Casting Time: 1 round vrs. full round action?

Venator · Oct 11, 2006

Several spells have casting times of "1 round" and others have the casting time of "full round action." Are they the same or different? At first i thought they were indeed different, then i changed my mind, and now ive changed it back again.

Reason for my confusion:

In Chapter 8: Combat under the heading Full-Round Actions (pg. 143) it says,

PHB said:
A spell that takes 1 round to cast is a full round action. It comes into effect just before the beginning of your turn in the round after you began casting the spell.

Then, is says under Casting a Metamagic Spell,

PHB said:
...Casting a metamagic version of the spell is a full-round action for a sorcerer or bard. Note that this isnt't the same a spell with a 1-round casting time - the spell takes effect in the same round that you began casting...

So it first says that a spell with a 1-round casting time is a full round action and that it comes into effect at the start of your next turn, and then it says that full round actions take effect in the same round that you cast it...

I'm fairly sure that I know what they mean, but im looking for some help.

A 1-round casting time is a full round action to cast, meaning that you cant do anything else that round, and its effects take place a turn later. This effectively takes "longer" to produce its effects, but no longer to actually cast.

A casting time of full round action also takes the entire turn, but its effects are produced then and there.

Is this correct?

Nail · Oct 11, 2006

FAIK, they mean exactly the same thing. The core rules do not have spells with a "full round action" casting time.

Nail · Oct 11, 2006

Could you point out the spells inwhich the casting time says "full round action"?

Vegepygmy · Oct 11, 2006

Venator said:
A 1-round casting time is a full round action to cast, meaning that you cant do anything else that round, and its effects take place a turn later. This effectively takes "longer" to produce its effects, but no longer to actually cast.

A casting time of full round action also takes the entire turn, but its effects are produced then and there.

Is this correct?

No.

Casting a spell as a full-round action (as a sorcerer does when using a metamagic feat) simply means that the spell requires a full-round action instead of say, a standard action. The casting is still completed during the caster's turn.

A 1-round casting time, on the other hand, requires an entire round to cast--not just the caster's turn. That's why it doesn't come into effect until just before the caster's next turn.

The distinction is important because a spell with a 1-round casting time is much, much easier to disrupt, since everyone else in the combat will get to take their turns before the caster can complete the spell. In contrast, the only way to disrupt a spell with a full-round casting time is to ready an action--the same as it would be if it were only a standard action to cast.

It's a confusing distinction, I know, so I hope this makes it clear for you.

Nail · Oct 11, 2006

Alright, here's the text in the PH that's relelvant: p. 88.

PH 3.5e said:
If the spell’s normal casting time is 1
action, casting a metamagic version is a full-round action for a
sorcerer or bard. (This isn’t the same as a 1-round casting time, as
described under Cast a Spell, page 143.)

That's buried, isn't it?

:\

A spell cast as a full round action happens at the end of the caster's turn.

A spell cast with a 1-round casting time happens at the beginning of the caster's next turn, and the caster must concentrate until that next turn, or lose the spell.

Venator · Oct 11, 2006

The reason this came up is two-fold.

First, Channeled Pryoburst from the PHBII pg. 106 has an option for "full-round action"

Heres the text:

PHBII said:
If you cast this spell as a swift action, it deals 1d4 points of fire damage per two caster levels (maximum 10d4) against a single target of your choice.
If you cast this spell as a standard action, it deals 1d6 points of fire damage per caster level (max 10d6) to all creatures in a 10-foot radius spread.
If you cast this spell as a full-round action, it deals 1d8 points of fire damage per caster level (max 10d8) to all creatures in a 15-foot radius spread.
If you spend 2 rounds casting this spell, it deals 1d10 points of fire damage per caster level (max 10d10) to all creatures in a 20-foot raidus spread.

Can the full-round version be cast as a full round action, just like a sorcerer would cast a metamagic spell, or is it cast as a 1 round action? Even more confusion comes up when you consider the fact that the next option is a 2 round casting time. It kind of leads me to believe that the full-round version should have been a 1-round action. Very confusing.

There are also other new "channeled" spells in the Complete Mage that behave the same way.

The second reason was based on something i read earlier today. It was in reference to a Druid using the metamagic feat Rapid Spell on pg. 84 of the Complete Divine.

It says...

Complete Divine said:
...A rapid spell with a casting time measured in rounds can be cast in 1 full round.

Does this mean a full-round action, or 1 round?

Venator · Oct 11, 2006

edited because what i wrote didnt make sense.

Venator · Oct 11, 2006

Vegepygmy said:
No.

Casting a spell as a full-round action (as a sorcerer does when using a metamagic feat) simply means that the spell requires a full-round action instead of say, a standard action. The casting is still completed during the caster's turn.

A 1-round casting time, on the other hand, requires an entire round to cast--not just the caster's turn. That's why it doesn't come into effect until just before the caster's next turn.

The distinction is important because a spell with a 1-round casting time is much, much easier to disrupt, since everyone else in the combat will get to take their turns before the caster can complete the spell. In contrast, the only way to disrupt a spell with a full-round casting time is to ready an action--the same as it would be if it were only a standard action to cast.

It's a confusing distinction, I know, so I hope this makes it clear for you.

I mis-read this the first time. It definetly does clear it up. You have an increidbly good point there that i have overlooked. 1 round casting time means the ENTIRE round!! Full round means your entire turn. Duh!!

frankthedm · Oct 11, 2006

If you cast this spell as a swift action, it deals 1d4 points of fire damage per two caster levels (maximum 10d4) against a single target of your choice.

A wave of the hand and a syllable of power {swift action]

If you cast this spell as a standard action, it deals 1d6 points of fire damage per caster level (max 10d6) to all creatures in a 10-foot radius spread.

A small fireball, nothing fancy here.

If you cast this spell as a full-round action, it deals 1d8 points of fire damage per caster level (max 10d8) to all creatures in a 15-foot radius spread.

Your somatic and verbal components are more pronounced, and a visible small build up of energy occurs in your hands for the amountof time it takes to hustle your speed.

If you spend 2 rounds casting this spell, it deals 1d10 points of fire damage per caster level (max 10d10) to all creatures in a 20-foot radius spread.

You stop making any pretences it is not a Dragon Ball Z attack, stand there doing the stance for about 12 seconds while intoning kamehameha!

To time the verbal component…
Use your 5 foot adjustment to take your 'stance' in a safer square if needed.
Round 1 Move time frame: kaa-
Round 1 Attack time frame: mee-
Round 2 Move time frame: haa-
Round 2 Attack time frame: mee-
Just before round 3 begins: HAA! {5' adjust if needed and you did not do so when begining the spell, pick your target, do your damage, then take your turn for round 3.]

While I like the spell, the last option is not worth it. The Opportunity cost of 2 whole rounds is simply too high. More often then not, the low class foes that would let a caster get the spell to Fuu Powah! won't survive the full round casting. 1 point per level [average damage from going d8's to d10's] to be a sitting duck for two rounds? No. D12's maybe, that might be too strong, but having no threatened area combined with any smart foe running for cover or making you Target Numero Uno makes for a decent balancing factor.