E6: The Game Inside D&D

Ry · Jul 2, 2007

As was stated by someone else before (when I was concerned about the same thing): If you multiclass that much, you're probably doing it to get the saves. In that situation, your saves are your key class feature.

You're giving up any higher-level class features: Fighter's weapon spec, ranger's animal companion, etc. etc.

Ry · Jul 2, 2007

GrolloStoutfoam said:
I think the system has a built in check. To get these saves the character has to make a trade off which results in lower spell progression, BAB, and fewer class abilities. Not worth it in my opinion as I can just have my cleric take feats that bump my reflex save while having full caster progression and BAB +5.

Exactly.

GrolloStoutfoam said:
Also the character would have to qualify for the PrC at or before 6th level to get all the benefits of the PrC level. I think the intent is, if a character would qualify for the PrC after 6th level, they can take the PrC class abilities as feat chains. This means they get the special abilities of the PrC but not the increase in BAB, saves, caster level. Just my interpretation though, I could be wrong.

That depends on the individual GM. There's a LOT of feats out there, and you can get some really great ones for about $15 (phil reed's pdfs). They address things like providing special abilities and shoring up multiclass combinations that serve the same purpose as those upper level Prestige Class abilities provide.

Personally, I would only allow feat chains towards Prestige Class abilities that could have been acquired by an ECL 6 character. But what feats you allow should really be guided most by

1) How do you want your campaign to go?
2) Do you think it's a balanced feat on its own?

Ry · Jul 2, 2007

One more thing re: saves

Saves are passive abilities; the PC doesn't usually control when their character uses this fine ability, which gives them limited appeal compared to stuff the player can decide to use. So if a player goes after them like crazy, and succeeds in having really exceptional saves - it's best to just let them.

Ry · Jul 2, 2007

wolfpunk said:
How rare is it for people to reach 6th level? Meaning is this version of d&d supposed to be significantly more deadly, making sixth level characters rare, and characters with a significant amount of feats truly epic?

It's hard for me to pronounce on that. I'd say that the population of the world is (in order of most to least)

Level 1
Level 2
Level 3
Level 4
Level 5
Level 6
Level 6+5
Level 6+10
Level 6+15
Level 6+20

But those last 4 categories might outnumber level 4 if you put them together.

BUT - and this is a big but - PCs are more likely to encounter the higher level ones than they are to encounter the Level 1 ones. This is because level is still a decent measure of importance, and PCs are doing important stuff.

Ry · Jul 2, 2007

mfrench said:
I've been trying to work out an adventure path based mainly on the WotC free adventures, as well as a handful of published adventures and the dozen or so Dungeon issues that I have. Specifically, the stuff on G's Gauntlet Expanded and the post in How to Create Depth in Worldbuilding have been driving the development. I've been planning to start a new thread on it all weekend, but haven't got around to it yet.

Sounds cool! Keep me posted if I miss the thread.

Ry · Jul 2, 2007

I wanted to share something I'm going to be trying in the new E6 game.

Like the Conviction and Death Flag mechanics, this isn't necessary to E6. But I wanted to let people know I was using it because I've already playtested the level cap enough to know it works, and I want to incorporate this other rule for the sake of my own game.

Once again: You can use E6 and not use this rule if you don't like it.

Raising the Stakes

At any time, a player can choose to make a 'raise' before rolling their d20s. The terms of the raise are up to the player, but the GM can either accept ("Call") or decide "no bet."

For example: "I attack the goblin, raise you a decapitation frightening his buddies against me falling prone." "Call."

"I attack the goblin, raise you 2d6 damage against 2d6 damage" "Call."

Modifiers will be left to the standard underlying rules, and raises based on odds that are too strong will simply be declined. So if the fighter has a 95% chance of hitting the goblin, the raise of "I do an extra 5d6 or take an extra 5d6 damage." would be declined. Instead, a raise could be : "OK, if I hit, I decapitate the goblin and his friends are frightened. If I miss, I'm on the ground grappled by 5 goblins and I take 2d6 damage."

This can be used also to bypass other less fun mechanics "OK, I walk up to the sorcerer and hit him with my dagger. I raise grappling him against getting knocked back 10 feet and taking 2d6 damage from cracking my head on the pillar."

Ry · Jul 2, 2007

wolfpunk said:
Question, has anyone thought of letting a character who takes levels in their favored class to gain one level in that class above the level 6 maximum? For example, a dwarf could be a level 7 fighter, a half orc could be a level 7 barbarian. Humans and Half-elves could take 1 extra level of whatever class they took at first level.

That could work - although I'd recommend one of these two options:

1) Dig up some feats that have Racial requirements. They tend to follow along the same lines and you might find that's even more satisfying.
2) Put your cap at 8th level instead of 6th if you like those abilities

Also, if you're big into items just above the cap, you could allow Eberron's artificer, who for the purpose of meeting magic item prerequisites has a caster level equal to his artificer level +2

Ry · Jul 2, 2007

green slime said:
That depends on how the "cap" is interpreted. As the official line is that the creator level as described in the DMG is only a guideline as to when the "average" such item would be created, in order to determine item saving throws, rather than a firm requirement for production of said item, yes.

But if you take the other, common, interpretation, that the CL is a requirement, rather than a guideline, then no.

I was under the impression that the CL was a requirement, but the "average" referred to how items are usually created at their minimum level. Otherwise why does the Eberron Artificer get a caster level bonus for the purpose of meeting requirements in their "item creation" class feature?

Ry · Jul 2, 2007

Dragonblade275 said:
That's what I was thinking. The notes you made on The Shackled City showed that a lot of the enemies at higher levels would have to be rewritten to use E6. And, though I like to spend time working on DnD, I don't want to have to rewrite published adventures to make them work with the system that I'm using.

One thing I forgot to mention: E6, once you get even a little used to it (say, by running adventures from level 1 to 6 a lot, and then using some level 6 and 7 and 8 modules from there) is pretty easy to ballpark, and you get a LOT of mileage out of your NPCs because the 5th-level sorcerer you wrote for the game three months ago is still useful in tomorrow's game.

Ry · Jul 2, 2007

mfrench said:
I've been trying to work out an adventure path based mainly on the WotC free adventures, as well as a handful of published adventures and the dozen or so Dungeon issues that I have. Specifically, the stuff on G's Gauntlet Expanded and the post in How to Create Depth in Worldbuilding have been driving the development. I've been planning to start a new thread on it all weekend, but haven't got around to it yet.

MFrench, have you seen my blog on that topic? It might help.