Gods & Monsters - New Immortals Handbook Supplement

Hey all!

Okay, I started this thread to discuss points pertinent to the forthcoming Gods & Monsters book, which is the new book I am creating from the appendices of the Immortals Handbook: Ascension.

This will sort of be like a primer to the Immortals Index, but instead of concentrating on one mythology I will draw the titular gods and monsters from multiple sources.

I also plan to include the information on designing your own Pantheons.

Just to refresh your memories, here are the current slated Gods:

1. Morgan Le Fay (Disciple)
2. Yanauluha (Prophet)
3. Achilles (Hero-deity)
4. Vainamoinen (Quasi-deity)
5. No Cha (Demi-deity)
6. Hecate (Lesser Deity)
7. Horus (Intermediate Deity)
8. Dagda (Greater Deity)
9. Surtur (Elder One)
10. Algol (Old One)
11. Metatron (First One)
12. Abraxas (Demiurge)
13. Dabbat...The Great Beast (Time Lord)
14. Tetragrammaton (High Lord)

I'll probably be looking for an equal number of Monsters, not counting those monsters already replacing the Avatar/Aspect slots for the weaker immortals (such as the Wakinyan/Thunderbird in Yanauluha's entry since he is too weak to possess an Avatar).

So the first question is: Are there any monsters of myth you would really like to see in the book?

At this point the only monster I have decided upon is Typhon (which would mean detailing the Serpentine Epic Dragon), although I do have a handful of others in mind.

Demons and devils are also likely to feature in some capacity.

So if you have any ideas, now is the time and this is the thread.

Upper_Krust said:

So the first question is: Are there any monsters of myth you would really like to see in the book?

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Thats a tough question. Mythology and legend are abound with monsters/spirits/etc. However, most of the 'common' ones have all ready been covered in the various monster manuals and other books. (or are just advanced versions of those...)

The Kitsune(oriental mythology) are one such creature I have yet to see detailed well. (a Rokugan book did a minor writeup IIRC, and everyone who likes Oriental Adventures I have ever met has done some sort of bad writeup on them) And they could fill quite a bit of space. I would imagine, since the power of a kitsune scales with the number of tails it possess, (somewhat) an 'age category'-like table similar to dragon write ups could work. I doubt they would be epic at the low end, and might only touch upon epic in the higher-end, but it is an option.

The stats for an Arch Angel or two would be cool, and theres quite a few to choose from so you could pick a 'lesser' one and still have plenty for an immortals' index. (Or just a generic Arch Angel template...)

Perhaps one or two 'bizzaro monsters' to go with Algol? (if you weren't already planning to fill his section with the Helio-whatchamacallit template)

Heck, throwing the templates originally planned for the Volume 2 Bestiary (the ones Ascension references anyway) might help loads. (One, people get to use those powers faster, since Bestiary 2 is quite a ways off. {2 years at your speed }Two, you essentially provided infinite monsters in the same space, since you could slap said templates on anything.)

I guess I will through out a few ideas.

How about...

Ekhis/Echidna (to go with Typhon)

Tiamat (the proper Sumerian one)

Fenrir

the immortal Gorgons (Euryale and Stheno)

Garuda (of Hindu/Buddhist myth)

Orochi (Japanese myth)

Apep (Egyptian myth)

Jörmungandr (Norse myth)

the Minotaur (Greek myth)

Gugalana/Bull of Heaven (Sumerian myth)

Nandhi (Hindu myth)

Akupara/A'Tuin (Hindu myth/Diskworld)

Leviathan (Judeo-Christian myth)

Kerberos/Cerberus (Greek myth)

Chimaera (Greek myth)

Polyphemus the Cyclops (Greek myth)

Shaitan, King of the Jinn (Islamic myth)

Grendel (Anglo-Saxon myth)

Nuckelavee (Celtic myth)

Ravana, King of the Rakshasas (Hindu myth)

Talos (Greek myth)

Hey Ltheb dude!

Ltheb Silverfrond said:

Thats a tough question. Mythology and legend are abound with monsters/spirits/etc. However, most of the 'common' ones have all ready been covered in the various monster manuals and other books. (or are just advanced versions of those...)

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Agreed, although you know I like to turn the dials up to '11' in my books, so there is a bit of scope in that regard.

I certainly don't want to cover a monster thats already seen print in 3rd Ed.

Ltheb Silverfrond said:

The Kitsune(oriental mythology) are one such creature I have yet to see detailed well. (a Rokugan book did a minor writeup IIRC, and everyone who likes Oriental Adventures I have ever met has done some sort of bad writeup on them) And they could fill quite a bit of space. I would imagine, since the power of a kitsune scales with the number of tails it possess, (somewhat) an 'age category'-like table similar to dragon write ups could work. I doubt they would be epic at the low end, and might only touch upon epic in the higher-end, but it is an option.

Click to expand...

Interesting idea. Like the immortals themselves I would like the monsters to cover a good spectrum of CRs, mythologies and alignments.

Ltheb Silverfrond said:

The stats for an Arch Angel or two would be cool, and theres quite a few to choose from so you could pick a 'lesser' one and still have plenty for an immortals' index. (Or just a generic Arch Angel template...)

Click to expand...

Well I already have Metatron in there so I can't get much more arch-angelic than that.

Ltheb Silverfrond said:

Perhaps one or two 'bizzaro monsters' to go with Algol? (if you weren't already planning to fill his section with the Helio-whatchamacallit template)

Click to expand...

I'll see what I dig up.

Ltheb Silverfrond said:

Heck, throwing the templates originally planned for the Volume 2 Bestiary (the ones Ascension references anyway) might help loads.

Click to expand...

I was thinking a few of the Bestiary 2 mob might see the light of day in Gods & Monsters.

Ltheb Silverfrond said:

(One, people get to use those powers faster, since Bestiary 2 is quite a ways off. {2 years at your speed }

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Cheeky scamp!

Ltheb Silverfrond said:

Two, you essentially provided infinite monsters in the same space, since you could slap said templates on anything.)

Click to expand...

Templates you say...I'll see what I can do.

Hi zen_hydra mate!

zen_hydra said:

I guess I will through out a few ideas.
How about...
Ekhis/Echidna (to go with Typhon)
Tiamat (the proper Sumerian one)
Fenrir
the immortal Gorgons (Euryale and Stheno)
Garuda (of Hindu/Buddhist myth)
Apep (Egyptian myth)
Jörmungandr (Norse myth)
the Minotaur (Greek myth)
Gugalana/Bull of Heaven (Sumerian myth)
Nandhi (Hindu myth)
Akupara/A'Tuin (Hindu myth/Diskworld)
Leviathan (Judeo-Christian myth)
Kerberos/Cerberus (Greek myth)
Chimaera (Greek myth)
Polyphemus the Cyclops (Greek myth)
Shaitan, King of the Jinn (Islamic myth)
Grendel (Anglo-Saxon myth)
Nuckelavee (Celtic myth)
Ravana, King of the Rakshasas (Hindu myth)
Talos (Greek myth)

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I picked out the ones on your list which interest me the most.

- Talos could of course be a reworking of the Iron Golem into my new Golem format.
- The Nuckelavee could be very interesting.
- Garuda I was half thinking about anyway.
- Grendel/Grendel's mother could be cool.
- Ravana is one of my favourites of all time, but I do not want too many from one Pantheon or of the same type of Power. Another one from Hindu myth I am contemplating is the Mahisha.

I want to point out that the kitsune was done to perfection, IMHO, in Kitsunemori. It has rules for kitsune-specific classes (myobu and nogitsune), rules on how they gain (and lose) tails, and how that impacts their fox-magic, and more. The only possible downside that I can think of is that it might take a little longer to make a kitsune character using these rules, instead of just using monster stats on a page, but this book is still far and away the best rules for kitsune in d20 that I know of.

It's hard to think of some powerful mythological monsters that haven't been either mentioned in a d20 book yet, or listed here. Here's a few that I found:

Falak (Islam)

Likho (Slavic)

Cipactli (Aztec)

Alzrius said:

... Kitsunemori...

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Darn you, interweb! You bring nothing but useful information and a wealth of online-arguments.

I'll check it out.

I can't think of any off the top of my head that weren't already mentioned above- however, I second the call for the Bestiary II templates at least- if not one example of an Entity (so we can see how they work) and one example of an Anomaly (same reason).