Metal School

warlord said:

Quick question: What do you guys think of metalcore?

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I dig a lot of it; I think that it's unfortunate that it gets bashed more for the sense of style (or lackthereof?) of the musicians than what the people are actually playing.

However, this is not to say that the music these bands are playing is that terribly great in any case; there is such a glut in that scene right now that there is a lot of garbage out there and a lot of it has hit it mainstream, which is unfortunate itself.

However, completely writing off a (sub-)genre of whatever music you might dislike is inherently and incrediably close-minded, at least in my opinion (and a lot of people tend to do this, which is dumb). With metalcore, the trendy haircuts and clothes and the glut of similar bands with poorly-worded names has created a big shiny target for "real" metalheads, and (from what I hear in my city from the locals) a sense of dis-association from the punk/hardcore scene. In any case, going band-by-band will always net you a ton of terrible bands and a few really great ones, and that's how I ty approach any style of music (from Drone Doom to the dreaded Glam Metal of the 80s).

I also think how it's kinda funny with the trend of this style of music, and how it went from emo to "screamo" to metalcore to deathcore. The emo kiddies are growing up and adding in more extreme metal elements, which is something I doubt anyone saw coming.

Bands I dig: All that Remains, As I Lay Dying, God Forbid, Killswitch Engage (except their new album, which blew), Lamb of God, Shadows Fall, Unearth, Winds of Plague.

cheers,
--N

Personally I love metalcore, but I was in a metalcore band so I have a somewhat skewed opinion. I've noticed most metalheads I know write it off as emo becaue most metalcore thats "in" right now likes to stadle the line between metalcore and screamo (ie Underoath). But there are some good metalcore bands out there: This Run Through, As Cities Burn (their first album only though, evr since TJ left the've headed in this odd post rock direction.), Gwen Stacey and my personal favorite Arma Angelus aka Pete Wentz's good band.

To me metalcore is mostly noise. Of course, I'm teaching the history of metal here, so I do have a skew. I'm saddened that the industry has gotten to the point that raw energy has replaced talent. (This is a GROSS generalization - there are some notable exceptions, but they are, unfortunately, exceptions). Emo & Grunge was pretty much the death of the metal movement in the early 90s, which for a metalhead like myself, was a punch in the gut. Music went from party to placid; funky to flaccid. It was less about the music and more about, I hate the world and myself and now I'm going to screw up your life; not that metal hasn't always been on the edge, but where it once was about telling a story that made you either take action or disagree, now it has more of a, life's worthless kill yourself attitude (again - generalization)

I think the real proof in the pudding though, is in the up and coming bands (local types). Before, you had to have some modicum of talent to book a show, now, if you own a distortion pedal and can growl like a bear, you're in. From the production side of things, it really rips my heart out. Now see what you've done, I've gotten melancholy. . .

Double Post. My Bad.

I can growl like a bear. Can you get me a record deal Thunderfoot?

I can growl like a bear.

Its simply not enough these days.

Alright you two . . .

Yeah, but Danny if I rember right you also have a 4 and half octave range and play about 6 different insturments. All I do is scream/growl and play bass. But growling aside what do you guys think of rock historians classifying metal as music for white males?

warlord said:

Yeah, but Danny if I rember right you also have a 4 and half octave range and play about 6 different insturments. All I do is scream/growl and play bass. But growling aside what do you guys think of rock historians classifying metal as music for white males?

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With few exceptions - dead on. Unfortunately, the masses tend to follow what they are fed by marketing executives. There are some obvious exceptions but for the most part, rock n' roll is a white man's game. Frankly, I think the genre suffers due to that fact. Jimi Hendrix, Living Color, Sevendust (to name but a few) are great examples of black males that can split the industry open; Carlos Santana, Los Lonely Boys and Sepultura the Latino market and there are a host of young ladies that prove the talent is there. But, by and large, the target audience is always young to middle aged white males.

Bands with a feminine focus usually are labeled as 'wuss rock' (Journey comes screaming to mind), and those of ethnic bent are so reviled by their own ethnicities that they usually fold, capitulate and end up as backing musicians in more 'socially accepted' venues. (I remember seeing an episode of Showtime at the Apollo where Living Color were greeted with blank stares and disingenuous applause. Meanwhile an Asian break dancer was treated as the second coming of Christ. (Which is sad, because they completely blew the stage apart that day.) I hate bringing race/ethnicity into these discussions, but unfortunately, it is a horrible fact of the industry.

As long as this discussion can stay civil, I think this is okay, but if it starts getting heated, we should probably steer clear of further discussions that may bring this thread to a close. However, if there is enough interest I can do a chapter on 'Ethnicity in Metal' - I'm already planning a 'Women Take the Stage' chapter.

Thunderfoot
Metal Teacher and Headmaster of Discipline. . .

warlord said:

But growling aside what do you guys think of rock historians classifying metal as music for white males?

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I think it's kinda like classifying D&D as a hobby for white males. You can find plenty of exceptions to the stereotype out there. But at the same time, you look around and wonder how much there might be to that idea. Hmmmmmm.

Well, if we agree that men enjoy violent entertainment more than women do, there's part of the answer there. Even when metal's lyrics are not literally about violent behavior, a lot of the imagery still pertains to "battles" and "fighting back" and defiance and so on. And it's often played with a general feeling of aggression. There is a lot of talk about "metal warriors united" and "brothers of metal" and so on, evoking a very male camaraderie of the sort seen in sports teams and military squads and hunting buddies and so on. So the question then is, why?

Social status is very important to males. It means power, which means the ability to provide, which increases your attractiveness to females, which increases your chances to spread your genes along. Heavy metal speaks to uniquely male issues of power and disenfranchisement - if you're an outcast, if you don't fit into society, you won't get that social status. But metal offers an appealing solution: you can fight back. You don't have to change who you are. You have a right to live the way you want, and there is a whole metal community willing to fight alongside you for that right.

In short, my guess, or "theory" or whatever, is that some of metal's appeal comes from channeling aggression (or just general energy) into a socially acceptable medium (much like rough sports, or action movies, or games where the player slays imaginary orcs ) and some of it is about overcoming "guy problems". Women have their own set of gender-based problems so metal doesn't resonate with them in quite the same way, thus fewer female metal fans.... this post is all generally speaking of course, and my two cents and all that, just coming from someone who has listened to metal long out of the teenage years and later started asking, what IS the appeal, anyway

As for the white fanship thing, there are quite a few non-European countries like Japan and Brazil where metal is still massive, so I don't know about that one. Someone could probably make a good argument that rap music addresses issues of power and disenfranchisement in a way that speaks much more specifically to the black community than metal does.