Druid iterative attacks combined with natural attacks

Wednesday Boy · Apr 28, 2008

This or something like this has most likely been discussed a bunch before but I can't find it when searching, so here goes...

I'm playing a Druid using the PHII Shapeshifting variant rules. I have a BAB of +6/+1 and one of the forms I can Shapeshift into allows you to gain one primary natural attack (bite) and two secondary natural attacks (claw). So how do my iterative attacks granted by BAB interact with the natural attacks of the forms? Would the second BAB iterative attack :
1) use the bite, so I would have two bite attacks (at different attack bonuses) and two claw attacks or
2) would it be considered a secondary attack and use the claw, so I would have one bite attack and three claw attacks?

I thought it would be the former but I couldn't find any guidelines. Thanks for the help!

jaelis · Apr 28, 2008

You can't use weapons while shifted, so all you get is the stated natural attacks, regardless of BAB.

Darklone · Apr 28, 2008

There are some Dragon feats that allow you to apply iterative attacks to natural weapons.

Wednesday Boy · Apr 28, 2008

jaelis said:
You can't use weapons while shifted, so all you get is the stated natural attacks, regardless of BAB.

Ah, gotcha. That's much simpler. And for all of my natural attacks I use my highest BAB, true?

jaelis · Apr 28, 2008

They all state whether they are primary or secondary. Primaries are a full BAB while secondaries are at BAB-5. (Unless you have Multiattack, which I believe you eventually get in at least some forms. Then they are at BAB-2.)

Einan · Apr 28, 2008

There's a question about this in the FAQ or the Errata and it basically says, no iterative attacks when shapeshifted. So use your highest BAB and go for broke.

Folly · Apr 28, 2008

There is no way to gain iteratives with your natural attack routine, but you can do iteratives with a natural weapon. This means that you can either bite, claw(-5), claw(-5) or you can bite, bite(-5) or claw, claw(-5). This is why normally druids use the natural attack routine instead.

It is possible to combine manufactured attacks and natural attacks, but it is tricky. The most common reason for this is a druid/monk. In this case you can make all of your natural attacks as secondarys. So if in your example, the druid had a monk level the attack routine while would be monk, bite(-5), claw(-5), claw(-5).

Wednesday Boy · Apr 28, 2008

Awesome! Thanks all!!

jaelis · Apr 28, 2008

Folly said:
There is no way to gain iteratives with your natural attack routine, but you can do iteratives with a natural weapon. This means that you can either bite, claw(-5), claw(-5) or you can bite, bite(-5). This is way normally druids use the natural attack routine instead.

I don't think that is right, unless you have some special ability to obtain an iterative attack.

Natural Weapons said:
Creatures do not receive additional attacks from a high base attack bonus when using natural weapons.

Wednesday Boy · Apr 28, 2008

Folly said:
There is no way to gain iteratives with your natural attack routine, but you can do iteratives with a natural weapon. This means that you can either bite, claw(-5), claw(-5) or you can bite, bite(-5). This is way normally druids use the natural attack routine instead.

So if I was in a form that just gets one primary attack, I could still get two attacks because my BAB is +6/+1?