A new Middle Earth d20 thread

My personal favourite Vala next.

I'm going broadly with the 40 class levels +20HD model of DDg - note that Eonwe is supposed to break the mould - he's only a Maia, but he is also the greatest warrior in Arda.

I used the legendary horse and legendary wolf stats for Nahar and Oromë’s hounds, and then slapped the celestial template on top.

Works rather nicely.

Anyway...



Oromë

Vala
Alignment: Neutral Good
Domains: Animal, Good, Plant, Protection

Druid 10 / Fighter 10 / Ranger 20
Medium-size Ainu
Divine Rank: 14

Hit Dice: 20d8+240 (Ainu) plus 10d8+120 (Drd) plus 10d10+120 (Ftr) plus 20d10+240 (Rgr) (1260 hp)
Initiative: +18 (+10 Dex, +8 Superior Initiative)
Speed: 60 ft.
AC: 72 (+10 Dex, +14 Divine, +27 Natural, +11 Deflection)
Attacks: +5 Ghost Touch Holy Power Unerring Accuracy Shortspear +75/+70/+65/+60 melee or +5 Holy Wounding (+4 Mighty) Composite Longbow +70/+65/+60/+55 ranged; or by spell +63 melee touch or +64 ranged touch.
Damage:+5 Ghost Touch Holy Power Unerring Accuracy Shortspear 1d8+34 (19-20/x3) or +5 Holy Wounding (+4 Mighty) Composite Longbow 1d8+25(x3).
Face/Reach: 5ft. by 5ft./5ft
Special Attacks: Domain powers, salient divine abilities, spell-like abilities, spells.
Special Qualities: Divine immunities, DR 49/+4, fire resistance 34, SR 46, speak and read all languages, favoured enemies (magical beasts +5, shapechangers +4, evil Maiar +3, goblinoids +2, aberrations +1); divine aura (1400 ft. DC34).
Saves: Fort +58 Ref +56 Will +56
Abilities: Str 28 Dex 30 Con 35 Int 27 Wis 31 Cha 32

Skills Animal Empathy +75, Climb +43, Concentration +46, Craft (Bowyer) +42, Craft (Trapmaker) +42, Diplomacy +45, Escape Artist +44, Handle Animal +75, Heal +44, Hide +64, Intimidate +45, Intuit Direction +54, Knowledge (Nature) +62, Knowledge (Geography) +52, Knowledge (History) +42, Knowledge (the Blessed Realm) +42, Jump +43, Listen +44, Move Silently +44, Ride +64, Scry +42, Search +62, Sense Motive +44, Spellcraft +42, Spot +74, Swim +43, Wilderness Lore +75

Feats: Dodge, Combat Reflexes, Mobility, Improved Initiative, Track, Weapon Focus (Shortspear), Weapon Specialization (Shortspear), Improved Critical (Shortspear), Weapon Focus (Composite Longbow), Weapon Specialization (Composite Longbow), Point-Blank Shot, Far Shot, Rapid Shot, Mounted Archery, Shot-on-the-Run, Ride-by-Attack, Spirited Charge, Trample

Epic Feats: Superior Initiative, Bane of Enemies (Magical Beasts), Death of Enemies (Magical Beasts), Legendary Rider, Dire Charge, Epic Reputation, Epic Weapon Focus (Shortspear), Epic Weapon Specialization (Shortspear).

Divine Immunities: Ability damage, ability drain, acid, cold, death effects, disease, disintegration, electricity, energy drain, mind-affecting effects, paralysis, poison, sleep, stunning, transmutation, imprisonment, banishment.

Salient Divine Abilities: Self-Incarnation, Annihilating Strike, Battlesense, Call Creatures, Divine Celerity, Divine Fast Healing, Divine Ranger, Divine Archery, Divine Inspiration, Divine Weapon Focus (Shortspear), Divine Weapon Specialization (Shortspear), Extra Domain (Protection), Free Move, Frightful Presence, Speak with Creatures, Power of Nature, Wound Enemy


Domain Powers: Cast good spells at +1 caster level; 14/day cast Animal Friendship at 14th level; 14/day generate Protective Ward which confers a +14 resistance bonus on next Saving Throw; 14/day rebuke or command plant creatures at 14th level.

Spell-Like Abilities: Oromë uses these abilities as a 24th level caster, except Good spells which uses as a 25th level caster: Aid, Animal Shapes, Antilife Shell, Antimagic Field, Barkskin, Calm Animals, Changestaff, Command Plants, Commune w/ Nature, Control Plants, Dispel Evil, Dominate Animal, Entangle, Hold Animal, Holy Aura, Holy Smite, Holy Word, Magic Circle against Evil, Mind Blank, Plant Growth, Protection from Elements, Protection from Evil, Repel Vermin, Repel Wood, Repulsion, Sanctuary, Shambler, Shield Other, Spell Immunity, Spell Resistance, Wall of Thorns, The Save DCs are 35+ spell level.

Druid Spells/Day: 6/7/7/5/5/4. Save DCs 20+ Spell Level.

Ranger Spells/Day: 6/6/5/5. Save DCs 20+ Spell Level.


Possessions: +5 Holy Wounding (+4 Mighty) Composite Longbow, +5 Ghost Touch Holy Power Unerring Accuracy Shortspear and the Valaróma: a magical horn of great potency which, when winded by Oromë, replicates effects of the salient divine ability Divine Inspiration to all who hear it within 14 miles. Courage is evoked in allies, and dread in enemies.


Nahar, Oromë’s Valinorean Legendary Horse: CR10; Large Magical Beast; HD 18d8+144 (288hp); Init +2; Spd 80ft.; AC 19 (touch 11, flat-footed 17); Atk +22 melee (2d6+9, 2 hooves), +17 melee (1d6+4, bite); SA Smite Evil 1/day; SQ Acid/Cold/Electricity Resistance 20, Darkvision 60ft., DR 10/+3, Scent, SR25; SV Fort +19, Ref +13, Will +8; Str 28, Dex 14, Con 26, Int 3, Wis 14, Cha 10.
Skills and Feats: Listen +8, Spot +8

Valinorean Legendary Hound: CR9; Medium-size Magical Beast; HD 14d8+70 (182hp); Init +4; Spd 60ft.; AC 24 (touch 19, flat-footed 15); Atk +17 melee (2d6+10, bite); SA Trip, Smite Evil 1/day; SQ Acid/Cold/Electricity Resistance 20, Darkvision 60ft., DR 10/+3, Scent, SR25; SV Fort +14, Ref +18, Will +6; Str 24, Dex 28, Con 20, Int 3, Wis 14, Cha 10.
Skills and Feats: Hide +12, Listen +10, Move Silently +12, Spot +10, Wilderness Lore +4; Weapon Finesse (Bite). +8 bonus on Wilderness Lore if tracking by scent.


As Tolkien can describe things far more eloquently than I:

Oromë loved the lands of Middle-earth, and he left them unwillingly and came last to Valinor; and often of old he passed back east over the mountains and returned with his host to the hills and the plains, He is a hunter of monsters and fell beasts, and he delights in horses and in hounds; and all trees he loves, for which reason he is called Aldaron, and by the Sindar Tauron, the lord of forests. Nahar is the name of his horse, white in the sun and shining silver at night. The Valaróma is the name of his great horn, the sound of which is like the upgoing of the Sun in scarlet, or the sheer lightning cleaving the clouds. Above all the horns of his host it was heard in the woods that Yavanna brought forth in Valinor; for there Oromë would train his folk and his beasts for the pursuit of the evil creatures of Melkor.

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Silmarillion, p.29

And Oromë tamer of beasts would ride too at whiles in the darkness of the unlit forests; as a mighty hunter he came with spear and bow, pursuing to the death the monsters and fell creatures of the kingdom of Melkor, and his white horse Nahar shone like silver in the shadows. Then the sleeping earth trembled at the beat of his golden hooves, and in the twilight of the world Oromë would sound Valaróma his great horn upon the plains of Arda; whereat the mountains echoed, and the shadows of evil fled away, and Melkor himself quailed in Utumno, foreboding the wrath to come.

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Silmarillion, p.41



[Edited to include 3 previously omitted SDAs, changed Nahar and Valinorean Hound type to 'Magical Beast' to reflect celestial template and corrected saving throws, modified spear abilities and toned-down Valaroma effects.]

Ha! Orome looks great!


Ulmo: CG Barbarian 20/ ??

mandos: LN ?? Cleric 20/Divine Oracle 10/Wizard 20?

osse: CN ??

manwe: LG paladin 20/cleric 20

yavanna: NG Druid 20/cleric 20?

aule: expert 20/fighter 20?

... can't remember the others right now

these would be harder than orome (obviously a ranger)

Personally I feel that using the DMG Aristocrat or Expert for a PC is pointless. If you want to have a PC with Aristocratic or Noble leanings then just adapt the SW:Revised Noble to a Medieval version and you are set. The one in the WoT and the 1st edition SW Noble was broken with one of their major class features being usable only once, ... ever! ...

I have already done this for my campaign, ... but I don't think we can post a completed adaption, just how you adapt the SW:Revised Noble to the ME setting. Just a thought.

For the Expert, do the same for the SW:Revised Tech Specialist class.

Just my opinion.

Ps. Sepulchrave II, ... you rock! ...

If you want to have a PC with Aristocratic or Noble leanings then just adapt the SW:Revised Noble to a Medieval version and you are set. The one in the WoT and the 1st edition SW Noble was broken with one of their major class features being usable only once, ... ever! .

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It's my plan to stay within the core rules, and stuff that will eventually be in the SRD - i.e. ELH and DDg. Makes for a better baseline, I'd argue.

Cleric 20/Divine Oracle 10/Wizard 20?

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Nice idea, but see above. It's a shame, because I'm kind of partial to Divine Oracles.

I don't feel it's pointless at all to use the NPC classes. Sometimes it makes sense, especially when you consider the character and look at what the class actually grants. I also have been using the Core rules for my conversions, and the stuff that seems very likely to make it into the SRD. As Sepulchrave said, it gives a better baseline.

ColonelHardisson said:

I don't feel it's pointless at all to use the NPC classes. Sometimes it makes sense, especially when you consider the character and look at what the class actually grants. I also have been using the Core rules for my conversions, and the stuff that seems very likely to make it into the SRD. As Sepulchrave said, it gives a better baseline.

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Ok, point taken. I guess all I mean is that the benefits of Aristocrat and Expert don't come close to the benefits of a PC class, and in my opinion it ultimately handicaps them compared to another character who has the same number of classes, but they are all PC classes.

Like I said though, ... this is just my opinion.

But just for an example, if you give Frodo 1 level of Fighter and two Rogue he can kick butt. Give him 1 level of Aristocrat and 2 levels of Rogue and he has probably 1 less hit point, 1 less BAB, 1 less Feat, less Fort save, but a better Will save. They have more choices for skills, ... but I think it comes at too high a cost. If that was a level of Barbarian, or Ranger, or Paladin they would be getting HUGE benefits. Having even one level of Druid, Bard, Sorcerer or Wizard would be tremendously useful. Think of the first time you saw what a sleep spell can do to a few orcs, or Mage Armour when you ran into trouble. Healing magic, the list goes on.

Now if you give Frodo the Aristocrat level for his 1st level development you handicap him even more. Ok, ... I guess this sounds like munchkinism. But the NPC classes were designed for just that, for NPCs and that's why their CR's are calculated as being lower than a PC.

On the ME Conversion site there are classes from Non-SRD sources because finding a match to the setting Tolkien wrote about is more important (again, in my opinion) than making ME match the game we play.

That said, ... ... oh never mind, I'm just rambling now!

Tell you what, just for argument's sake, I'll post my version of Frodo.

But it will take a little bit, maybe later tonight?

Takeda said:

Ok, point taken. I guess all I mean is that the benefits of Aristocrat and Expert don't come close to the benefits of a PC class, and in my opinion it ultimately handicaps them compared to another character who has the same number of classes, but they are all PC classes.

Like I said though, ... this is just my opinion.

But just for an example, if you give Frodo 1 level of Fighter and two Rogue he can kick butt. Give him 1 level of Aristocrat and 2 levels of Rogue and he has probably 1 less hit point, 1 less BAB, 1 less Feat, less Fort save, but a better Will save. They have more choices for skills, ... but I think it comes at too high a cost. If that was a level of Barbarian, or Ranger, or Paladin they would be getting HUGE benefits. Having even one level of Druid, Bard, Sorcerer or Wizard would be tremendously useful. Think of the first time you saw what a sleep spell can do to a few orcs, or Mage Armour when you ran into trouble. Healing magic, the list goes on.

Now if you give Frodo the Aristocrat level for his 1st level development you handicap him even more. Ok, ... I guess this sounds like munchkinism. But the NPC classes were designed for just that, for NPCs and that's why their CR's are calculated as being lower than a PC.

On the ME Conversion site there are classes from Non-SRD sources because finding a match to the setting Tolkien wrote about is more important (again, in my opinion) than making ME match the game we play.

That said, ... ... oh never mind, I'm just rambling now!

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Where does Frodo kick butt?

I don't see Frodo, for example, using any of those abilities. He's basically just a regular person, or Hobbit. Min/maxing, or, and forgive the term, munchkinizing him or any of the characters doesn't really fit with the books.

The conversion site has material by a number of different people. I, personally, limit myself to Core stuff. The Core rules easily handle ME, because they're the most generic, and thus, the most versatile.

Hi Sepulchrave! I am trully impressed by your work, keep it going!
How do you envision stats of other great Noldor? I personally see Fingolfin as Fighter 20/Paladin20/Ari 5 ( as greatest warrior among Noldor), Feanor as Fighter 20/Ari 5/Expert30( highest level of all sons of Finwe and their descendants), Finrod Felagund Sor 30/Ari 5( might have become more powerful than his sister Galadriel if he had survived as long). Fingon seemed to be almost as mighty in battle as his father, maybe Fighter 20/Paladin15/Ari 5, his brother Turgon seemed to be of great Wisdom, as Ulmo chose him, Fighter 10/Paladin/Cleric 10/Ari 5. Other notable non-Ainur beings of 3rd age would be between 25th-40th level.

I am curious why do you think Sauron dimished in stature with the passing of time? In Valinor he was just of one of the many Maiar there, servant of Aule, propably Divine Rank 3 or 4. Under service of Melkor he grew mighty in the Dark Art of Sorcery, and eventually he became Morgoth`s heir, the second Dark Lord, close to becoming The Supreme Ruler of All Middle Earth, one to whom so many others were due! At a height of his power, with The One Ring on his hand, he could even posess Divine Rank of 6.

Concerning The Istari, I think that they lost they Outsider Hit Dice and Divine Ranks when locked in mortal bodies( Gandalf might have regained some when he became The White). In Valinor, Curumo( Saruman) was propably Divine Rank 4, Olorin(Gandalf)-3, others no higher than 2.

Do you have any house rules for Middle Earth Sepulchrave?

Follow the link in my sig, and you'll find my take on Fingolfin - 40th level fighter. If you're interested. Feanor was the greatest of the Noldor, but I took that to mean in terms of craft ability. Fingolfin was a better warrior. At least, that's how I interpret this:

"Feanor was the mightiest in skill of word and of hand, more learned than his brothers; his spirit burned as a flame. Fingolfin was the strongest, the most steadfast, and the most valiant. Finarfin was the fairest, and the most wise of heart..."

Quenta Silmarillion - The History of the Silmarils, Chapter 5: Of Eldamar

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Sauron, as well as Morgoth, diminished his strength by using portions of it to create things, the most important of which were the Rings.

In Unfinished Tales, in the section on the Istari, it points out that the wizards took the forms of men, including all the physical frailties that entailed. So, they were effectively human in Middle Earth. The only real indication they were more than that was the fact that they wouldn't die of old age.