TSR Q&A with Gary Gygax

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This is the multi-year Q&A sessions held by D&D co-creator Gary Gygax here at EN World, beginning in 2002 and running up until his sad pasing in 2008. Gary's username in the thread below is Col_Pladoh, and his first post in this long thread is Post #39.

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Col_Pladoh

Gary Gygax
dead said:
Dear Gary,

Please help me find inner peace.

I love 1st Edition AD&D to death, but there were two rules in the game that annoyed the hell out of me and, as a result, I did not abide by them. Here are the rules:

1) Level limits for demihumans

2) Restrictions on picking up multiple classes (or stopping your progression in a class/classes). In other words, if you started an elf fighter/wizard from 1st level, then you were stuck with an elf fighter/wizard forever! You weren't "officially" allowed to add another class, or discontinue, say, your fighter class and pursue wizardry only. [Not to mention the fact that humans could not pick up multiple classes (except they could dual-class if they had extraordinary attributes; but only once in their life).]
I don't regret that in the least. If demi-humans, already given some advantages, were as able as humans, the world would be dominated by them, and there goes the whole of having a relatively familiar world setting in regards to what cultures and societies one will find in control. So a demi-human is unlimited in thief level only, as that is a class not destined to control the fate of major groups or states.

As for limiting human PCs to one class or possibly a dual class, the game is supposed to be about heroic people, not comic book super heroes.


I want to return to the good ol'days very soon and run a retrospective 1E AD&D campaign but I want to stay as *true* to the original rules as possible. Now, I know your decision to have the two rules above was for "game balance", but I'd like to hear from you how I could possibly describe the restrictions "in game".

If you create a setting with a complete demihuman culture and varied societies, complete with a long history for that dominant race, then have them take the place of humans and restrict humand as if they were a demi-human race. The only unlimited race should be theone that is dominant on the planet.

Using the elf fighter/wizard as an example: If the player is a 4th-level fighter/4th-level wizard, but (in game) his character wants to join the clergy of an elven god and become a cleric, I can't just say: "No, the rules don't allow you to do that." I have to give an "in game" explanation.

How many people do you know that are able to excell in more than one field? what some bozo wants to do so as to have a dominant PC isn't a matter for consideration in regards a campaign. Saying "why not" is a lame excuse. In a world where magic works, many-ton beasts can fly, things breath fire, it makes as much sense for a player to demand that his PC can ivent a spell that always slays his target subject, ot armor that is impervious to any and all forms of attack.

As to the level restrictions on demihumans, you might say: "Demihumans just lose all drive for adventure after they've had but the merest taste of it". This doesn't rub well with me, though, because they don't get very far before they're restricted. Top levels are, perhaps, 10th. To get to 10th level doesn't take very long. It is just a drop in the river of time.
So? Maybe the whiny player should take his wannabe PC off to a game world where everyone is a superhero of unpteenth level with barns full of magic.

Alternatively, Gary, you could tell me that roleplaying games were in their early conception back then and your decision to put these arbitrary restrictions in place to serve game balance (but not resolving in-game believability) was a mistake.

Either response should put me on the road to finding inner peace.

Thankyou.

Bah! It is a mistake to bow to the wished of munchkins who whine. If they know the restrictions on dfemi-human characters before they create one, then they haven't a leg to stand on.

Why are humans more able to rise in level than demi-humans? Because the gods say so, and don't like pointy eared types with curly-toed shoes, squat miners with big beards, hairy-footed midgets, etc.

Cheers,
Gary
 

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dead

Explorer
Col_Pladoh said:
Bah! It is a mistake to bow to the wished of munchkins who whine. If they know the restrictions on dfemi-human characters before they create one, then they haven't a leg to stand on.

The player is not a munchkin. They like the story idea of a diverse character. They're not thinking about how much stuff they can slaughter at and loot to steal at all.

I'm somewhat at peace now.

I'm glad to see your stance on this but I'm gonna stick to my house rules (which don't create over-powerful, comic-book characters, by the way). ;)

Thanks.
 


tenkar

Old School Blogger
Gary, you're making me want to dig thru my closet to find my 1st Ed AD&D books. Back in the day my players generally weren't looking to multi-class unless the group was small and they needed the flexiblity.

Ah well, it all went down hill with the 2nd edition anyway ;)

Erik

"Why are humans more able to rise in level than demi-humans? Because the gods say so, and don't like pointy eared types with curly-toed shoes, squat miners with big beards, hairy-footed midgets, etc." EGG
 


Col_Pladoh

Gary Gygax
Joseph Elric Smith said:
Right answers all the way gary
Ken

Thanks Ken!

Your kind and unsolicited support is appreciated:D

BTW, give me your snailmail addy again, so I can sent the check as promised.

Heh,
Gary
 

Col_Pladoh

Gary Gygax
dead said:
The player is not a munchkin. They like the story idea of a diverse character. They're not thinking about how much stuff they can slaughter at and loot to steal at all.
Okay, you know better than I do. I am left wqith the nagging question: If the players aren't concerned about power gaming, wish only to create "stories," why should they worry/express concern about level limits

I'm somewhat at peace now.
Then I did a somewhat satisfactory job in responding.

I'm glad to see your stance on this but I'm gonna stick to my house rules (which don't create over-powerful, comic-book characters, by the way). ;)

Thanks.
It is your campaign, and you best what the participants expect and enjoy.

Novertheless, what I said about level limits for demi-human PCs is logical in the fantasy cosmos the AD&D game subsumes. without such limits, using actual human history, myth, and legend becomes problematical.

Cheerio,
Gary
 


Col_Pladoh

Gary Gygax
tenkar said:
Gary, you're making me want to dig thru my closet to find my 1st Ed AD&D books. Back in the day my players generally weren't looking to multi-class unless the group was small and they needed the flexiblity.
That is a good point indeed! When only two or three players generally adventure it is typically necessary for them to play multiple PCs or else be multi-classed.

Ah well, it all went down hill with the 2nd edition anyway ;)
Now there's an observation with which I have no disagreement :uhoh:

Cheerio,
Gary
 

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