers political/faction plots that won't destabalise in a way they might in FR, it is also (as an inactive current setting) more stable than FR. Lastly, and oddly, that it is NOT FR. In a way FR has benefited from being 'off stage' in ISRP, it is 'active' through characters that come from there and live there, but is not subjet to the events of the ISRP...thus giving in a way those of use with FR characters a haven that is 'ours' to tinker slightly with as we wish behind the scenes, we get to play FR and Greyhawk at the same time, but the former is protected!

One BIG downside to Sigil is going to be the misuse of the Cant, and trust me, it WILL happen f we go there!

All in all I would prefer to see a wise (don't you roll your eyes at me!) choice of Faerun setting. Sigil as a runner up. And the Land of Frolicing Pixies as a distant 3rd (*gags Dearah* Hush you!)

The end of the discussion is drawing near, and barring a flurry of activity and new suggestions the discussion should close on time by the end of this weekend.

However, that said I wanted to use this opportunity to nudge everyone to consider some of the options that have not really been explored yet in this discussion but either were presented as options and potentials, or have since come to mind as worth listening to arguments on. Now is your chance to speak up on them or I will continue to assume no one feels strongly about them or has had other ideas to present.

They are:
Eberron - Not many people have really commented on this.

Merging the two settings into one - Do we want to have two settings? Do we want to just have one setting? Do we want for them to be different, i.e. one relaxed and one more setting enforced? Do we want them to be the same, and if so relaxed or more structured? Do we want to consider just having Greyhawk be our core setting and having two main areas within it? They could be different towns, the same town. Whatever. Do we want to argue for merging the settings into one setting and also relocating it to a new world altogether?

I will be presenting another proposal this weekend, which involves moving Greyhawk to a setting enforced room. It does tie into this vote though, as they are connected in a way. I will do my best to overlap them in such a way that you'll get a chance to read the new proposal before we start voting on the Juxta proposal... so you can consider how they will affect each other depending on how each vote goes.

Personally, I adore having two settings. It provides a wider range in role-playing abilities, and with the features of the new chat software the capabilities of each setting will be expanded to the point that we'll have more than enough variety within one setting to account for just about anything you can imagine. I would also hate to move the tavern one more time. To me CRT is a core of ISRP, and while it has changed settings before it's always been around. But it does become increasingly difficult to keep relocating it. I'm personally for keeping CRT in Greyhawk and exploring another setting entirely. I'd really rather have two settings, as it provides a chance to appeal to both sides of the patron perspective, those that want complete freedom and those that want a more structured environment.

Please spread the word to everyone to keep an eye on the message boards closely this weekend. There will be a relatively short window of opportunity to affect the resulting poll one last time. I'll announce the final vote proposal and give a brief amount of time for last ditch feedback, and then we'll vote.

Ok, it is late and I'm exhausted so forgive me for cutting this short and not making complete sense. If you have questions, please feel free to ask!

Let me just add one more thing to this discussion, in the form of a quotation:

"I don't know the key to success, but the key to failure is trying to please everybody." - Bill Cosby

Merging the settings, well I think it is a good route to go.

As I have said before, and will again.. so many people have mistaken the settings for being in the same realm anyhow, that it might help to clear that up. Perhaps make the setting into the market area of Ford's Keep.. or near the docks.. then peple can pass between rooms easily,

I mean people already seem to think that they can easily pass between realms, and this will not go away, no matter what the settings are.

People have, and will continue to ignore whatever comes into place, and instead play things according to their own interests and views. Even though the Tavern and the Emporium are distinct, and no matter how often that is said..players have continued to simply ignore this factor.

They will continue still whatever setting is selected. So perhaps merging settings, might work itself out best, because then even though players do ignore the setting, they might create less disruption in moving among them.

Just some thoughts.

Personally, I'm very heavily against Eberron because I fear that a lot of us don't know the setting the way we know older, more established settings. I'm also against merging the settings again, although it would be convienent in a way (ie, folks moving from the Emporium to the tavern smoothly, etc), it would limit options, especially if enforcement of the settings becomes much stricter. I feel it's important to have two settings so there can be more variety. Not everyone likes Greyhawk as a setting -- especially given the firearms restrictions (yes, I remember that blurb), among other things. Having the Emporium set someplace else is a good idea to me because it does allow for more options. I'm still all for sticking the Emporium somewhere in Faerûn (in the Dales, perhaps? They're somewhat central), though a homegrown setting, provided that we can hammer one together quickly in such a way that it's cohesive and understandable, would be good as well. The strength of using a published setting is that there's information out there on it in the form of books, but there's also a great deal of information on the setting out on the internet about it as well (second edition stuff, as well as some d20 stuff from before the setting was released for 3E). At the same time, while there's a great many plots going on in a published world, there's also a great deal of space on the map that we only know general things about -- there's numerous cities and towns that aren't listed in the setting, various regions where there's not much known, etc. Something that's easy to find information about -- and a lot of it -- would be a good thing, in my opinion.

That having been said, I'm still against Eberron. I haven't looked at it much, but I don't feel like it would be a good setting for the Emporium simply because it's so new. I've seen maybe three characters in the past several months that are clearly from Eberron (at least one warforged, but I digress). I see characters that are out of the 'Realms every day. The fan base is there (for FR), the information is there. I say roll with what we already know is popular.

But that's just my pocket of change on the subject. I'm sure I'll think of more.

I want to address the issue of people ignoring things / not taking the time to learn the setting.

I think that if we are going to go the two room route, the CRT should stay as it is. Let the new room be the uber-strict, you-must-conform-and-know-the-setting room. Because seriously, I know I'm not going to have the TIME even if I had the DESIRE to learn a new campaign setting well enough to play within a strict-enforced room. When I do come onto this site, I do so to relax.

Yeah, it gets a little absurd with some of the race combos and fads I've seen in the past, but you know what? I'm a big girl, (and most of us are big boys and girls) and look the other way. I play a character that technically shouldn't have found her way to the CRT, and if people don't want to play with me because of it, fine. I'm here to play her, and relax. The same, I'm sure, goes for those who play the odd race combos, etc etc etc.

So, I'm firmly for leaving the crt AS IS. It's a good room, it's ALWAYS been a good room. If it isn't broke, don't fix it, the saying goes, and I think it safe to say that for the intent and how it's used and how content MOST are with it, it's not broken, so DON'T TOUCH IT PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF US ALL! -Ahem-

If those of us who are more hardcore desire something hardcore, then make the new room the hardcore one, PLEASE.

Thank you for your time.

JudeSedai said:

That having been said, I'm still against Eberron. I haven't looked at it much, but I don't feel like it would be a good setting for the Emporium simply because it's so new. I've seen maybe three characters in the past several months that are clearly from Eberron (at least one warforged, but I digress). I see characters that are out of the 'Realms every day. The fan base is there (for FR), the information is there. I say roll with what we already know is popular.

But that's just my pocket of change on the subject. I'm sure I'll think of more.

Click to expand...

Snipping out the bit thats unimportant, my position on this is now known, I don't see the point of debate on much of it, but this I shall say. Building long term things (like a setting for ISRPers) around what is popular and the fan base is a poor choice. When the AOL rooms started, I believe you wuold have found both DL and Greyhawk more popular than Faerun. Several months ago, at the release of, many more people would clamor for Eberron.

Faerun is a fine setting, but it has a past and and will be out of hands for the future of it.

Krystal> The CRT is not the room up and being discussed..

I concur with Darrius on this point. Settings come and go, with fads and trends as all things do in this world.

Adele> If we were to select homebrew, not that it would win the vote, who would create that? Maybe a group project?