A new Middle Earth d20 thread

sword-dancer said:

My personal impression and i believe it was somwhere mentioned in the silmarillion ist the following.

Morgoth and Sauron lost "power" because all their craftings and corruptings they bound these things to their will.
They hold it in their greedy and powerhungry claws.
The valar didn`t do that, remember Aule after creating the dwarfes, who didn`t live really, and Aule was ready to destroy without hesitation, as Illvatar/Eru asked him about it, and make complaints.
Eru seen that Aule had no mockery in sense stopped him, and give the Naugrim live.

Morgoth and Sauron didn`t create only copying and corrupt, and so they must maybe overcome the spirit, will, or such from Eru, perhaps this had also a role to play.

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Actually, it is written in Morgoth`s Ring that Sauron during Second Age was more powerful than Morgoth after wasting most of his power.

Melkor said:

Actually, it is written in Morgoth`s Ring that Sauron during Second Age was more powerful than Morgoth after wasting most of his power.

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It's ironic to hear Melkor describing how much more powerful Sauron is than himself.

Sepulchrave II said:

Certainly - I'd be more than happy. I'd ask that you wait on Galadriel (well. Nenya), and the One Ring, though, because I'm still fiddling with them. If you want to add some backstory from Tolkien, that would be even better...

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Alright, will be posting updates to the site in about four hours. Colonel's generic NPCs and Dray Beast; Sepulchrave's Balrog, Eonwe, Orome, Tulkas, Huan, Carcharoth; and hopefully Tim A's trolls. Leaving Galadriel and Finrod for later.

Derek

GruTheWanderer said:

It's ironic to hear Melkor describing how much more powerful Sauron is than himself.

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Foul, you don`t understand anything! Sauron`s power was mine, for he belonged to me! He made The Numenorians worship me, praise me, and give bloody sacrifices to my name! And I was pleased, for I turned greatest of The Edain from the way Iluvatar intended them to follow! For great was his sadness when he had to destroy his children, and undo the glory of Numenor, that the ocean claimed! Behold, for soon the time will come for me to return from The Void, after I will master its Power, and I shall use the might of Eternal Darkness against The Flame Imperishable! And I shall be victorious, and all my faithful servants will be rewarded, and Sauron will be first among them! Do not listen to Valar propaganda and false prophecies of this lunatic Mandos! Join me, join the winning side!

Site Updated

Hi All,

The site has been updated. As mentioned above, plus Turin's Magic Trace information and fixed a few broken links and missing credits. Our first posted Ainur (other the Balrogs). Thanks again, Sepulchrave.

Scoop away!
Derek

I've been following the Middle Earth threads since last fall (my handle at the time was Quantanephilim) and I've found the exchanges very interesting.

However, I noticed the Colonel's reference to only using core books in the Middle Earth conversions, and I thought it might be kind of nice to write up an article on using elements from non-core books (especially the splatbooks, a few of the Realms sourcebooks, and maybe a few of the better third-party documents) in a Middle Earth campaign. Although I can't do that right now (I don't have access to my books from where I'm sitting right now), I'll post my thoughts on it in the next few days. I'd like to hear the thoughts of other readers as well.

Tyler Do'Urden said:

I thought it might be kind of nice to write up an article on using elements from non-core books (especially the splatbooks, a few of the Realms sourcebooks, and maybe a few of the better third-party documents) in a Middle Earth campaign. Although I can't do that right now (I don't have access to my books from where I'm sitting right now), I'll post my thoughts on it in the next few days.

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Hey Tyler,

This sounds great. I think the Colonel and Sepulchrave are limiting their own conversions to the core books, but are not implying that anyone else must follow their example. Quite a bit of the material on the website offers suggestions outside the core: Wheel of Time classes, using the Bear Warrior from Oriental Adventures for Beornings, and of course the VP/WP mechanics from Star Wars. But there's obviously a lot of outside material that hasn't been scratched yet, so have at it.

Derek

Yes, the Core Book limitation is my own personal guideline. Please don't take that as limiting anyone else in what they want to do. The project is intended to to let people present a wide variety of interpretations of Lord of the Rings, thus helping to ensure that anyone who visits the site (or these threads) will find something to their liking. Please feel free to use any and all sources in your conversion - I'd be very interested in seeing it.

As Gru noted, even I have suggested non-Core material in doing a Middle Earth d20 conversion. I simply use the Core when I'm doing character write-ups, magic items, or monsters that are going to be posted on the site, just to make them accessible to anyone. The only exceptions are the Epic Level characters I've done, but I think I did them in such a way that you could probably use them without that book. But I'm thinking about adding a few non-Core things to some of my conversions - for example, I've been thinking about adding in the Defense bonus concept from Wheel of Time and Star Wars to my character write-ups that are posted.

Don't feel limited in doing whatveer you want to do just because I, or anyone else, does things a certain way. I don't know anymore about this stuff than any of you guys. Matter of fact, many of you probably know quite a bit more.

ColonelHardisson said:

Where does Frodo kick butt?

I don't see Frodo, for example, using any of those abilities. He's basically just a regular person, or Hobbit. Min/maxing, or, and forgive the term, munchkinizing him or any of the characters doesn't really fit with the books.

The conversion site has material by a number of different people. I, personally, limit myself to Core stuff. The Core rules easily handle ME, because they're the most generic, and thus, the most versatile.

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Sorry, been busy.

I think you took me too literally, ... I meant that Frodo demonstrates time and time again an incredible resolve and a self-less nature that suggests to me that he has more going for him then just being an Aristrocratic Hobbit. Maybe a Noble, ... but I think Frodo being a 1st level Rogue to start (as much as by Bilbo's example and inspiring stories), and then picking up alternating levels of Paladin and Rogue. I don't see him using Lay on Hands, ... or many of the Core Paladin abilities, ... but we don't see Gandalf use the big guns either, ... and a lot can be said supporting Aragorn being a Paladin, or Ranger, ... Or fighter, or , ... the list goes on.

But, ... I can't see very many peope in Middle Earth being able to carry the One Ring for any length of time without succumbing to it's influence. His having a level of Paladin, as well as Strong Will might help. I know it is just a bit of rationalization, ... but why not? Each and every one of us has a slightly different interpretation of what we read, of what we get out of movie, book, game, etc. It's all really subjective.

I know my saying that a level of Aristocrat being less powerful than the PC classes seems like min/maxing, ... I am just saying that if we encourage people to emulate the ME setting with 3e D&D by taking NPC classes we have to be careful. Take an Uruk-Hai with 3 levels of Fighter, ... compare him to a Human Aristocrat of 2nd level and 1 level of Fighter. ... The Uruk-Hai is going to hand him his head, ... more than likely. The NPC classes are not fully-fleshed was my only point. Flesh them out a little and sure, ... no problem.

The Revised:SW Noble class is more fleshed out, ... and is easily adapted to the ME setting. The site we make mention of in our signatures has articles showing ways of adding/modifying existing classes to better emulate ME classes/monsters/races, etc. Why not classes that are in the D20 system, and readily availabe (WotC sold, and thus widely distributed).

Ok, ... It's late and I think I am losing my point. I'll check back tomorrow, ... err, later today to see if this makes sense, ... or if anyone has there own slant to add?

Takeda

Here's Frodo, ... or at least my version.

Here's my take on Frodo, ... as he is once he and Sam head off on their own. I see Frodo very much as a reluctant hero. He feels that he has no choice but to do what he can. It is this selfless nature that I feel supports my ... 'version'

Frodo Baggins, male Hobbit (lightfoot) Rog2/Pal1: CR 3; Size S (3 ft., 4 in. tall); HD 2d6+4 + 1d10+2; Vitality 24, Wounds 12; Init +3 (+3 Dex); Spd 20 ft.; AC 21 (+7 (+3 Chainshirt), +3 Dex, +1 Size); {DR 6/+4(+3 Chainshirt)}, Attack +3 w/ ”Sting” melee (“Sting”, 1d6+1 dmg, Crit 17-20, Mithril), or +6 (+2 Base, +3 Dex, +1 Size) ranged; SV Fort +8 (+2 Base, +2 Con, +3 Cha, +1 Racial), Special Qualities: Sneak Attack +1d6 dmg, Divine Grace, Lay on hands (3 pts/day), Detect Evil, Divine Health , Ref +11 (+3 Base, +3 Dex, +3 Cha, +1 Racial), Will +9 (+0 Base, +3 Wis, +3 Cha, +1 Racial, +2 Iron Will); AL LG; Str 10 (+0), Dex 17 (+3), Con 14 (+2), Int 12 (+1), Wis 16 (+3), Cha 17 (+3).

Languages Spoken: Westron.

Skills and Feats: Balance 3 ranks (Dex)=+6, Climb 4 ranks (+2)*(Str)=+6, Decipher Script 1 rank (Int)=+2, Diplomacy 2 ranks (Cha)=+5, Disable Device (Int), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Forgery (Int), Gather Information 1 rank (Cha)=+4, Handle Animal 1 ranks (Cha)=+4, Heal (Wis), Hide 5 ranks (+4)*(Dex)=+12, Innuendo (Wis), Intimidate (Cha), Intuit Direction 1 ranks (Wis)=+4, Jump 3 ranks (+2)*(Str)=+5, Knowledge-Local History 2 ranks (cc)(Int)=+2, Listen 3 ranks (+2)*(Wis)=+8, Move Silently 5 ranks (+2)*(Dex)=+10, Open Lock (Dex), Perform 1 rank (Dancing) (Cha)=+4, Pick Pocket (Dex), Profession (Wis), Read Lips (Int), Ride (Dex), Scry (Int), Search 3 ranks (Int)=+4, Sense Motive 1 ranks (Wis)=+4, Spellcraft (Int), Spot 5 ranks (Wis)=+8, Swim (Str), Tumble 3 ranks (Dex)=+6, Use Magical Device 1 rank (Cha)=+4, Use Rope 1 rank (Dex)=+4, Wilderness Lore 2 ranks (cc)(Wis)=+4, Iron Will, Dodge.
* Racial Bonuses.

Possessions: +3 Mithril Dwarven Heavy Fortification Chainshirt (it is supposed to be worth a small fortune!), “Sting” +1 Mithril Elven Keen Shortsword (detects Orcs and Goblins within 50’ by emitting a blue glow, the brighter the glow, the closer the Orc or Goblin), the “One Ring” (which I feel gives Ethereal Jaunt and Ghost Touch to wearer at all times, among a long list of other things!).

Paladin Spells Per Day: None until 4th level.

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