When a Spellcaster Dies and Shared Spells

What happens to a spellcaster's personal spells when he/she dies? I'm assuming the caster becomes a corpse and a corpse is an object not a person so spells that affect creatures no longer function. Is that correct? The catch may be that the target of the spell was a creature when it was cast...

But more importantly, what happens to a spell that was shared (i.e., with an animal companion) when the caster dies? Does the spell expire on the caster, on the animal companion, or both?

We had a situation where the druid caster died but his animal companion was still within 5 feet of the druid's corpse. Should the shared spells affecting the animal companion have ended with the death of the caster?

I think by RAW it stays if the animal companion remains within 5 feet of the corpse. I see no reason to make a different ruling--the player already had to deal with the bummer of dying, they might as well get to keep whatever spell was up on the animal so they can contribute to the rest of the fight and have a reason to pay attention and stay involved.

Rystil Arden said:

I think by RAW it stays if the animal companion remains within 5 feet of the corpse.

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There's a metaphysical question in there of whether the dead body is still Vadania, or merely the shell Vadania used to inhabit

-Hyp.

If you brought the dead person back to life, would you expect the spells to still be on that person?

To me the answer is yes. And so the spells are still shared.

Ogrork the Mighty said:

I'm assuming the caster becomes a corpse and a corpse is an object not a person so spells that affect creatures no longer function. Is that correct?

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From the 3.5 FAQ (if desired):
"A spell only checks to see if you are a legal target
when it is cast. If you become an illegal target later (such as via
the polymorph spell), the spell remains in effect."

If the shared spell remains only under the condition that the companion remains a certain distance from the caster, and the caster no longer exists (dies, becomes an object), then does the condition become unfulfilled? It can be interpreted to mean a living caster.

Another way to look at it is that the caster is the one sharing out to the companion (think direction) - if the caster is no longer there to share out, how does the spell continue? Due to the distance limitation, I understand shared spells to work as an influence of the caster upon the companion, rather than as another instance of the spell. Which raises another, possibly related question - if a shared spell is dispelled on the caster, does it also drop from the companion? The way I look at it, it does.

foxwick said:

If the shared spell remains only under the condition that the companion remains a certain distance from the caster, and the caster no longer exists (dies, becomes an object), then does the condition become unfulfilled? It can be interpreted to mean a living caster.

Another way to look at it is that the caster is the one sharing out to the companion (think direction) - if the caster is no longer there to share out, how does the spell continue? Due to the distance limitation, I understand shared spells to work as an influence of the caster upon the companion, rather than as another instance of the spell. Which raises another, possibly related question - if a shared spell is dispelled on the caster, does it also drop from the companion? The way I look at it, it does.

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It's not actually dispelled on the caster on death, though, or becoming an object, since it checks for validity only at casting. What if a caster under the effect of Enlarge Person was targeted with Flesh to Stone. Wouldn't they become a Large size statue at first? For Hyp's best example on the subject, Shillelagh only works on a normal nonmagical club or quarterstaff, but it makes it magical. If you checked for legal target at any time after the casting, it would immediately become invalid and Shillelagh would fail.

Rystil Arden said:

It's not actually dispelled on the caster on death, though, or becoming an object, since it checks for validity only at casting.

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My issue is not that the spell should expire.

My issue is whether the object on which the spell is still operating - the corpse - is still 'you'.

To illustrate my point better, let's say a wizard casts Shield, Shared with his familiar, and then Magic Jars into another body.

Which body has the Shield spell - the wizard's original, currently vacant, body? Or the one the wizard inhabits? And which body does the familiar need to stay within 5 feet of? Are the answers to the two questions necessarily the same?

Does either answer change if the spell was Polymorph instead of Shield? What if the spell was Owl's Wisdom?

-Hyp.

Hypersmurf said:

My issue is not that the spell should expire.

My issue is whether the object on which the spell is still operating - the corpse - is still 'you'.

To illustrate my point better, let's say a wizard casts Shield, Shared with his familiar, and then Magic Jars into another body.

Which body has the Shield spell - the wizard's original, currently vacant, body? Or the one the wizard inhabits? And which body does the familiar need to stay within 5 feet of? Are the answers to the two questions necessarily the same?

Does either answer change if the spell was Polymorph instead of Shield? What if the spell was Owl's Wisdom?

-Hyp.

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I know--I was replying to foxwick with that though, not you

I would say that Shield (or Bull's Strength or Polymorph or physical spells) would be on the old body. And if you don't let the familiar keep the dweomer by staying near the old body, then there should be no way to keep it. My metaphysical answer is that the familiar gets the spell because it is able to tap into the magic with the particular metaphysical signature of its master as long as it stays very very close to the dweomer to keep the link.

Owl's Wisdom is mental and by the terms of Magic Jar would probably leap. The Familiar would then likely have to switch to the new body, so I hope the two were close. And before you ask, yes, I'll draw the distinction between the Magic Jar and dying because the text of the Magic Jar spell specifically calls out the transfer of mental abilities. Magic Jar is a bit odd in total because it should probably have a Target of: Personal and then One Creature, see text rather than just 'One Creature', since you can actually still use it to jump in the gem for a few hours without any valid 'One Creature' targets around.

But let's say you die and you're True Resurrected or Revivified while the duration is still running--you keep your spell effects, right? That's why I'd rule that the spell is still running the whole time and thus the familiar can still leech off the dweomer if it stays in 5 feet.

Simpler answer--the target for Raise Dead is 'Dead creature touched'. Is that not 'You'? If not, who comes back when Raise Dead is cast? It says in the spells description that it provides the dead creature the benefit of restoring its life. If the game doesn't know it is you, then it won't be able to make it be you when your life is restored either.

As I said in the first post (though I was a bit obscure), I could definitely see it easy to make the other ruling through an obscure argument on semantics of being dead, but since my way is not invalidated, I would use it to not screw over the dead player any more than necessary.

Rystil Arden said:

But let's say you die and you're True Resurrected or Revivified while the duration is still running--you keep your spell effects, right?

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Sure. But while you were dead, was it 'you' benefiting from them, or just the object you used to inhabit?

While you were Magic Jarred, the Bull's Strength spell was still operating... but was it operating on 'you', or just on the body it was cast on? When you return, you 'keep the spell effect', but that doesn't mean you had it the whole time. The spell never stopped operating, but was it always 'you' it was operating on?

Similarly, when you die, the spell keeps operating on your corpse... does that mean it's operating on 'you'? And while your body is dead, are 'you' within 5 feet of the familiar standing next to it?

Simpler answer--the target for Raise Dead is 'Dead creature touched'.

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Yup. Is a dead creature a creature? (Not necessarily a redundant question. Compare: Is a natural armor bonus an armor bonus? Is an incorporeal touch attack a touch attack? Is a monstrous humanoid a humanoid?) After all, a corpse is an object, and an object is 'not a creature'. So if 'you' are a creature, can you be a dead creature if a dead creature is not a creature?

-Hyp.