What's the best fighter/mage class/Prc?

Starbuck_II · Apr 15, 2008

Anyone mention Swift Blade?
I know it has that 1 level of just casting Haste as 3rd level slots prequisite, but is a really good Prc.
Full BAB, 6/10 casting though (kinda bad but if focusing on melee notjust casting can be okay).
Level 2: 20 % concealment (like Blur) increases up to level 5 by +10% till reach 5th level when it is 50%.(Level 3: 30%; 4: 40%; 5: 50%)
Level 3: You can cast Haste as free action/round (similar to Quicken).
6th levels: One can't dispel your haste . It is extraodinary now, still dutation runs out.

It is a nice class up to 6th at least: benefits are less spectacular after that.
Oh, Level 9, Haste acts like 3.0 version, you get extra standard action along with 3.5 benefits.
Cap Stone ability: Level 10, if you prepare/spontanously use haste cast with 6th level slot: you get mini-time stop for 1 round. Each slot higher than 6th, raises duration by 1 round.
Example, if I take a 8th level slot use for Haste, I cast it and get 3 rounds of Time stop. Better than Time Stops average duration.

Lurks-no-More · Apr 16, 2008

Klaus said:
Mind you, it's *caster* level. So your Wiz 1/Ftr 5/AC 5 has the spell capability of a Wiz 6 (casting spells up to 3rd level), but with a caster level of 10 (so he drops a fireball that deals 10d6).

That's not bad, either.

I'm always going back and forth whether Abjurant Champion is a broken PrC or not...

Nifft · Apr 16, 2008

Starbuck_II said:
Example, if I take a 8th level slot use for Haste, I cast it and get 3 rounds of Time stop. Better than Time Stops average duration.

Nitpick: time stop has a duration of 1d4+1 rounds.

E[ d4 ] = 2.5
2.5 + 1 = 3.5
3 < 3.5

Cheers, -- N

Graf · Apr 16, 2008

I actually really like the swiftblade prerequisit. It's much more interesting from a story angle than "take combat concentration".

I'd second Knight Phantom but mostly from a flavor angle.

moritheil · Apr 22, 2008

Starbuck_II said:
Anyone mention Swift Blade?
I know it has that 1 level of just casting Haste as 3rd level slots prequisite, but is a really good Prc.
Full BAB, 6/10 casting though (kinda bad but if focusing on melee notjust casting can be okay).
Level 2: 20 % concealment (like Blur) increases up to level 5 by +10% till reach 5th level when it is 50%.(Level 3: 30%; 4: 40%; 5: 50%)
Level 3: You can cast Haste as free action/round (similar to Quicken).
6th levels: One can't dispel your haste . It is extraodinary now, still dutation runs out.

It is a nice class up to 6th at least: benefits are less spectacular after that.
Oh, Level 9, Haste acts like 3.0 version, you get extra standard action along with 3.5 benefits.
Cap Stone ability: Level 10, if you prepare/spontanously use haste cast with 6th level slot: you get mini-time stop for 1 round. Each slot higher than 6th, raises duration by 1 round.
Example, if I take a 8th level slot use for Haste, I cast it and get 3 rounds of Time stop. Better than Time Stops average duration.

It was widely panned because it doesn't get higher level spells. For people who demand instant access to epic magic at 21, this is a big deal. Also, the concern was that it basically limits a character's options without making him or her substantially better; several people claimed that it would be possible to do everything just as well with an uninterrupted casting class like Loremaster, using the higher level spell slots to mimic the benefits of Swiftblade, and still have spell slots left over.

I personally thought a dip looked OK but many people who spent time with it insisted it wasn't worth it. I never did the cost-benefit analysis myself.

SSquirrel · Apr 23, 2008

Arkhandus said:
I like Monte Cook's "Mage Blade" core class from Arcana Unearthed/Arcana Evolved.

The only gripes I have about it are minor; 1, it's Charisma-based despite being described as a trained spellcaster and warrior, not just a natural-born sorcerer-type; 2, its skill points and class skills kinda suck, which compounds the annoying focus on Charisma instead of Intelligence.

bard-like spellcasting progression (but up to 7th-level spells at the end),

If you notice, AU/AE only has 2 spell progressions, which I've seen referred to as full caster and half caster. A damn sight better than 4 levels of spells like Paladins and Rangers get

The focus on Charisma could easily be swapped to Int w/o any major deal I think.

I'm a big AE fan so I was going to recommend this one too

Olgar Shiverstone · Apr 23, 2008

Lurks-no-More said:
That's not bad, either.

I'm always going back and forth whether Abjurant Champion is a broken PrC or not...

Except that the best you can do is drop 3rd level spells while your wizard counterpart is dropping 6th level ones.

Never underestimate the impact of being behind on spell levels.

Besides, the Practiced Spellcaster feat can recover up to 4 caster levels for you, which is almost as good as the 5th level AC ability.

moritheil · Apr 23, 2008

Olgar Shiverstone said:
Except that the best you can do is drop 3rd level spells while your wizard counterpart is dropping 6th level ones.

Never underestimate the impact of being behind on spell levels.

I don't follow that at all. Even if you don't take it as an elf or some other race with automatic MWP (which involves no loss in spellcasting whatsoever) you only need to dip 1 level and it is a full casting progression PrC. You would therefore most likely be casting 5th level spells while the wizard is casting 6th level spells, and that is not "at best" in terms of spellcasting - best is equal advancement with the wizard.

Besides, the Practiced Spellcaster feat can recover up to 4 caster levels for you, which is almost as good as the 5th level AC ability.

Yes, in some situations the benefit is comparable, but those situations are not where AbChamp shines.

Arkhandus · Apr 24, 2008

SSquirrel said:
If you notice, AU/AE only has 2 spell progressions, which I've seen referred to as full caster and half caster. A damn sight better than 4 levels of spells like Paladins and Rangers get The focus on Charisma could easily be swapped to Int w/o any major deal I think.

I'm a big AE fan so I was going to recommend this one too

Just for reference, I wasn't complaining about the spell progression, though. Just mentioning what kind of progression it has. And yeah, it's a good class, I just hate the Charisma focus. -_-

*eye-twitch* It's like a token Charisma-based caster thrown in just because the others in AU/AE rely on Intelligence or Wisdom. Even though the Mage Blade should, by description and all, also be Intelligence-based. Couldn't Greenbonds or Witches be Charisma-based instead, if Monte wanted to have at least one Charisma-based caster in AU/AE? *sigh*

moritheil · May 2, 2008

Oh, I seem to have forgotten to mention the Nar Demonbinder. This allows martial casting classes like Bard, Duskblade, or Hexblade to get 8th level spells with proper multiclassing. It's not perfect, but having 8th level spells at 20 is better than ending at 4th, 5th, or 6th level spells.

What's the best fighter/mage class/Prc?

Starbuck_II

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Lurks-no-More

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Nifft

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Graf

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moritheil

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SSquirrel

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Olgar Shiverstone

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Arkhandus

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moritheil

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